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Repair questions for 1990 Acura Integra, A/C and Valve CoverGasket (slightly long)
Hi folks--
I have some repair questions concerning my 1990 Acura Integra I hope someone here can help me with. The car has about 250,200 miles on it, and I am the only owner. I've been pretty good with keeping up with services and oil changes, but now I need to get *second opinions* on some maintenance issues, because the place I had been taking the car the last three years has become much less reliable, and I'm in the process of finding another reliable mechanic. I need to keep the car running well to go to and from school (I'm an older, nontraditional student), and keep the car for another 3 to 4 years, until I'm again gainfully employed and able to afford another newer car. In any case, I think the car should last me at least another 100K miles anyway! When I took the car in for inspection this morning, I had the mechanic check out the A/C, since I thought it was running very rough after I had more Freon put in it two weeks ago. The A/C went out last fall and I didn't get it fixed until now. BTW, the car passed inspection without a problem, since I had a minor exhaust system issue addressed two weeks ago at Big Al's. The mechanic told me that the compressor was old, and was "going," which I knew, since I've had relatively cool (not cold) A/C the past three or four years anyway, but the compressor didn't run nearly as rough as now. He said that the compressor could last another three months, or another three years, it was hard to say. He also said that the compressor would run harder in the extreme heat, and that I should expect the compressor to run rough until the car is warmed up anyway. Also, I asked him about replacing the valve cover gasket, as I have some oil leaking from the around the engine. Someone else told me that a failing valve cover gasket would cause that. The mechanic told me that there were two different types of gaskets now, one with Kevlar, and the older conventional kind. He also quoted a cost (around $100.00) for the repair, which I thought was fair. Is that in the ballpark? Is there anything else that would cause the car to use/burn excessive oil? Until the last service (replaced spark plugs) the car used 3/4 of a quart of oil in a month, and nearly left me stranded until I had the spark plugs replaced. So, is what I'm being told about the A/C compressor, and the oil leakage and valve cover gasket repair sound accurate, or am I being scammed again? Hopefully the valve cover gasket issue will be the last thing I'll have to deal with right now regarding my car. The fall semester starts on August 19th, and my time to address automotive issues after that will be extremely limited! Right now the yearly mileage on the Acura is 10K to 11K, but could increase to 20K if I don't move next spring when I transfer to another school that is 40 miles away, and would require a daily round-trip commute. Thanks in advance for the help/advice. I just want/need to have a working and reliable car to get me to and from school, errands, running events, and occasional social outings. My *other* vehicle is a 1979 Dodge Ram van/RV, that is even more unreliable, and with gas being so expensive, isn't cost-effective to drive. Jean in VA |
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Repair questions for 1990 Acura Integra, A/C and Valve Cover Gasket (slightly long)
"Jean S. Barto" > wrote
> Also, I asked him about replacing the valve cover gasket, > as I have some oil > leaking from the around the engine. Someone else told me > that a failing > valve cover gasket would cause that. Yes, it will. > The mechanic told me that there were > two different types of gaskets now, one with Kevlar, and > the older > conventional kind. He also quoted a cost (around $100.00) > for the repair, > which I thought was fair. Is that in the ballpark? Yes, it's in the ballpark, but I'd expect a bit less from an independent mechanic. Closer to $75 total. I haven't heard about the Kevlar type gasket here. If it were popular or recommended, it is IMO the sort of thing one would hear about here, since valve cover gasket replacements are pretty common around a ballpark age of 100k miles/7 years or so. I would buy the genuine Acura gasket instead of the Kevlar one, unless googling or someone here speaks up and confirms this is the latest technology. > Is there anything else > that would cause the car to use/burn excessive oil? Yes. I suggest also replacing the PCV valve. This is a part that will cost around $20. Get only an OEM (= genuine Acura) one. Also, the seals around the spark plug tube holes (and in the valve cover) probably need replacement. > Until the last service > (replaced spark plugs) the car used 3/4 of a quart of oil > in a month, and > nearly left me stranded until I had the spark plugs > replaced. Can you elaborate? I have a suspicion about what happened here, but want to hear more from you. When was the last full tuneup of your car (consisting of the items listed at http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id11.html ? Were genuine Acura parts used in this tuneup? |
