Highway deaths drop to record low

On 2008-08-16, Zigler > wrote:
> On Aug 16, 2:50*pm, Brent P >
> wrote:
>> On 2008-08-16, Zigler > wrote:
>>
>> > For example, if YOUR speeding causes ME an accident, then you damn
>> > well better hope it's a LOT more than a fender-bender, because I would
>> > crawl out of my car (if I could) and beat the absolute living **** out
>> > of you within a millimeter of your life... (then I would have to
>> > contend with the consequences of MY actions, including 1st degree
>> > assault, making me almost as big of an idiot... but hey, nobody's
>> > perfect...).
>>
>> What you mean is that when you decided to do something stupid and slow
>> that violated someone else's right of way you'd blame that driver for
>> 'going too fast'.

> Nope. You got the wrong dude. I don't drive like an idiot, nor do I
> speed excessively, nor do I drive slowly, nor do I gun it from a stop,
> nor do I creep out of a stop. I just drive like a normal, sensible,
> sane human being. That's a problem for some people.

Given your tone, I would say you're a slothy driver. Normal, sensible,
sane human beings don't have that sort of anger for people who drive
faster than they do.

>> > Better yet, just drive the ****ing speed limit, huh? Or at least
>> > within 5 MPH (minor roads) or 10 MPH (highway). It's a wonder how many
>> > dumb speeding ****s end up at the next stoplight right next to me...
>> > as if you really have anywhere to go that is that important... or more
>> > important than the rest of us... as if your time is really worth so
>> > much compared to anyone else's... as if chronic speeding assholes do
>> > any more than put others at risk, add stress to our commute, and
>> > CONTRIBUTE TO TRAFFIC CONGESTION by disrupting the natural, steady,
>> > smooth flow of traffic (think funnel).

>> Let me tell you what causes congestion. People like yourself who refuse
>> to accelerate or move at proper speeds. If I am not stuck behind a

> OOoop. Not only a WRONG assumption about me, but you forgot to include
> assholes who SPEED and created a traffic system with too many
> different rates of speed. Thing about it, for ****sakes. It's common
> sense. A funnel can only pass so much volume of sand per unit of time;
> slowing the sand down will cause "clumping and clogging", while
> forcing more volume than the dimensions of the funnel can handle will
> back it up more and more. That's part of the whole point behind the
> ramp meters we all love to hate.

The clumping is caused by idiots driving slowly side by side. Thanks for
playing.

>> slothy driver in the morning my commute is 25% shorter and I get several
>> green signals in a row and drive on an empty road. When I get stuck
>> behind some slow to accelerate driver I get several red signals in a row
>> and am stuck in traffic. Timing is everything.

> Exactly. And timing, by necessity, by nature, imposes certain
> reasonable limits.

Your sloth drivers do not drive for such efficency. The lights are
magical to them and they don't even understand how they work. I often
need to encourage drivers to pull on to the sensors when I'm biking
because they don't understand how the lights function.

>> What is even worse is the same sort of people who are slow drivers when
>> I am driving are the same people who'd run me off the road when I am
>> biking so they can wait at a stop at a red signal longer.
>>
>> Stress? You know what creates stress on the road? Idiots who block and
>> have a self-rightous idea of what the correct speed should be.

> "Self-righteous" idiots like the Highway Patrol, the Department of
> Transportation, and the elected local and federal legislative bodies?

No, the criminal government isn't involved. Just the idiots who think
the criminal government's revenue driven number signs give him the right
to block interstate travel at reasonable speeds.

> Wow. You sound at total odds with country you are living in.

Actually the people of the country I live in are driving way faster than
the control freaks. Even the control freaks are well over the posted
speed limit.

> The "correct speed" isn't up for debate by ANY idiots while driving on
> the road; it's posted right there on all those ****ing signs
> "littering" the highways all across the nation. I suppose some folks
> think they are decoration.

Um, the sign is irrelevant except as a taxation guideline. And speed
isn't up for debate, it's KEEP RIGHT EXCEPT TO PASS. People will drive
the speed they are going drive. Google '85th percentile method'.

