Passat 1.8T vs 2.0 TDI comparo: thermostat function....

Greetings, aficionados:

Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those in the
UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a 2.0 TDI
with waaaaaay more grunt.

Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T. Like at
least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same commute
to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out of the vents.
Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of temp/hot air), , and
still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C, just noticeably slower than
the other car.

I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the two,
simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...

Cheers,


Kevin
Halifax, NS

The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than the
gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all the
way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant stream
that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also need to
have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.

"K Bourke" > wrote in message
news:VlRkj.12995$yQ1.2844@edtnps89...
> Greetings, aficionados:
>
> Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those in
> the UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a 2.0
> TDI with waaaaaay more grunt.
>
> Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
> colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T. Like
> at least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same
> commute to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out of
> the vents. Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of
> temp/hot air), , and still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C, just
> noticeably slower than the other car.
>
> I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the
> two, simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
> diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...
>
> Cheers,
>
>
> Kevin
> Halifax, NS
>
>

The glow plugs are in the combustion chamber to warm things up for
slightly easer starting. They run for a few seconds. If the glow plug
light is off then the glow plugs are off. Of course assuming not
faults that cause the glow plug light to stay on indicating a problem.
The glow plugs have nothing to do with the coolant and oil warming up
faster.

My diesel takes a lot longer to warm up than my gas vehicles. I can
get warm air out of the gas vehicles after a few minutes of idling or
a mile of driving. The diesel will not put out warm air on a cold day
idling. It takes 3-5 miles to get warmed up. i don't use my John Deere
tractor much in the winter so I have no knowledge of how long it takes
for that diesel to make warm water.

On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:09:56 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
> wrote:

>The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than the
>gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all the
>way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant stream
>that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also need to
>have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.
>
>"K Bourke" > wrote in message
>news:VlRkj.12995$yQ1.2844@edtnps89...
>> Greetings, aficionados:
>>
>> Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those in
>> the UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a 2.0
>> TDI with waaaaaay more grunt.
>>
>> Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
>> colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T. Like
>> at least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same
>> commute to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out of
>> the vents. Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of
>> temp/hot air), , and still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C, just
>> noticeably slower than the other car.
>>
>> I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the
>> two, simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
>> diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>
>> Kevin
>> Halifax, NS
>>
>>
>

What Erik said, plus installing a block heater should give you a head start
for heat.


"Erik Dillenkofer" > wrote in message
news
> The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than the
> gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all
> the way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant
> stream that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also
> need to have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.

In addition to the glow plugs in the combustion chamber for starting the
engine (in temps below 40 degrees F), the TDI's ALSO have a set of 3 glow
plugs in the coolant to warm the engine quicker. I know, I have one. See
Bentley manual section 28b-3 & 4.

"Jim Behning" > wrote in message
...
> The glow plugs are in the combustion chamber to warm things up for
> slightly easer starting. They run for a few seconds. If the glow plug
> light is off then the glow plugs are off. Of course assuming not
> faults that cause the glow plug light to stay on indicating a problem.
> The glow plugs have nothing to do with the coolant and oil warming up
> faster.
>
> My diesel takes a lot longer to warm up than my gas vehicles. I can
> get warm air out of the gas vehicles after a few minutes of idling or
> a mile of driving. The diesel will not put out warm air on a cold day
> idling. It takes 3-5 miles to get warmed up. i don't use my John Deere
> tractor much in the winter so I have no knowledge of how long it takes
> for that diesel to make warm water.
>
> On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:09:56 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
> > wrote:
>
>>The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than the
>>gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all
>>the
>>way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant
>>stream
>>that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also need to
>>have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.
>>
>>"K Bourke" > wrote in message
>>news:VlRkj.12995$yQ1.2844@edtnps89...
>>> Greetings, aficionados:
>>>
>>> Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those in
>>> the UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a
>>> 2.0
>>> TDI with waaaaaay more grunt.
>>>
>>> Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
>>> colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T.
>>> Like
>>> at least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same
>>> commute to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out of
>>> the vents. Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of
>>> temp/hot air), , and still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C, just
>>> noticeably slower than the other car.
>>>
>>> I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the
>>> two, simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
>>> diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>>
>>> Kevin
>>> Halifax, NS
>>>
>>>
>>

Well silly me. I am wrong again. My 2003 Jetta has no block heater. I
looked all over my electronic Bentley and see no reference in the
cooling section or electrical diagrams.

http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-2.html has some comments about
factory block heaters. I am not sure what they mean by no block heater
installed from factory. ok they did not use those exact words but I
thnk that is what the paragraph means.