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Repair questions for 1990 Acura Integra, A/C and Valve CoverGasket (slightly long)
Thanks for writing back so quickly. My reply is lengthy, but I think, worth
reading-- I had a *mini service* done last September at a Tread Quarters near my house. I went to them because my former BF goes to their place in his town nearby and has had good experience with them (he has a 1991 Civic, but with only about 125,000 miles on it). I got my tires and car battery from my Tread Quarters previously, and that was OK, as far as I know. However, when I had the mini-service done, Tread Quarters was supposed to have replaced the spark plugs as part of the service. Although they may have done that, the car died again the next week (stalled at an intersection, could not be jumped), and I had to get obnoxious, and get my former BF involved, to get the car fixed so that it would start reliably and not stall out at intersections, etc. So, the car was fixed as far as I knew, in late September. I kept driving it for the rest of the Fall semester. This *mini service* cost around $300.00, as I recall, and would have been even more expensive if I had gotten it done at a dealer. I do not know what kind of parts they used during this service. I had a second instance of being left stranded over Xmas break, and took the car back for service, this time to the Acura dealer where I took the car previously until I felt they were trying to scam me about 5 or 6 years ago. I frankly don't remember what was done back in early January, in any case they didn't charge me. I do recall that I wasn't particularly impressed with them, although they were a little improved from my last visit to them 4 or 5 years ago. So, I kept driving my car without incident from early January until mid-June, when it was due for an oil change. This time I took the car back to the Toyota dealer, where I had taken it previously, and where I had been *very* happy with their work until last August (A/C work, which failed in November). All they were supposed to do back in June was change the oil and put in a new rear backup light bulb which had burned out. What followed between mid-June and late July was my car eventually getting harder and harder to start when it had been sitting for awhile (such as overnight). The engine would whine and cough and take three or four turns of the key before turning over. I found I had had to pump the accelerator two or three times before turning the ignition key. I've never had to do this before, the car has always started up without coughing or sputtering, on the first turn of the ignition key, without fail, unless the battery or alternator was failing. This starting problem got worse and worse until I nearly got stranded in the parking lot at school 2 1/2 weeks ago after a math final. The next day I took the car back to the Toyota dealer, because I thought they had screwed up the oil change. I did not want to wait until my inspection was due in August, as that would have had me homebound for nearly two weeks. In any case, the Toyota dealer changed out the spark plugs because they were allegedly fouled with oil. They also put more Freon into the A/C. The Toyota service advisor also told me "Your car is burning oil, it's on its last legs, and the A/C has a slow leak in it. Also, your car was hesitating because one of the spark plugs was cracked." So, at some point the spark plug cracked--either on its own, or because someone (a earlier mechanic, or a vandal) deliberately cracked it. So, I'm not sure *who* scammed me this time--Tread Quarters back last September, the Acura dealer in early January, or the Toyota dealer back in mid-June for the oil change. Most likely, the Toyota dealer during the mid-June visit. Of course, the Toyota service advisor calls me at 6:45 PM (right before closing), and when I went to pick up the car the next day, he and *his team* were on their day off. So, I never had a chance to speak face-to-face with that service advisor, or the mechanic who worked on my car. Additionally, I felt the service advisor at the Toyota dealer two weeks ago was flippant and arrogant to me on the phone, and was only trying to help the dealership sell me a new car. However, my car was working OK when I picked it up (it was starting more or less OK, and the A/C was working), and so I thought I could wait on addressing my concerns until my inspection appointment this morning. However, when I went to Advance Auto for some windshield wipers later that morning two weeks ago, I had a tech check the charge on the battery. He said it was charging OK. Then, a friend of his came up while he was finishing checking my battery. They both commented on how rough the A/C compressor was running, and also said my problem with the engine oil leak was a failed valve cover gasket. I may have also mentioned in my first message that I originally was to have my inspection appointment at the Toyota dealer this morning. When I arrived, a service advisor told me my "service team" was not there. Furthermore, the service advisor I spoke with was not helpful when I told him I was unhappy with how my A/C was serviced (rough