> Well, if you want to debate the "correct" speed that is different from
> that posted on the books and signage, then you need to make your views
> known to the democratic process.

LOL. You still believe in that myth? We are ruled. The elections a show.
A farce. For idiots to think they have a say things.

>> Keep right except to pass.

> Yes. And keep your ****ing proper following distance, you know, the
> number you wrote down on your written drivers exam when you took it.

The ****? My following distance is greater than the distance the asshole
like you that I'm stuck behind.

>> > But we all know it has nothing to do with time; it's a need for speed
>> > and the slight Adrenalin flow that results.

>> LOL. I don't imagine my commute being 25% shorter in time for good
>> acceleration. (I don't even go faster (and often slower) than the speeds
>> the slow drivers eventually get too, I just get to them sooner). On the
>> interstate there is a huge difference between the 85th percentile
>> speed and the posted speed limit over 50 some miles.

> Suppose:
> Distance traveled = 60 miles

> Posted speed: 70MPH; Time = 51 minutes
> 85th percentile, perhaps: 85MPH; Time = 42 minutes

> Sure, about 9 minutes faster in this example. Not huge. But not
> insignificant.

70mph? Posted speed limit around here is 45-55mph. Compare that to
85mph!

> Of course, you have to factor in fuel consumption;

I've noticed no significant difference in fuel economy in my vehicles
at 55mph vs. normal traffic speeds. Whatever savings there may be, it is
entirely within the noise of the data. There

> PROVEN increased incidence of accidents and fatalities;

WRONG. States which raised their speed limits have seen fatalities fall
faster than those that did not. Montana, the state which raised then
lowered its speed limit saw a drop upon raising it and a dramatic
increase upon lowering it.

> the fact that if 100% of the
> people decided to drive the speed of the given 85th percentile, you
> would decrease your throughput and increase congestion, at least
> during higher volume times;

The mathmatics disagree with you. Increasing speed means increasing
qout. Increased qout and constant qin means decreasing congestion.

> and the fact that the more drivers making
> up their own personal speed limits increases the total speed rate
> differential and by necessity the safety and efficiency, and,
> ultimately, speed and throughput of the system; not to mention, if the
> 85th percentile wants to drive 85 or 90MPH, then why not make it 100,
> 110?

You really don't have the engineering background for this discussion.
People drive the speed they feel comfortable with. When the number on
the sign is higher, more and more people exhibit proper lane discipline.
Proper lane discipline results in greater safety. See German autobahn
vs. US interstate.

> We teach our children reasonable limits and common sense, but our sped-
> up central nervous systems and silly human nature causes us to behave
> like animals, by and by.

LOL. laugh. full of crap. Maybe it's time you grew up and decided not to
have a parental government.

> So, look out, folks. You have broken the Zigler. I give in. I throw up
> the white flag. Next time, I'm doing 130MPH so I can sleep in a little
> longer, and if I happen to kill you and your family or your ****ing
> grandmother, tough cookies. It's all about me.

If everyone showed proper lane discipline 130mph isn't a problem. The
highest speed I'll ever admit to going on a public road is 118mph in
Germany. I was behind a cop at the time... just couldn't keep up with
him. silly 1.6L engine. Anyway, the fastest sustained driving I've ever
done in my life was also the safest driving I've ever done. It was so
beautiful when people keep right except to pass in mass. Everyone did
what they should. Even on city streets. Swift acceleration when the
light turned green.... It was a driving heaven for me. Well except for
that no-right-on-red business. Roads developed for push carts in 16
whatever were flowing modern traffic better than 6 lane modern arterials
at home.

On 2008-08-16, Dave Head > wrote:

> With either of those, you have to wait on them to arrive, travel on their
> schedule, and then you're stranded when you get as far as they will go. You
> have to rent a car or walk or pay a taxi. No, I wouldn't want to get locked
> into that sort of "public transportation." That's why public transportation
> can't pay for itself now - it doesn't serve the needs of enough people to make
> the ridership go up enough to use fares to finance it.