On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:00:15 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
> wrote:

>In addition to the glow plugs in the combustion chamber for starting the
>engine (in temps below 40 degrees F), the TDI's ALSO have a set of 3 glow
>plugs in the coolant to warm the engine quicker. I know, I have one. See
>Bentley manual section 28b-3 & 4.
>
>"Jim Behning" > wrote in message
.. .
>> The glow plugs are in the combustion chamber to warm things up for
>> slightly easer starting. They run for a few seconds. If the glow plug
>> light is off then the glow plugs are off. Of course assuming not
>> faults that cause the glow plug light to stay on indicating a problem.
>> The glow plugs have nothing to do with the coolant and oil warming up
>> faster.
>>
>> My diesel takes a lot longer to warm up than my gas vehicles. I can
>> get warm air out of the gas vehicles after a few minutes of idling or
>> a mile of driving. The diesel will not put out warm air on a cold day
>> idling. It takes 3-5 miles to get warmed up. i don't use my John Deere
>> tractor much in the winter so I have no knowledge of how long it takes
>> for that diesel to make warm water.
>>
>> On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:09:56 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than the
>>>gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all
>>>the
>>>way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant
>>>stream
>>>that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also need to
>>>have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.
>>>
>>>"K Bourke" > wrote in message
>>>news:VlRkj.12995$yQ1.2844@edtnps89...
>>>> Greetings, aficionados:
>>>>
>>>> Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those in
>>>> the UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a
>>>> 2.0
>>>> TDI with waaaaaay more grunt.
>>>>
>>>> Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
>>>> colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T.
>>>> Like
>>>> at least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same
>>>> commute to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out of
>>>> the vents. Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of
>>>> temp/hot air), , and still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C, just
>>>> noticeably slower than the other car.
>>>>
>>>> I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the
>>>> two, simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
>>>> diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kevin
>>>> Halifax, NS
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>

It's not a block heater. Check in the ignition section of your bentley
(sounds silly, but that's where they're referenced in my copy for my 2001).

"Jim Behning" > wrote in message
...
> Well silly me. I am wrong again. My 2003 Jetta has no block heater. I
> looked all over my electronic Bentley and see no reference in the
> cooling section or electrical diagrams.
>
> http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-2.html has some comments about
> factory block heaters. I am not sure what they mean by no block heater
> installed from factory. ok they did not use those exact words but I
> thnk that is what the paragraph means.
>
> On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:00:15 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
> > wrote:
>
>>In addition to the glow plugs in the combustion chamber for starting the
>>engine (in temps below 40 degrees F), the TDI's ALSO have a set of 3 glow
>>plugs in the coolant to warm the engine quicker. I know, I have one. See
>>Bentley manual section 28b-3 & 4.
>>
>>"Jim Behning" > wrote in
>>message
. ..
>>> The glow plugs are in the combustion chamber to warm things up for
>>> slightly easer starting. They run for a few seconds. If the glow plug
>>> light is off then the glow plugs are off. Of course assuming not
>>> faults that cause the glow plug light to stay on indicating a problem.
>>> The glow plugs have nothing to do with the coolant and oil warming up
>>> faster.
>>>
>>> My diesel takes a lot longer to warm up than my gas vehicles. I can
>>> get warm air out of the gas vehicles after a few minutes of idling or
>>> a mile of driving. The diesel will not put out warm air on a cold day
>>> idling. It takes 3-5 miles to get warmed up. i don't use my John Deere
>>> tractor much in the winter so I have no knowledge of how long it takes
>>> for that diesel to make warm water.
>>>
>>> On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:09:56 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>>The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than
>>>>the
>>>>gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all
>>>>the
>>>>way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant
>>>>stream
>>>>that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also need
>>>>to
>>>>have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.
>>>>
>>>>"K Bourke" > wrote in message
>>>>news:VlRkj.12995$yQ1.2844@edtnps89...
>>>>> Greetings, aficionados:
>>>>>
>>>>> Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those
>>>>> in
>>>>> the UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a
>>>>> 2.0
>>>>> TDI with waaaaaay more grunt.
>>>>>
>>>>> Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
>>>>> colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T.
>>>>> Like
>>>>> at least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same
>>>>> commute to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out
>>>>> of
>>>>> the vents. Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of
>>>>> temp/hot air), , and still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C,
>>>>> just
>>>>> noticeably slower than the other car.
>>>>>
>>>>> I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the
>>>>> two, simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
>>>>> diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kevin
>>>>> Halifax, NS
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>

OK, so now I see it tin the wiring diagram under 65/10. Now I need to
find out where Q7 is which is the alleged glow plugs (coolant). Once
again I am wrong.

