How to tell a different trim version

Zathras > wrote:

> On Sun, 17 Jan 2010 21:57:42 +0000, (SteveH)
> wrote:
>
> ..Just to add..
>
> >My experience of pre-facelift cars is that specs are largely random -
> >Alfa were building to order, so you could pretty much order any spec.
> >you wanted at the time.
>
> There were definitely lots of weird combos.
>
> >Hints are in the dash trim - if it's wood, with a wooden steering wheel
> >and gearstick, I believe you're looking at a Lusso.
>
> Yes. Also it had no side skirts.

Oh yes, forgot that bit!

> >Leather could be ordered on any trim level.... and Turismo didn't exist
> >at the time.
>
> I've not seen any base models (non Veloce or Lusso) with leather - I
> think it would have been more cost-effective at the time to just get a
> Lusso (which is always leather). Some people prefer cloth to hold them
> in their seats rather than slide about on leather (though this didn't
> happen with the Alfa leather in the same way that the wooden Alfa
> steering wheel on some models was surprisingly grippy) so there are a
> few cloth Veloces out there.

Base / Lusso confuses me.

I've seen what I'd call 'base' cars with nasty looking coth seats and
what I thought were 'lusso' spec. cars which didn't have leather, but
had a kind of corduroy seat fabric and electric rear windows, with the
wooden trim.

> >Base spec. cars tended to have wind-down windows in the back and a
> >plastic steering wheel - Veloce (or, Sport Pack as they were called on
> >pre-facelift cars, as I recall) usually had 'Recaro' type seats with
>
> Leather or cloth. You could have a "Veloce" with cloth recaro-style
> seats as standard or a "Veloce Leather" which had leather recaro-style
> seats. Veloce models had instruments with red on black dials. Other
> models had white on black. Veloce had lowered suspension and (cheap)
> side skirts.
>
> Boot spoilers were extras on all models and were available only for
> the tastefully challenged! IIRC, boot spoilers weren't even fitted to
> early GTAs thus blowing the need for boot spoilers out of the water
> and upsetting those that told everyone there was a technical need for
> a big one - exposing those folks as common frustrated 'Barrys' (Catman
> excluded..er..maybe..er..)
>
> The Veloce Leather was *the* trim for the discerning Alfa enthusiast.
> IMHO! Nice 16 inch telephone dial (teledial) wheels. Still my all-time
> favourite design.

Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?

> >leather, and carbon-fibre look trim on the dash with leather steering
> >wheel.
> >
> >Lusso spec. had 15" 'pepperpot' alloys, Veloce / Sportpack were 16" or
> >above and base were steel wheels with plastic trim.
>
> IIRC, Selespeeds had 16 inch pepperpot wheels too. These wheels found
> there way onto other cars as Selespeeds tended to head toward scrap
> yards quicker than other models!!

Good point - weren't Sele wheels very similar to standard Veloce wheels
with a subtle difference?

