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The dangers of DRLs



 
 
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  #71  
Old July 6th 05, 09:28 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 15:05:36 -0400, Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> On Tue, 5 Jul 2005, CH wrote:
>
>> There are a lot of plans of how to override the automatic headlights on
>> the web as far as I know.

>
> Most of them do not work on the latest GM vehicles, which monitor all
> lighting functions via the BCM and activate the chime and "SERVICE
> VEHICLE" light if you attempt to interfere.


One, there are electronic ways to override. These sensors are not rocket
science. If you are unable to do so yourself, there are people, who can do
that.

Two, it is not that difficult to access the control module and just
erase the trigger for the SES light.

Chris
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  #72  
Old July 6th 05, 09:30 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 05:55:43 -0400, Nate Nagel wrote:

> CH wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 20:42:33 -0400, Nate Nagel wrote:
>>
>>>Actually, in my case, I really *don't* have a choice of buying a non-GM
>>>car, unless I want to commit financial suicide.

>>
>> Why not? A clunker Corolla is $500.

>
> Gas and insurance are significantly more than purchase price, however, and
> are basically fixed costs...


You are right there, of course, but if you really hate the automated
headlights that much and think they are that dangerous you might want to
either still buy a clunker from a brand that doesn't have them or find an
employer, who will give you a company car, that doesnt have them.

Chris
  #73  
Old July 6th 05, 09:34 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 14:43:03 -0400, James C. Reeves wrote:

>
> "Nate Nagel" > wrote in message
> news:1120643773.6151a1501fd47b981402a57eda947826@t eranews...
>
>>> There are a lot of plans of how to override the automatic headlights on
>>> the web as far as I know.
>>>

>> Will definitely be looking at those should it become an issue.
>>

> The biggest problem with GM vehicles is that the BCM monitors DRL and
> headlamp functions. Doing the disable procedure incorrectly will set a
> code and illuminate the "Service Vehicle Soon" light in the instrument
> cluster. GM is apparently hell-bent on ****ing off the owners of their
> vehicles that just want to fix (or get rig of) their poor design...or so
> it seems.


The percentage of people, who even worry about things like automatic
headlights, is so small, that GM doesn't really think it is necessary to
cater to them. It's like with any other feature, only if significant
numbers of purchases depend on it being present or not present, a company
will provide/eliminate the feature.

Also, there are a whole bunch of ECM/BCM modification services out there
that can program your ECM/BCM almost any way you like. Erasing a trigger
for the SES light is one of their easiest exercises.

Chris
  #74  
Old July 6th 05, 09:36 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 15:04:56 -0400, Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> On Tue, 5 Jul 2005, CH wrote:
>
>> Oh, btw, Nissan also uses power brakes, power steering, ABS and
>> countless other features that don't give you 'full control' of your car.

>
> Red herring.


No.

> Power brakes do not activate by themselves -- there is no braking
> effect until the driver steps on the pedal.


But the braking effect is significantly different from what it would be
if the car did not have power brakes.

> Power steering, likewise, does not remove directional control of the
> car from the driver;


BMW builds cars, who change their steering ratio according to certain
parameters. Plus any power steering system diminishes road feedback.

> there is no steering effect until the driver moves the steering wheel.
> ABS is a borderline case; it reduces one kind of car control and
> augments another kind of car control. Whether the tradeoff is a good one
> depends on the implementation and the driver. In no case, however, is
> any of these items analogous to DRLs.


That's right, all of the items I named have a significant influence on
control and safety of a car, a missing DRL override switch does not.

Chris
  #75  
Old July 6th 05, 09:39 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 15:02:49 -0400, Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> On Tue, 5 Jul 2005, CH wrote:
>
>> Weird, I never got into a situation, where the DRLs had a negative
>> impact on safety

>
> Yes, you did. You may not know enough about the effects of lighting upon
> safety, but that doesn't mean there's no such effect.


From my own experience I can say that DRLs on other cars significantly
improve their visibility. I never got in a situation where the DRLs of
another car either made it harder for me to see or in any other way
created a safety hazard. And I assume that my DRLs are not any different
in that respect.

But as you are so vocal about the dangers of DRLs he Describe a
situation, where DRLs have a negative impact on safety.