sounding compressor), and made some excuse that the service manager wasn't available for me to speak to. So, I walked out, and went down the street to an independent garage (recommended to me by the muffler place) who diagnosed the compressor issues and inspected my car without incident. While there, I tentatively scheduled the valve cover gasket repair at the independent garage for Monday morning. I think this new mechanic at the independent garage said that the conventional valve cover gasket was around $85.00, and the Kevlar one about $15.00 more. That's why I said the service was around $100.00. Lastly the mechanic I met at Advance Auto two weeks ago called me back *just now* as I'm typing this (I called him last week, he just called back because his cell phone was being repaired, and he was just now returning his calls). I might have him look at my car Saturday afternoon as a side job. This guy told me ten days ago at Advance Auto that my car should last me another 250K if I take care of it. Another 100K would be great, as that would get me through the rest of my schooling and into regular employment again. He is Mexican, and a diesel mechanic at the local AAFES distribution center. He seemed knowledgeable, and *perhaps* is someone I can have work on my car on the weekends, which is his only free time. In closing, I just don't think its normal for a car, even with 250K miles, to use 3/4 quart of oil in five weeks, and have trouble turning over when the battery has a good charge. I have all of my maintenance records going back sixteen years, and it has only been the last couple of years that I've had to get *really* anal/vigilant/bitchy about my car servicing. Additionally, although I look *very good* for age 51, I no longer look 25, and so I'm of the gender and age group that's apt to be routinely scammed regarding automotive maintenance. I top off my oil and washer/radiator fluid as required, and have oil changes done every 3K to 5K. However, I leave anything more complicated to trained mechanics. I don't have the tools, or the time, to do it myself. Furthermore, my hands are small and relatively weak, and so I would have trouble actually turning a wrench and repairing/replacing parts. I'm simply not particularly mechanically inclined. BTW, I checked the "Car Talk" website for good garages in my area, and like I thought, the Toyota and Acura dealerships have lukewarm ratings. The independent garage a mile from me has an *OK* one, but the best write-up of all is for a place about twelve miles from me, that is out of the way for me to get to. However, if neither the closer garage (1.5 miles away) or the *side-job* mechanic works out, I *will* check out this out of the way place. Thanks for reading this, and perhaps someone else can chime too-- Jean in VA On 8/3/06 3:18 PM, in article et, "Elle" > wrote: > "Jean S. Barto" > wrote >> Also, I asked him about replacing the valve cover gasket, >> as I have some oil >> leaking from the around the engine. Someone else told me >> that a failing >> valve cover gasket would cause that. > > Yes, it will. > >> The mechanic told me that there were >> two different types of gaskets now, one with Kevlar, and >> the older >> conventional kind. He also quoted a cost (around $100.00) >> for the repair, >> which I thought was fair. Is that in the ballpark? > > Yes, it's in the ballpark, but I'd expect a bit less from an > independent mechanic. Closer to $75 total. > > I haven't heard about the Kevlar type gasket here. If it > were popular or recommended, it is IMO the sort of thing one > would hear about here, since valve cover gasket replacements > are pretty common around a ballpark age of 100k miles/7 > years or so. > > I would buy the genuine Acura gasket instead of the Kevlar > one, unless googling or someone here speaks up and confirms > this is the latest technology. > >> Is there anything else >> that would cause the car to use/burn excessive oil? > > Yes. I suggest also replacing the PCV valve. This is a part > that will cost around $20. Get only an OEM (= genuine Acura) > one. > > Also, the seals around the spark plug tube holes (and in the > valve cover) probably need replacement. > >> Until the last service >> (replaced spark plugs) the car used 3/4 of a quart of oil >> in a month, and >> nearly left me stranded until I had the spark plugs >> replaced. > > Can you elaborate? > > I have a suspicion about what happened here, but want to > hear more from you. > > When was the last full tuneup of your car (consisting of the > items listed at > http://home.earthlink.net/~honda.lioness/id11.html ? > > Were genuine Acura parts used in this tuneup? > > |
#4
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Repair questions for 1990 Acura Integra, A/C and Valve Cover Gasket (slightly long)
Jean, it's important to establish a kind of "baseline" here