<snip>

I don't think any of this helped at all!
--
SteveH

In article >,
says...
> Zathras > wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 17 Jan 2010 21:57:42 +0000, (SteveH)
> > wrote:
> >
> > ..Just to add..
> >
> > >My experience of pre-facelift cars is that specs are largely random -
> > >Alfa were building to order, so you could pretty much order any spec.
> > >you wanted at the time.
> >
> > There were definitely lots of weird combos.
> >
> > >Hints are in the dash trim - if it's wood, with a wooden steering wheel
> > >and gearstick, I believe you're looking at a Lusso.
> >
> > Yes. Also it had no side skirts.
>
> Oh yes, forgot that bit!
>
> > >Leather could be ordered on any trim level.... and Turismo didn't exist
> > >at the time.
> >
> > I've not seen any base models (non Veloce or Lusso) with leather - I
> > think it would have been more cost-effective at the time to just get a
> > Lusso (which is always leather). Some people prefer cloth to hold them
> > in their seats rather than slide about on leather (though this didn't
> > happen with the Alfa leather in the same way that the wooden Alfa
> > steering wheel on some models was surprisingly grippy) so there are a
> > few cloth Veloces out there.
>
> Base / Lusso confuses me.
>
> I've seen what I'd call 'base' cars with nasty looking coth seats and
> what I thought were 'lusso' spec. cars which didn't have leather, but
> had a kind of corduroy seat fabric and electric rear windows, with the
> wooden trim.
>
> > >Base spec. cars tended to have wind-down windows in the back and a
> > >plastic steering wheel - Veloce (or, Sport Pack as they were called on
> > >pre-facelift cars, as I recall) usually had 'Recaro' type seats with
> >
> > Leather or cloth. You could have a "Veloce" with cloth recaro-style
> > seats as standard or a "Veloce Leather" which had leather recaro-style
> > seats. Veloce models had instruments with red on black dials. Other
> > models had white on black. Veloce had lowered suspension and (cheap)
> > side skirts.
> >
> > Boot spoilers were extras on all models and were available only for
> > the tastefully challenged! IIRC, boot spoilers weren't even fitted to
> > early GTAs thus blowing the need for boot spoilers out of the water
> > and upsetting those that told everyone there was a technical need for
> > a big one - exposing those folks as common frustrated 'Barrys' (Catman
> > excluded..er..maybe..er..)
> >
> > The Veloce Leather was *the* trim for the discerning Alfa enthusiast.
> > IMHO! Nice 16 inch telephone dial (teledial) wheels. Still my all-time
> > favourite design.
>
> Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
> seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
> with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
> get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?
>

My 2000 Veloce had Recaro cloth, but the only adjustment was a little
electric switch on the side of the seat to adjust the rake. In just over
eight years of ownership I don't think I ever used it after the first couple
of months (being Italian it probably stopped working around that time
anyway!)

Looking at my old brochures circa 2000, there are three types of alloys - the
8 hole 15" as fitted to the Lusso and larger engined standard models, 5 hole
16" as fitted to Veloce and 5 hole 16" for Selespeed. Standard spec
presumably had the plastic trims with a ring of small holes round the rim.

ISTR the GTA had 5 hole alloys similar to the Veloce, but with bigger holes.

Silliest bit of trim (after the boot spoilers of course...) is the fold-down
armrest on my 05 2.0 JTS - it just gets in the way!

--
Halmyre

This is the most powerful sigfile in the world and will probably blow your
head clean off.

Halmyre > wrote:

> > Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
> > seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
> > with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
> > get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?
> >
>
> My 2000 Veloce had Recaro cloth, but the only adjustment was a little
> electric switch on the side of the seat to adjust the rake. In just over
> eight years of ownership I don't think I ever used it after the first couple
> of months (being Italian it probably stopped working around that time
> anyway!)
>
> Looking at my old brochures circa 2000, there are three types of alloys - the
> 8 hole 15" as fitted to the Lusso and larger engined standard models, 5 hole
> 16" as fitted to Veloce and 5 hole 16" for Selespeed. Standard spec
> presumably had the plastic trims with a ring of small holes round the rim.
>
> ISTR the GTA had 5 hole alloys similar to the Veloce, but with bigger holes.
>
> Silliest bit of trim (after the boot spoilers of course...) is the fold-down
> armrest on my 05 2.0 JTS - it just gets in the way!

Well, I was under the impression this was a Lusso:

http://www.italiancar.co.uk/forsale/forsale.html

And that those style seats could be had in Veloce Leather models as in
this: (Veloce Leather Selespeed)

http://www.italiancar.co.uk/Veloce/Veloce.html

There were also these seats / trim:

http://thevaletguy.co.uk/lightbox/da...erior_Front_Be
fore.jpg

Which I thought was 'base'.

And you had the silly seats I can't find, with adjustable knee support
etc - but I can't find a photo.


