Another timing belt question

My local repair shop is great. They've always done a good job on my
several cars over the past ten years. Now I have to replace the
timing belt (and the water pump) on my '97 Miata. Is there anything
about the job on a Miata that would make it a better idea to have it
done by a specialist? My guys are great with Hondas and such but I
don't think they deal with very many Miatas.

Thanks for any input.

Dave

Dave Smith wrote:
> My local repair shop is great. They've always done a good job on my
> several cars over the past ten years. Now I have to replace the
> timing belt (and the water pump) on my '97 Miata. Is there anything
> about the job on a Miata that would make it a better idea to have it
> done by a specialist? My guys are great with Hondas and such but I
> don't think they deal with very many Miatas.
>
> Thanks for any input.
>
> Dave

With your shop being competent, they shouldn't have any problems. It's
something that a lot of "semi-mechanics" take on successfully, and the
setup is fairly similar to the timing belt/water pump arrangements
on many other engines.
Since they are a good shop, they shouldn't have any problems with the
tensioners, seals, etc.
I am always more afraid of a dishonest job than a poorly done job on
cars. Since you have 10 good years with this repair shop, I'd say go
with them.

Pat

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Is there anything
> about the job on a Miata that would make it a better idea to have it
> done by a specialist?

Nah, it's straightword, easy in fact. The miata.net Garage has an
illustrated article for novices:
http://www.miata.net/garage/timingbelt.html

--
Lanny Chambers
'94C, St. Louis
http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html

I forgot to mention one other little detail. A dowel rod or something
similar is sometimes useful. You can pull the #1 plug, and check the
position of the piston against the crankshaft timing marks. This establishes
beyond doubt which marks to use, and can be helpful when it looks like there
might be a off one tooth situation with the timing belt. It's also useful
to remember that you can slit the old timing belt lengthwise, cut 1/2 off,
and use the other half to maintain cam position while you start the new belt
on.

"Chuck" > wrote in message
news:4qDZf.5811$IZ2.492@dukeread07...
> Two areas of concern are getting the new camshaft seals in place properly,
> and the crankshaft bolt torqued properly.
> The rest is fairly simple if involved, due to the number of things in the
> way.
>
> "Lanny Chambers" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >,
> > Dave Smith > wrote:
> >
> > > Is there anything
> > > about the job on a Miata that would make it a better idea to have it
> > > done by a specialist?
> >
> > Nah, it's straightword, easy in fact. The miata.net Garage has an
> > illustrated article for novices:
> > http://www.miata.net/garage/timingbelt.html
> >
> > --
> > Lanny Chambers
> > '94C, St. Louis
> > http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html
>
>

Chuck mentions what I think could be the easiest way to make sure to get the
belt right however, I'm thinking that if you're doing the cam / crank seals,
it renders this idea useless as the belt / belts are always in the way of
putting the seals in place right? Are the seal replacements really necessary
if you're in the 60k range? I know if skipped, they would be STRONGLY
recommended in the second go-round at 120k or so. As would be the waterpump
and some people would say .......... the starter motor (just kidding ;-).

Chris
99BBB

"Chuck" > wrote in message
news:5EDZf.5815$IZ2.327@dukeread07...
>I forgot to mention one other little detail. A dowel rod or something
> similar is sometimes useful. You can pull the #1 plug, and check the
> position of the piston against the crankshaft timing marks. This
> establishes
> beyond doubt which marks to use, and can be helpful when it looks like
> there
> might be a off one tooth situation with the timing belt. It's also useful
> to remember that you can slit the old timing belt lengthwise, cut 1/2 off,
> and use the other half to maintain cam position while you start the new
> belt
> on.
>
> "Chuck" > wrote in message
> news:4qDZf.5811$IZ2.492@dukeread07...
>> Two areas of concern are getting the new camshaft seals in place
>> properly,
>> and the crankshaft bolt torqued properly.
>> The rest is fairly simple if involved, due to the number of things in the
>> way.
>>
>> "Lanny Chambers" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > In article >,
>> > Dave Smith > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Is there anything
>> > > about the job on a Miata that would make it a better idea to have it
>> > > done by a specialist?
>> >
>> > Nah, it's straightword, easy in fact. The miata.net Garage has an
>> > illustrated article for novices:
>> > http://www.miata.net/garage/timingbelt.html
>> >
>> > --
>> > Lanny Chambers
>> > '94C, St. Louis
>> > http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html
>>
>>
>
>

On Fri, 7 Apr 2006 20:40:35 -0400, "Chuck" >
wrote:

>I forgot to mention one other little detail. A dowel rod or something
>similar is sometimes useful. You can pull the #1 plug, and check the
>position of the piston against the crankshaft timing marks. This establishes
>beyond doubt which marks to use, and can be helpful when it looks like there
>might be a off one tooth situation with the timing belt. It's also useful
>to remember that you can slit the old timing belt lengthwise, cut 1/2 off,
>and use the other half to maintain cam position while you start the new belt
>on.
I don't see why this should be necessary. At least on my '99 the crank
marks are large and distinct. You would really have to try to miss it.