Imagine what the environmentalist groups will want to do with the
ability to control every vehicle on the road. They will seek to ration
how much everyone can drive. You will travel on their schedule, on their
rules. They just won't let your car on the grid if you try to get around
it.

On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 09:22:12 -0700 (PDT), Zigler
> wrote:

>On Aug 16, 6:19*am, necromancer
> wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:32:50 -0500, "Speeders & Drunk Drivers are
>>
>> MURDERERS" > wrote:
>>
>> >No surprise here. *People are driving slower and less. *Just shows how easy
>> >it is to reduce the incredible highway homicide problem. *We need to lower
>> >speed limits and enforce it with stiff penalties and also mandate license
>> >suspension for most serious highway crimes like DUI or extreme speeding.
>>
>
>> What would the penalty for 16MPH over the limit (regardless of where
>> it occured) be?
>
>You get your car keys shoved up your ass... Plus a $G...

Then feel free to find the person I replied to (who has admited to
such) and do exactly what you said. If you can, please make a video of
it and post to youtube.

Thas ASSumes, of course, that you are not that person wearing a
sockpuppet.

>> >We could cut the highway death toll in half and save money in the process!
>>
>> My time is worth more than that.
>
>I highly doubt it.

Believe me, my time is worth more to me than your illusion of safety
will ever be.

--

Speeders & Drunk Drivers Are MURDERERS (a.k.a. SFB) admits to being
a deadly speeder, psychopath and criminal coddler:

"> Have you ever driven a car faster than the legal speed limit?

Yes, but never deliberately. In fact i got a speeding ticket about 5
years ago for doing 41 in a 25. I just about kicked the cops teeth in
cause i was sure he was lying. No way the SL on this wide open
stretch could be 25, i thought."

Pride of America (c.k.a. Laura Bush murdered her boyfriend/
laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE/Speeders And Drunk Drivers
Are Murderers (SADDAM)), 10/3/2002
Message-ID: >
http://tinyurl.com/5u4wg

Proof that POA is LBMHB/lbVH/SADDAM:
See the following: http://tinyurl.com/ahphj

On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 15:30:20 -0400, Nate Nagel >
wrote:

<< snip >>

>It won't. Your own idiocy is far more likely, if you're a typical
>American driver.

And odds are high that he is indeed a typical american (sic) driver.

>> then you damn
>> well better hope it's a LOT more than a fender-bender, because I would
>> crawl out of my car (if I could) and beat the absolute living **** out
>> of you within a millimeter of your life...
>
>No you wouldn't.

He talks big, doesn't he?

A feeling tells me that, "ziglar," is really SADDAM in a sock.....

>Like being in the hospital, because a universal truth is that pretty
>much everyone that initiates a threat of physical violence as a debate
>tactic on Usenet is invariably doing so to compensate for complete
>impotence in real life. Go ahead, throw a swing at me, Mr. Big Usenet
>Talker. I can guarandamntee you that I won't start a fight with you,
>but I won't hesitate to defend myself if assaulted either.

An excellent assessment.

>> Better yet, just drive the ****ing speed limit, huh? Or at least
>> within 5 MPH (minor roads) or 10 MPH (highway).
>
>No. My time and my safety are too important to me to be a "rock in a
>stream."
>
>> It's a wonder how many
>> dumb speeding ****s end up at the next stoplight right next to me...
>> as if you really have anywhere to go that is that important... or more
>> important than the rest of us... as if your time is really worth so
>> much compared to anyone else's... as if chronic speeding assholes do
>> any more than put others at risk, add stress to our commute, and
>> CONTRIBUTE TO TRAFFIC CONGESTION by disrupting the natural, steady,
>> smooth flow of traffic (think funnel).
>
>WAAAAAAH WAAAAH WAAAAAH TEHYRE ALLL BREAKING THE LAAAAAAAAW!

LOL!! Better call the WHAAAAAAmbulance for mr. ziglar/SADDAM...

>I can't remember the last time I saw someone obeying the speed limit on
>a freeway, so your argument that "speeding" disrupts traffic is asinine.