in order to troubleshoot this most effectively. So basic, not too expensive parts may need to be replaced. Unfortunately you're going to hear from this group one thing (or several opinions) and from your mechanics, possibly other things. It can be frustrating, but try to organize your approach into a sequence of steps. Pulling the spark plugs and seeing what brand they are is not difficult, if you or your boyfriend have a few tools. I, with others, strongly urge only using the plugs recommended for your car in its owner's manual. Most likely NGK plugs are one brand Honda/Acura recommends in the manual. Other than NGK plugs (and one other brand, IIRC) can cause serious running problems. It's possible the car's fuel injectors are leaking. The injectors, as you can imagine, spray fuel into the cylinders for combustion and ultimately your car's power. They are not supposed to be open when the car is "off." But sometimes, especially with older ones, gunk builds up on them and they stick open. A bottle of Chevron Techron ($7 at WalMart, Autozone, etc.) fuel system cleaner, poured into a near empty gas tank, which is then filled, might make a huge difference. Yours is an old car. Depending on how it's been maintained (and regular oil changes are not quite enough), it may be on its last legs. But maybe not. Read on. AFAIC, you are right to dump the Toyota shop. My impression is they are giving you the single woman treatment: Walk all over you, because they figure you won't complain, since you can't discuss the car's needs all that intelligently. My 1991 Honda Civic sat in a dealership lot for five days, with the service people repeatedly saying they would get to its no start condition. The problem was in fact easy to diagnose and ultimately was repaired within ten minutes. I have no doubt they dumped on me because I was a single woman not screaming bloody hell. They charged me a fortune for the tow and repair, as well. The repair did not hold up. I dealt with it intermittently for another year. This newsgroup was key to my understanding the problem and getting it fixed right. We do not all always agree, but often something good for the OP does come out of the discussions, as far as getting the OP's car back to good running condition. About the valve cover gasket: The $100 price you mention must be for labor and parts. I still don't like the Kevlar idea. I have changed the valve cover gasket a few times on my 91 Civic, and, as I mentioned, it comes up here as a maintenance item often. Just never heard of it. Many people purchase the parts they need for a repair, from online, genuine Acura ( = OEM here) parts dealers. You can do so for this valve cover (a.k.a. "cylinder head cover") gasket. See item #3 at http://www.acuraautomotiveparts.org/...prddisplay.jsp . This gasket will last a good long time--at least 50k miles and several years. Cost will be under $20 w/shipping. You can also buy an OEM PCV valve $14 not counting shipping and have it installed. Backtrack from the link above, and see the section under "Breather Chamber." > and the Kevlar one about > $15.00 more. That's why I said the service was around > $100.00. > > Lastly the mechanic I met at Advance Auto two weeks ago > called me back *just > now* as I'm typing this (I called him last week, he just > called back because > his cell phone was being repaired, and he was just now > returning his calls). > I might have him look at my car Saturday afternoon as a > side job. This guy > told me ten days ago at Advance Auto that my car should > last me another 250K > if I take care of it. If he saw it and said this, he is speaking the truth, for the most part. Without seeing it, and assuming it has been well-maintained, I would think you can take it to 300k miles easily. > In closing, I just don't think its normal for a car, even > with 250K miles, > to use 3/4 quart of oil in five weeks, Yes, that's maybe high, but not necessarily alarmingly so for an older car, for around 1000 miles in five weeks. The heat may be lowering oil viscosity and increasing consumption this time of year. As I mentioned, the PCV valve certainly may be overdue for replacement. If it's not working optimally, and on a car this old that's a good chance, it will tend to push oil out at various seals (including the valve cover gasket, esp. with an older gasket). My best luck (with my 91 Civic, 180k miles) has been with independent shops, insofar as the quality of the repair and cost was concerned. So I think the shop you found at the Car Talk site is worth a try, at least, especially if it specializes in Acuras or Imports. Still, even independent shops can rip people off. Automotive A/C is not something where I have specific expertise, but I do know the fundamentals of A/C. Compressors do break with age, and it is something I would expect to fail majorly before other components in your car. Studies bear out that women are walked all over at garages and dealerships. (Or they let themselves be walked over!) You're getting savvier every year on this. Keep asking questions. Others will post here. You're right to keep checking back. |
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Repair questions for 1990 Acura Integra, A/C and Valve Cover Gasket (slightly long)