Chris
  #76  
Old July 6th 05, 09:40 PM
Daniel J. Stern
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On Wed, 6 Jul 2005, CH wrote:

> >> Enforcement of having a manual override for automatic headlights has
> >> been codified since the Model T? I think not, back then they couldn't
> >> even imagine automatic headlights, much less override switches for
> >> them.

> >
> > No, you thundering shortbus retard, not "enforcement of having a
> > manual override for automatic headlights". Nobody's talking about
> > "enforcement of having a manual override for automatic headlights"
> > except for you. Go play in your sandbox while the adults discuss the
> > lengthy history of laws requiring that drivers properly use their
> > lights.

>
> An adult would not go ballistic if things don't go his way.


That's true. That's also not what I did. I ranted at your apparently
willful obtuseness.
  #77  
Old July 6th 05, 09:41 PM
Daniel J. Stern
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On Wed, 6 Jul 2005, CH wrote:

> >> There are a lot of plans of how to override the automatic headlights
> >> on the web as far as I know.

> >
> > Most of them do not work on the latest GM vehicles, which monitor all
> > lighting functions via the BCM and activate the chime and "SERVICE
> > VEHICLE" light if you attempt to interfere.

>
> One, there are electronic ways to override. These sensors are not rocket
> science. If you are unable to do so yourself, there are people, who can
> do that. Two, it is not that difficult to access the control module and
> just erase the trigger for the SES light.


Reality has a nasty habit of punching ugly holes in beautiful theories.

DS
  #78  
Old July 6th 05, 09:41 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 14:19:20 +0000, 223rem wrote:

> CH wrote:


>> Weird, I never got into a situation, where the DRLs had a negative
>> impact on either safety or conveninence. Pray tell us, what situation
>> that may be.

>
> When I sit (in winter) with my engine idling waiting for someone in an
> apartment complex and I dont want my lights shining in someones windows.
> Couldnt do that in my GM car!


Sitting there with an idling engine for a prolonged period od time is
extremely bad for the environment. If you get into this situation often
enough for the lights being a problem, buy an auxiliary gas powered
heater. I can point you to a manufacturer if you so wish.

>> Considering the total engineering disaster that is the Nissan 350Z
>> (google for alignment- and tire problems...) I am glad I don't own a
>> Nissan.

>
> So that problem alone dismisses Nissan in your eyes?


It shows that their testing and manufacturing procedures have serious
problems. And the fact that they are not even able to correct the problem,
in my opinion dismisses Nissan.

Chris
  #79  
Old July 6th 05, 09:44 PM
223rem
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CH wrote:
> But as you are so vocal about the dangers of DRLs he Describe a
> situation, where DRLs have a negative impact on safety.


1. An annoyed camper or apartment complex resident might be a hazard to
ones health.

2. Many drivers in DRL equipped cars dont think to turn on the regular lights
in fog or heavy rain in daytime. Driving without tail-lights in such
conditions is very dangerous.
  #80  
Old July 6th 05, 09:45 PM
CH
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On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 13:52:40 -0400, James C. Reeves wrote:

>
> "223rem" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> When I sit (in winter) with my engine idling waiting for someone in an
>> apartment complex and I dont want my lights shining in someones windows.
>> Couldnt do that in my GM car!

>
> And if you're a camper...it's common courtesy to enter the camp ground
> with only your parkers on. Can't do that in most GM cars either...you
> have no choice but to annoy (and/or awaken) the other campers. But some
> people are selfish and don't care about annoying other people, I suppose.


I do like to camp but I have to confess that cars driving on the
campground with low-beams don't annoy me half as much as people driving
around at dusk without their lights on.

>>> Considering the total engineering disaster that is the Nissan 350Z
>>> (google for alignment- and tire problems...) I am glad I don't own a
>>> Nissan.

>
> But Nissan obviously understands how people use their lights in the real
> world, at least. Not sure how tire alignment design has anything
> whatsoever to do with lighting systems design though. (Apples and
> Oranges)


What do I care about headlight problems if my car eats a set of tires
every 6000 miles? If I really wanted a car that doesnt have auto
headlights, there are enough other choices.

Chris
 




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