--
SteveH

SteveH wrote:
> Halmyre > wrote:
>
>>> Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
>>> seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
>>> with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
>>> get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?
>>>
>> My 2000 Veloce had Recaro cloth, but the only adjustment was a little
>> electric switch on the side of the seat to adjust the rake. In just over
>> eight years of ownership I don't think I ever used it after the first couple
>> of months (being Italian it probably stopped working around that time
>> anyway!)
>>
>> Looking at my old brochures circa 2000, there are three types of alloys - the
>> 8 hole 15" as fitted to the Lusso and larger engined standard models, 5 hole
>> 16" as fitted to Veloce and 5 hole 16" for Selespeed. Standard spec
>> presumably had the plastic trims with a ring of small holes round the rim.
>>
>> ISTR the GTA had 5 hole alloys similar to the Veloce, but with bigger holes.
>>
>> Silliest bit of trim (after the boot spoilers of course...) is the fold-down
>> armrest on my 05 2.0 JTS - it just gets in the way!
>
> Well, I was under the impression this was a Lusso:
>
> http://www.italiancar.co.uk/forsale/forsale.html

I was too.

>
> And that those style seats could be had in Veloce Leather models as in
> this: (Veloce Leather Selespeed)
>
> http://www.italiancar.co.uk/Veloce/Veloce.html
>

I thought they were the standard leather seats.

> There were also these seats / trim:
>
> http://thevaletguy.co.uk/lightbox/da...erior_Front_Be
> fore.jpg
>
> Which I thought was 'base'.
>
> And you had the silly seats I can't find, with adjustable knee support
> etc - but I can't find a photo.
>

Probably just as well. There was a cloth version that had adjustable
knee / thigh support as well. My V6 came with them.


--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
116 Giulietta 3.0l Sprint 1.7 GTV TS GT 3.2 V6
Triumph Sprint ST 1050: It's blue, see.
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

On Mon, 18 Jan 2010 19:44:50 +0000, (SteveH)
wrote:

>Zathras > wrote:

>Base / Lusso confuses me.
>
>I've seen what I'd call 'base' cars with nasty looking coth seats and
>what I thought were 'lusso' spec. cars which didn't have leather, but
>had a kind of corduroy seat fabric and electric rear windows, with the
>wooden trim.

I always thought Lusso should have had leather and tended to have
wood. Not sure about cars much pre-2001 though.

>Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
>seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
>with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
>get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?

Never come across those personally - weren't an option in 2001. did
they appear on GTA and later TI models?

>Good point - weren't Sele wheels very similar to standard Veloce wheels
>with a subtle difference?

I thought they were closer to the pepper pot style myself.

>I don't think any of this helped at all!

Indeed. A good memory test though!

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather (sold)
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email must have the word 'Alfa' in the
subject line to get through auto-filtering)

On Mon, 18 Jan 2010 20:07:20 -0000, Halmyre >
wrote:

>Looking at my old brochures circa 2000, there are three types of alloys - the
>8 hole 15" as fitted to the Lusso and larger engined standard models, 5 hole
>16" as fitted to Veloce and 5 hole 16" for Selespeed. Standard spec
>presumably had the plastic trims with a ring of small holes round the rim.

Later cars had 15 inch alloys instead.

>ISTR the GTA had 5 hole alloys similar to the Veloce, but with bigger holes.

They were less subtle too. I saw a GTV Cup that had 17 (or possibly 18
inch) version of the Veloce teledials - lovely!

>Silliest bit of trim (after the boot spoilers of course...) is the fold-down
>armrest on my 05 2.0 JTS - it just gets in the way!

Nah..I liked mine.

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather (sold)
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email must have the word 'Alfa' in the
subject line to get through auto-filtering)

On Mon, 18 Jan 2010 20:26:47 +0000, (SteveH)
wrote:

>Well, I was under the impression this was a Lusso:
>
>http://www.italiancar.co.uk/forsale/forsale.html

Could that be from a time (pre 2000?) when Lusso didn't always have
leather? The only ones I saw later than that without leather were
described as "mis-builds" by the main dealer that had them. He said
that because they were the incorrect spec, they were being sold to a
company cheap.

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather (sold)
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email must have the word 'Alfa' in the
subject line to get through auto-filtering)

Zathras wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Jan 2010 19:44:50 +0000, (SteveH)
> wrote:
>
>> Zathras > wrote:
>
>> Base / Lusso confuses me.
>>
>> I've seen what I'd call 'base' cars with nasty looking coth seats and
>> what I thought were 'lusso' spec. cars which didn't have leather, but
>> had a kind of corduroy seat fabric and electric rear windows, with the
>> wooden trim.
>
> I always thought Lusso should have had leather and tended to have
> wood. Not sure about cars much pre-2001 though.
>
>> Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
>> seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
>> with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
>> get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?
>
> Never come across those personally - weren't an option in 2001. did
> they appear on GTA and later TI models?
>

I think the GTA got still another type of seat. It had many horizontal
pleats IIRC.