On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 05:45:03 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
> wrote:

>It's not a block heater. Check in the ignition section of your bentley
>(sounds silly, but that's where they're referenced in my copy for my 2001).
>
>"Jim Behning" > wrote in message
.. .
>> Well silly me. I am wrong again. My 2003 Jetta has no block heater. I
>> looked all over my electronic Bentley and see no reference in the
>> cooling section or electrical diagrams.
>>
>> http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-2.html has some comments about
>> factory block heaters. I am not sure what they mean by no block heater
>> installed from factory. ok they did not use those exact words but I
>> thnk that is what the paragraph means.
>>
>> On Tue, 22 Jan 2008 18:00:15 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>In addition to the glow plugs in the combustion chamber for starting the
>>>engine (in temps below 40 degrees F), the TDI's ALSO have a set of 3 glow
>>>plugs in the coolant to warm the engine quicker. I know, I have one. See
>>>Bentley manual section 28b-3 & 4.
>>>
>>>"Jim Behning" > wrote in
>>>message
...
>>>> The glow plugs are in the combustion chamber to warm things up for
>>>> slightly easer starting. They run for a few seconds. If the glow plug
>>>> light is off then the glow plugs are off. Of course assuming not
>>>> faults that cause the glow plug light to stay on indicating a problem.
>>>> The glow plugs have nothing to do with the coolant and oil warming up
>>>> faster.
>>>>
>>>> My diesel takes a lot longer to warm up than my gas vehicles. I can
>>>> get warm air out of the gas vehicles after a few minutes of idling or
>>>> a mile of driving. The diesel will not put out warm air on a cold day
>>>> idling. It takes 3-5 miles to get warmed up. i don't use my John Deere
>>>> tractor much in the winter so I have no knowledge of how long it takes
>>>> for that diesel to make warm water.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:09:56 -0500, "Erik Dillenkofer"
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than
>>>>>the
>>>>>gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all
>>>>>the
>>>>>way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant
>>>>>stream
>>>>>that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also need
>>>>>to
>>>>>have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.
>>>>>
>>>>>"K Bourke" > wrote in message
>>>>>news:VlRkj.12995$yQ1.2844@edtnps89...
>>>>>> Greetings, aficionados:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lucky enough to have a brace of 2005 Passat wagons (estates for those
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> the UK/Aussie..), one a 1.8T 4-motion gas and the other (preferred) a
>>>>>> 2.0
>>>>>> TDI with waaaaaay more grunt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here in Nova Scotia, seasonal temps are dipping to -10 degrees C and
>>>>>> colder.... and the TDI takes a LOT longer to warm up than the 1.8T.
>>>>>> Like
>>>>>> at least twice the distance driven (I've swapped cars out for the same
>>>>>> commute to work...) for the TDI to start giving faintly warm air out
>>>>>> of
>>>>>> the vents. Doesn't *act* like a stuck T-stat (with sudden surge of
>>>>>> temp/hot air), , and still does get the water temp to 90 degrees C,
>>>>>> just
>>>>>> noticeably slower than the other car.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I can't see why there should be a (significant) difference between the
>>>>>> two, simply based upon the different engines (lower specific heat of
>>>>>> diesel??)....... and would appreciate any experience/opinions...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kevin
>>>>>> Halifax, NS
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>

"Lost In Space/Woodchuck" > wrote in message
...
> What Erik said, plus installing a block heater should give you a head
> start for heat.
>
>
> "Erik Dillenkofer" > wrote in message
> news
>> The diesel engine is much more efficient and has less waste heat than the
>> gas engine, therefore takes longer to heat up. Turn the heat control all
>> the way to hot on the diesel. There's a set of glow plugs in the coolant
>> stream that help to heat the coolant to bring it up to temp. You may also
>> need to have them checked to make sure they are operating corectly.
>


Thanks for the help.... will "look into" the coolant heaters/etc!

KB