Jean S. Barto wrote: > Tread Quarters was supposed to have replaced the spark plugs as part > of the service. Although they may have done that, the car died again > the next week (stalled at an intersection, could not be jumped), and > I had to get obnoxious, and get my former BF involved, to get > the car fixed so that it would start reliably and not stall out at > intersections, etc. So, the car was fixed as far as I knew, in late > September. Were the spark plugs replaced as part of normal maintenance, or were they replaced to fix a problem? Many garages replace plugs for the latter, even when the ignition system has no problems with it. > I kept driving it for the rest of the Fall semester. This *mini service* cost > around $300.00, $300 doesn't seem "mini." How expensive is regular service? > I had a second instance of being left stranded over Xmas break, and took the > car back for service, this time to the Acura dealer where I took the car > previously until I felt they were trying to scam me about 5 or 6 years ago. > > So, I kept driving my car without incident from early January until > mid-June, when it was due for an oil change. This time I took the car back > to the Toyota dealer, where I had taken it previously, and where I had been > *very* happy with their work until last August (A/C work, which failed in > November). All they were supposed to do back in June was change the oil and > put in a new rear backup light bulb which had burned out. > > What followed between mid-June and late July was my car eventually getting > harder and harder to start when it had been sitting for awhile (such as > overnight). The engine would whine and cough and take three or four turns > of the key before turning over. I found I had had to pump the accelerator > two or three times before turning the ignition key. Am I misreading something, or are you taking a Honda Acura to a Toyota dealer? Why not at least use a Honda dealer? I also don't understand how pumping the accelerator helps with a fuel injected engine, and I think all Acuras were fuel injected by 1990. The only time you should need to push the gas pedal of a fuel injected engine is to clear a flooded condition. And if a fuel injected engine is harder to start after it sat for a while, that could indicate an internal fuel system leak, such as because of a defective check valve. > This starting problem got worse and worse until I nearly got stranded in the > parking lot at school 2 1/2 weeks ago > In any case, the Toyota dealer changed out the spark plugs because they were > allegedly fouled with oil. They also put more Freon into the A/C. > The Toyota service advisor also told me "Your car is burning oil, it's on its > last legs, and the A/C has a slow leak in it. It may not cost that much to fix the A/C leak, especially at an auto A/C specialty shop, and the Freon R-12 your car uses is expensive but cheaper than converting to R-134a. But garages aren't supposed to simply add Freon to a leaking system but also fix the leak. At the very least, do not let anybody put R-134a into your system unless a complete conversion is done that includes removing all the old Freon and oil from the system. Cheap conversions don't cool well and have high failure rates. > Additionally, I felt the service advisor at the Toyota dealer two weeks ago > was flippant and arrogant to me on the phone, and was only trying to help > the dealership sell me a new car. At many dealerships, service advisors are little more than comissioned sales people and know little about cars. I don't understand why you'd choose a garage simply because a muffler shop recommends it. > However, my car was working OK when I picked it up (it was starting more > or less OK, and the A/C was working), > However, when I went to Advance Auto for some windshield wipers later that > morning two weeks ago, I had a tech check the charge on the battery. He > said it was charging OK. Then, a friend of his came up while he was > finishing checking my battery. They both commented on how rough the A/C > compressor was running, and also said my problem with the engine oil leak > was a failed valve cover gasket. > In closing, I just don't think its normal for a car, even with 250K miles, > to use 3/4 quart of oil in five weeks, and have trouble turning over when > the battery has a good charge. 3/4 qt. / 5 weeks (I'm assuming it's about 1000 miles) is not unusual for an old engine, especially one with worn valve seals. Acuras aren't known for leaky valve covers, so I see nothing wrong with a conventional gasket, but use only quality gaskets, either original equipment or Fel-Pro. > BTW, I checked the "Car Talk" website for good garages in my area, and like > I thought, the Toyota and Acura dealerships have lukewarm ratings. The > independent garage a mile from me has an *OK* one, but the best write-up of > all is for a place about twelve miles from me, that is out of the way for me > to get to. However, if neither the closer garage (1.5 miles away) or the > *side-job* mechanic works out, I *will* check out this out of the way place. How do you know the ratings are accurate? I would look for factory trained mechanics (ASE certification isn't nearly as good), but beware that even dealerships don't always employ them. Also AAA approval is desirable since it requires garages to abide by AAA arbitration of disputes (customer is not obligated). |
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