Well, in all fairness, I do see idiots like ziglar/saddam all the
time...

>
>> But we all know it has nothing to do with time; it's a need for speed
>> and the slight Adrenalin flow that results.
>
>Or perhaps that technology has advanced since the 1950s so the vast
>majority of people don't see the need to be constrained by laws that
>might have made sense back then but have nothing to do with real world
>conditions today.

Too bad that the conventional thinking in america (sic) as evidenced
by ziglar remains in the dark ages.

>> Well, there are PLENTY of
>> ways to get your rocks off and play in the sun; just keep your ****ing
>> playing OFF the public roads where your "fun" just adds to the stress
>> and risk of everyday people, like me, who spend most days traversing
>> the transportation system for their work.
>
>You're the asshole doing 54 in the passing lane, aren't you? Here's to
>you, Mr. Passive-Aggressive ****wit!
>
>> But cats like you are above the law and have absolutely zero regard
>> for the feelings and safety of others, would be my guess.
>>
>> Correct me where I am wrong.
>
>Just about everywhere. "Speeding" on a 55 MPH highway that is designed
>for 70 MPH traffic using 1950's and 1960's automobiles raises risk not
>one iota, in fact when everyone else is driving at 70-75 MPH *not*
>speeding increases your risk. Besides, if I really have a "need for
>speed" that needs to be satisfied, there's always SCCA, PCA, etc. - I
>don't need my excitement on public roads (but I sometimes get it anyway,
>usually thanks to some ****tard not slowly weaving back and forth while
>trying to balance his coffee and donut or whatever.)

Off hand, I'd say that the idiot going 55mph is the one raising the
danger for the rest of us.

>
>> Me and my damn conservative views...
>
>You're not a conservative, you're a whiny little bitch and a wanna be
>control freak. Here's an idea; live YOUR life, don't worry about
>everyone else's. Oh, and you might want to read up a little on traffic
>safety before you start coming off sounding like a complete ****ing
>moron. Oops, too late.

Indeed. If he has to do 55 so badly, let him use what another troll in
these groups referees to as the, "Federal Routes," and stay the hell
off the freeways.

>
>nate
>
>(yes, I may sound harsh, but it's not September yet.)

I'll let it slide.....

--

Speeders & Drunk Drivers Are MURDERERS (a.k.a. SFB) admits to being
a deadly speeder, psychopath and criminal coddler:

"> Have you ever driven a car faster than the legal speed limit?

Yes, but never deliberately. In fact i got a speeding ticket about 5
years ago for doing 41 in a 25. I just about kicked the cops teeth in
cause i was sure he was lying. No way the SL on this wide open
stretch could be 25, i thought."

Pride of America (c.k.a. Laura Bush murdered her boyfriend/
laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE/Speeders And Drunk Drivers
Are Murderers (SADDAM)), 10/3/2002
Message-ID: >
http://tinyurl.com/5u4wg

Proof that POA is LBMHB/lbVH/SADDAM:
See the following: http://tinyurl.com/ahphj

On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 16:29:09 -0400, Nate Nagel >
wrote:

>
>Oh, I get it. gpstard has nym-shifted again.

I would have guessed saddam. I hear that gpstroll has been running
container cranes (probablly ones that he broke into) in FL.

"Oh yeah. Well i've gone 3 1/2 years without a fatal crash
so i must be doing something right."

--Laura Bush murdered her boyfriend/laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE/
Speeders And Drunk Drivers Are Murderers (SADDAM), 9/24/2006

Ref: http://tinyurl.com/qdotr
Msg ID:

On Sat, 16 Aug 2008 13:41:52 -0700 (PDT), Zigler
> wrote:

>It's hard for me to judge people's motives and intentions (yet I may
>appear to), but it's probably a lot more complex than that.

You seem to be doing a fine job of it (actually, prejudge would be a
more appropriate word for you) with your threats and false bravado.

