Intermittent Starting - 'Lazy' Starter Solenoid or ...?

Intermittent Starting - 'Lazy' Starter Solenoid or ...?

I've got a 90 Nissan 240SX 4cyl 5spd w/ about 140K mi. About 10% of the
time or more(started recently) you turn the key to start and nothing
happens. Try again and it 'usually' starts on 2nd or maybe 3rd try.
I've discovered if hold hold the key in the start position for several
seconds (5+?) it often does start cranking after waiting. Most other
times it starts fine without incident.

I've cleaned the cables though they hardly needed it - the cable crimps
are also easily visible and show no signs of corrosion.

I went ahead and replaced the battery - after watching it for a couple
weeks noticed moisture kept forming around the negative terminal and
mild corrosion was just starting. The battery was going on 9 years old
anyway.

Connections at starter solenoid and engine/body are excellent - clean
and snug. (the car is kept clean, operated in hot dry conditions, we
rarely even get rain).

Since it was reasonably accessible I isolated the clutch starter switch
- that checks out OK.

Sooooo - I'm starting to think starter solenoid may be getting weak,
lazy...? Any suggestions before I spring for a new solenoid or starter?

Thanks

Some of those used a gear reduction starter. It's expensive as hell.
Does yours?


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jeffcoslacker
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Ouch - actually I have no idea offhand. But I'm hoping to just consider
the solenoid rather than the whole starter.


jeffcoslacker wrote:
> Some of those used a gear reduction starter. It's expensive as hell.
> Does yours?
>
>
> --
> jeffcoslacker
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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"loadhawg" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Intermittent Starting - 'Lazy' Starter Solenoid or ...?
>
> I've got a 90 Nissan 240SX 4cyl 5spd w/ about 140K mi. About 10% of the
> time or more(started recently) you turn the key to start and nothing
> happens. Try again and it 'usually' starts on 2nd or maybe 3rd try.
> I've discovered if hold hold the key in the start position for several
> seconds (5+?) it often does start cranking after waiting. Most other
> times it starts fine without incident.
>
> I've cleaned the cables though they hardly needed it - the cable crimps
> are also easily visible and show no signs of corrosion.
>
> I went ahead and replaced the battery - after watching it for a couple
> weeks noticed moisture kept forming around the negative terminal and
> mild corrosion was just starting. The battery was going on 9 years old
> anyway.
>
> Connections at starter solenoid and engine/body are excellent - clean
> and snug. (the car is kept clean, operated in hot dry conditions, we
> rarely even get rain).
>
> Since it was reasonably accessible I isolated the clutch starter switch
> - that checks out OK.
>
> Sooooo - I'm starting to think starter solenoid may be getting weak,
> lazy...? Any suggestions before I spring for a new solenoid or starter?
>
> Thanks
>

Well, you've covered most of the possibilities already, assuming you did
clean all the connections then there are just a couple more things.
It will be hard, because this is intermittent and doesn't last long, but you
need to determine if the starter solenoid is actually getting voltage at the
S terminal when you turn the ignition to start. I would suggest making a
temporary test setup by attaching another wire to the S terminal at the
solenoid and running that wire into the cab where you could attach it to a
test lamp to ground. When you turn the key to start, if the lamp lights up
the solenoid is getting the signal. If the starter fails to run then at
least you will have eliminated everything except the starter or solenoid. If
it doesn't start and the test lamp doesn't light up then you need to work
you way back through the neutral safety switch or clutch safety switch then
back through the ignition switch itself. If it turns out it is a choice
between the starter or starter solenoid, you can pull the starter and bench
test the solenoid and starter to determine which one has the fault. I'm
betting on worn starter brushes or commutator, but an ignition switch would
be my next guess.
--
Kevin Mouton
Automotive Technology Instructor
"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy"
Red Green

Kevin wrote:
>
> Well, you've covered most of the possibilities already, assuming you did
> clean all the connections then there are just a couple more things.

Very clean. ;-)

> It will be hard, because this is intermittent and doesn't last long, but you
> need to determine if the starter solenoid is actually getting voltage at the
> S terminal when you turn the ignition to start. I would suggest making a
> temporary test setup by attaching another wire to the S terminal at the
> solenoid and running that wire into the cab where you could attach it to a
> test lamp to ground. When you turn the key to start, if the lamp lights up
> the solenoid is getting the signal. If the starter fails to run then at

I've got a simple remote starter switch (simple pushbutton and 2 HD
clips) and the starter is accessible from above (not to pull but to
access connections). Interestingly enough reading this made me think it
could be in the ignition (key) switch. 2 weeks ago when i first
attempted to diag this - I hooked up the remote switch and it never
failed once in 20+ tries. At the same time I discovered a rather loose
almost sloppy lug on the solenoid that fastened the bat cable (I could
move the bat cable back and forth by hand) and figured that MUST have
been it.

When it started again and I checked it last week I discovered the
moisture and mild buildup on the neg bat terminal since I cleaned it
recently and figured that THIS time I found it with a leak around the
terminal that was causing corrosion.

And of course it still happens presently...

I'm going to try the remote switch again and see if it occurs. If it
does - that should eliminate the ign switch and isolate it to the
starter/solenoid. If it doesn't recur w/ the remote switch I'll get an
assistant to crank while I put a light on the solenoid and watch - this
may end up pointing to the ign switch. If the light is not lighting up
- that would as you say indicate the ign switch.

Now by ign switch - I'm presuming this will likely lead me to the key
cylinder?

thanks

> least you will have eliminated everything except the starter or solenoid. If
> it doesn't start and the test lamp doesn't light up then you need to work
> you way back through the neutral safety switch or clutch safety switch then
> back through the ignition switch itself. If it turns out it is a choice
> between the starter or starter solenoid, you can pull the starter and bench
> test the solenoid and starter to determine which one has the fault. I'm
> betting on worn starter brushes or commutator, but an ignition switch would
> be my next guess.
> --
> Kevin Mouton
> Automotive Technology Instructor
> "If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy"
> Red Green