--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
116 Giulietta 3.0l Sprint 1.7 GTV TS GT 3.2 V6
Triumph Sprint ST 1050: It's blue, see.
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

On 18 Jan, 21:48, Catman > wrote:
> SteveH wrote:
> > Halmyre > wrote:
>
> >>> Now, when we're talking Veloce seats - there were the standard Recaro
> >>> seats (which I have in leather) and the remarkably silly wing-back seats
> >>> with about eleventy hundred adjustable bits.... which I belive you could
> >>> get in leather or cloth.... were they some kind of sport-pack addition?
>
> >> My 2000 Veloce had Recaro cloth, but the only adjustment was a little
> >> electric switch on the side of the seat to adjust the rake. In just over
> >> eight years of ownership I don't think I ever used it after the first couple
> >> of months (being Italian it probably stopped working around that time
> >> anyway!)
>
> >> Looking at my old brochures circa 2000, there are three types of alloys - the
> >> 8 hole 15" as fitted to the Lusso and larger engined standard models, 5 hole
> >> 16" as fitted to Veloce and 5 hole 16" for Selespeed. Standard spec
> >> presumably had the plastic trims with a ring of small holes round the rim.
>
> >> ISTR the GTA had 5 hole alloys similar to the Veloce, but with bigger holes.
>
> >> Silliest bit of trim (after the boot spoilers of course...) is the fold-down
> >> armrest on my 05 2.0 JTS - it just gets in the way!
>
> > Well, I was under the impression this was a Lusso:
>
> >http://www.italiancar.co.uk/forsale/forsale.html
>
> I was too.
>
>
>
> > And that those style seats could be had in Veloce Leather models as in
> > this: (Veloce Leather Selespeed)
>
> >http://www.italiancar.co.uk/Veloce/Veloce.html
>
> I thought they were the standard leather seats.
>
> > There were also these seats / trim:
>
> >http://thevaletguy.co.uk/lightbox/da...erior_Front_Be
> > fore.jpg
>
> > Which I thought was 'base'.
>
> > And you had the silly seats I can't find, with adjustable knee support
> > etc - but I can't find a photo.
>
> Probably just as well. There was a cloth version that had adjustable
> knee / thigh support as well. My V6 came with them.
>

Adjustable as in either "in" or "out"? That sounds like the seats in
my old Veloce. When I swapped it for the '05 version, it just had
ordinary velour seats - pikey spec! My first impression was they
weren't as comfortable, but after a couple of days I was completely at
home.

--
Halmyre

On 19 Jan, 00:36, Zathras >
wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Jan 2010 20:07:20 -0000, Halmyre >
> wrote:
>
> >Looking at my old brochures circa 2000, there are three types of alloys - the
> >8 hole 15" as fitted to the Lusso and larger engined standard models, 5 hole
> >16" as fitted to Veloce and 5 hole 16" for Selespeed. Standard spec
> >presumably had the plastic trims with a ring of small holes round the rim.
>
> Later cars had 15 inch alloys instead.
>
> >ISTR the GTA had 5 hole alloys similar to the Veloce, but with bigger holes.
>
> They were less subtle too. I saw a GTV Cup that had 17 (or possibly 18
> inch) version of the Veloce teledials - lovely!
>
> >Silliest bit of trim (after the boot spoilers of course...) is the fold-down
> >armrest on my 05 2.0 JTS - it just gets in the way!
>
> Nah..I liked mine.
>

I've used it occasionally, but I can't easily apply the handbrake or
change gear while it's in the down position. I suppose it's OK for
long distance cruising, or with an auto box, but on a half-hour
commuter run it's just a nuisance. An arm-rest on the right-hand side
would be of more benefit for me.

--
Halmyre