>For one, modern technology and lifestyle, while solving many problems
>and offering many improvements, has also increasingly sped up not only
>the world, but the actual central nervous systems of most people of
>industrialized nations, as well. And if you think you can transcend
>your basic humanity, then you are obviously living in a Star Wars
>fantasy... But I'm certain that many people simply speed without any
>real conscious thought on the matter. Well, that alone is a little
>nuts, don't you think?

Well, if it ani't Dr. Zigmund Fraud. You got cites for this?

>Now, next time you're in a crowded building or hallway, try your
>philosophy of speeding on foot when you actually have to interact with
>people. You won't get very far. But at least you likely won't endanger
>anyone's life.
>
>So you sound like a genuine, bona fide Texan to me, if I'm not
>mistaken. Your reckless driving may be more suited to the desert than
>the metropolitan areas, to be sure.

I was going to say the same about you. You sound just like that other
asshole texan, bush with your, "bring 'em on," mentality.

>At any rate, you speed all you want in Texas, or wherever the hell
>you're from, but as soon as you enter the Twin Cities, Minnesota, look
>the hell out...

No thanks. You ****ers can't maintain your bridges. Last thing I want
is to be caught behind you and get dumped into a river bcause your
sloth ass kept me on that bridge longer than needed.

> the Zigler's in your rear view mirror, driving about 5
>over the speed limit, in the right lane when needed, and in a manner
>that always gets me there, on time, and relatively safely, and
>certainly more relaxed.

Not going to happen. See above.

>Peace out, Tex.

** Y * A * W * N **
--
"The record run in oil prices is related more to
speculation and a weakening dollar than supply
and demand in the market. In terms of fundamentals,
fear of supply reliability is overblown."

--Exxon-Mobil CEO Rex Tillerson

SFB spewed:

>For openers i'd like to see drunk driving classified as a felony. That
>would be a severe penalty and wouldn't cost the taxpayers the way
>prison time does.

Then get to prison, you highway killer.

"Oh yeah. Well i've gone 3 1/2 years without a fatal crash
so i must be doing something right."

--Laura Bush murdered her boyfriend/laura bush - VEHICULAR HOMICIDE/
Speeders And Drunk Drivers Are Murderers (SADDAM), 9/24/2006

Ref: http://tinyurl.com/qdotr
Msg ID:

"C. E. White" wrote:

> Motorcycle crashes stand out as a growing problem. Deaths were up 6.6
> percent last year, the department said.

Same in the UK. Bikers don't seem to believe the law applies to them. Cyclists
too come to think of it.

Graham

In article >,
Zigler > wrote:
>On Aug 16, 6:19=A0am, necromancer
> wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:32:50 -0500, "Speeders & Drunk Drivers are
>>
>> MURDERERS" > wrote:
>>
>> >No surprise here. =A0People are driving slower and less. =A0Just shows h=
>ow easy
>> >it is to reduce the incredible highway homicide problem. =A0We need to l=
>ower
>> >speed limits and enforce it with stiff penalties and also mandate licens=
>e
>> >suspension for most serious highway crimes like DUI or extreme speeding.
>>
>
>> What would the penalty for 16MPH over the limit (regardless of where
>> it occured) be?
>
>You get your car keys shoved up your ass... Plus a $G...

I knew that Lazer-cut key would come in handy some day.
--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

Zigler > wrote in news:82d9811a-2639-496f-87b6-
:

> On Aug 16, 11:58*am, "Speeders & Drunk Drivers are MURDERERS"
> > wrote:
>>
>> For openers i'd like to see drunk driving classified as a felony. That
>> would be a severe penalty and wouldn't cost the taxpayers the way
>> prison time does.
>
> Wow... even a little extreme for me? First offense, as well? And at
> WHAT BAC level?
>
> Where I live, it is .08%. I actually think that is a little
> ridiculous, but it can depend on the person. I'd like to consider
> raising the limit back to .10,



For cocaine the threshold level is zero. ANY amount of cocaine on you and
the feds can charge you with felony possession. And you don't have to be
driving a car or doing anything that poses a threat to others. In light of
that, i think making first time DUI a felony is reasonable.