The *camshaft* marks OTOH are difficult to line up, but a dowel won't
help with that. The trick is to make sure that the letters on the cam
gears and the engine match. If the tension is set correctly there are
two lines on the gears that should be pointing STRAIGHT up, with 19
teeth inclusive between them.

The dowel is useful when:
You have poor lighting. You don't know exactly where the #1 pistion is
because you cannot see. Or the crankshaft pully, balancer, etc is not on the
crank, and you are moving the crank by moving the car. Or, you are trying to
find TDC, and insure that a short nose crank pully is actually correctly
positioned. You are an old codger, and wear reading glasses.
You only really appreciate one when you don't have it, and wish you did.

"Natman" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 7 Apr 2006 20:40:35 -0400, "Chuck" >
> wrote:
>
> >I forgot to mention one other little detail. A dowel rod or something
> >similar is sometimes useful. You can pull the #1 plug, and check the
> >position of the piston against the crankshaft timing marks. This
establishes
> >beyond doubt which marks to use, and can be helpful when it looks like
there
> >might be a off one tooth situation with the timing belt. It's also
useful
> >to remember that you can slit the old timing belt lengthwise, cut 1/2
off,
> >and use the other half to maintain cam position while you start the new
belt
> >on.
> I don't see why this should be necessary. At least on my '99 the crank
> marks are large and distinct. You would really have to try to miss it.
>
> The *camshaft* marks OTOH are difficult to line up, but a dowel won't
> help with that. The trick is to make sure that the letters on the cam
> gears and the engine match. If the tension is set correctly there are
> two lines on the gears that should be pointing STRAIGHT up, with 19
> teeth inclusive between them.

I use the "chicken" method and it always has worked for me. This involves
getting everything lined up and making my own marks with a sharpie at the
top of the cam wheels and someplace convenient on the crank pulley.
Carefully transfer the marks from the belt you remove to the new belt and
simply line them up with the marks on the engine. I also use the sharpie to
write the date and mileage of the belt change on the belt surface.

Ken


"Chuck" > wrote in message
news:TCZZf.5895$IZ2.1353@dukeread07...
> The dowel is useful when:
> You have poor lighting. You don't know exactly where the #1 pistion is
> because you cannot see. Or the crankshaft pully, balancer, etc is not on
the
> crank, and you are moving the crank by moving the car. Or, you are trying
to
> find TDC, and insure that a short nose crank pully is actually correctly
> positioned. You are an old codger, and wear reading glasses.
> You only really appreciate one when you don't have it, and wish you did.
>
> "Natman" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Fri, 7 Apr 2006 20:40:35 -0400, "Chuck" >
> > wrote:
> >
> > >I forgot to mention one other little detail. A dowel rod or something
> > >similar is sometimes useful. You can pull the #1 plug, and check the
> > >position of the piston against the crankshaft timing marks. This
> establishes
> > >beyond doubt which marks to use, and can be helpful when it looks like
> there
> > >might be a off one tooth situation with the timing belt. It's also
> useful
> > >to remember that you can slit the old timing belt lengthwise, cut 1/2
> off,
> > >and use the other half to maintain cam position while you start the new
> belt
> > >on.
> > I don't see why this should be necessary. At least on my '99 the crank
> > marks are large and distinct. You would really have to try to miss it.
> >
> > The *camshaft* marks OTOH are difficult to line up, but a dowel won't
> > help with that. The trick is to make sure that the letters on the cam
> > gears and the engine match. If the tension is set correctly there are
> > two lines on the gears that should be pointing STRAIGHT up, with 19
> > teeth inclusive between them.
>
>

On Sat, 8 Apr 2006 21:41:09 -0400, "Chuck" >
wrote:

>The dowel is useful when:
>You have poor lighting. You don't know exactly where the #1 pistion is
>because you cannot see. Or the crankshaft pully, balancer, etc is not on the
>crank, and you are moving the crank by moving the car. Or, you are trying to
>find TDC, and insure that a short nose crank pully is actually correctly
>positioned. You are an old codger, and wear reading glasses.
>You only really appreciate one when you don't have it, and wish you did.

OK, I'll grant you that a dowel would come in handy if you are
replacing your timing belt in the dark. ;>)

This man is brilliant!

"KWS" > wrote in message
...
> I use the "chicken" method and it always has worked for me. This involves
> getting everything lined up and making my own marks with a sharpie at the
> top of the cam wheels and someplace convenient on the crank pulley.
> Carefully transfer the marks from the belt you remove to the new belt and
> simply line them up with the marks on the engine. I also use the sharpie to
> write the date and mileage of the belt change on the belt surface.
>
> Ken