OT 8N tractor wont start. (Been trying for over a year).

I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing twice.

I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.

As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained:
1= 85psi
2= almost 90 psi
3= almost 90 psi
4= almost 80 psi

I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings were obtained after the addition of oil:
1= 120 psi
2= 130 psi
3= 105 psi
4= 95 psi

I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb throat.

I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.

I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.

> wrote:
>
>I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.

If you're getting a good spark out of it... and spraying starting fluid into
the intake doesn't cause it to fire... and it's pulling air through the engine
then it's likely that the spark isn't happening at the right time.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 10/17/2016 8:20 AM, wrote:
> I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing twice.
>
> I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
>
> As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained:
> 1= 85psi
> 2= almost 90 psi
> 3= almost 90 psi
> 4= almost 80 psi
>
> I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings were obtained after the addition of oil:
> 1= 120 psi
> 2= 130 psi
> 3= 105 psi
> 4= 95 psi
>
> I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb throat.
>
> I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.
>
> I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.
>

Could it be that your distributor is installed 180 degrees
off? BTDT.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

wrote:
> I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing twice.
>
> I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
>
> As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained:
> 1= 85psi
> 2= almost 90 psi
> 3= almost 90 psi
> 4= almost 80 psi
>
> I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings were obtained after the addition of oil:
> 1= 120 psi
> 2= 130 psi
> 3= 105 psi
> 4= 95 psi
>
> I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb throat.
>
> I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.
>
> I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.

I used to have one of these on the farm... a long time ago.
Does the rotor point at the #1 plug wire on the dist cap when #1 is
at TDC _compression_ stroke? Pull the plugs and hold your thumb over the hole to be sure
it is a compression and not exhaust stroke.

Does the spark seem strong enough? It takes more under compression.

Is this the 6v positive ground version? Coil wired accordingly?

On Monday, October 17, 2016 at 3:20:54 AM UTC-10, wrote:
> I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing twice.
>
> I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
>
> As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained:
> 1= 85psi
> 2= almost 90 psi
> 3= almost 90 psi
> 4= almost 80 psi
>
> I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings were obtained after the addition of oil:
> 1= 120 psi
> 2= 130 psi
> 3= 105 psi
> 4= 95 psi
>
> I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb throat.
>
> I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.
>
> I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.

You should find an old mechanic that knows about engines to help you out. It sounds like a simple problem of ignition timing.

On Mon, 17 Oct 2016 06:20:51 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

>I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing twice.
>
>I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
>
>As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained:
>1= 85psi
>2= almost 90 psi
>3= almost 90 psi
>4= almost 80 psi
>
>I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings were obtained after the addition of oil:
>1= 120 psi
>2= 130 psi
>3= 105 psi
>4= 95 psi
>
> I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb throat.
>
>I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.
>
>I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.

Others have pointed some of these things out, but you need to check
timing, firing order, weak spark (someone mentioned reversed wiring on
the primary side of the coil). You also need to set the points dwell,
or properly set the gap. Spark testers are cheap, and will tell you if
the spark is weak, and to be honest, that's what it really sounds
like. Make sure you get the right tester (for points ignition
systems).

I guess this is a 6 volt system. Turn the ignition on, and check the
voltage at both sides of the coil (with the points closed). One side
should read the full 6 volts, and the other should be no more than
about .2 V. If the ground side is too high, there is a bad ground, or
bad wiring through the distributor to ground. If the power side is too
low, there is resistance somewhere in the circuit. (Make sure the
battery is fully charged.) And as someone else said, that should be a
positive ground system. And again, make sure the wires are not
reversed on the coil.

wrote:
> I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the
> thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be
> able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it.
> To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the
> following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I
> broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I
> checked the timing twice.
>
> I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a
> minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not
> restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it
> would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to
> restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort
> yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded
> to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like
> it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never
> takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when
> cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas.
> It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the
> carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug
> holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
>
> As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle
> control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I
> can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained: 1=
> 85psi 2= almost 90 psi 3= almost 90 psi 4= almost 80 psi
>
> I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one
> at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart
> container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The
> following readings were obtained after the addition of oil: 1= 120
> psi 2= 130 psi 3= 105 psi 4= 95 psi
>
> I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb
> throat.
>
> I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.
>
>
> I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.


OK, First thing, check the battery connections. If this is still a 6
volt tractor it is positive ground. Reverse the battery connections and
it won't start.

Next double check the plug wire locations to make sure you are in the
correct order AND correct rotation. 1-2-4-3 , as you face the dist. the
top left is #1 below it is #2, on the right side top is #3 bottom #4

Now pull the cap, wipe it clean, and take a points file and clean the
contacts, have seen many NEW points that have a coating that keeps them
from firing correctly. Reset the gap and make sure they actually
open/close, A worn lobe can cause problems. Replace the condenser and be
sure there is no rust/crud in the dist.

Pull the plugs and burn them clean with a torch and check the gap.
With the plugs out check for a nice hot spark at all 4 plugs.

_______________________

IF this tractor has been converted to 12 volt Negative ground - Check
all the above AND make sure that a second ballast resistor is in line to
the coil. When you turn on the ignition switch you should see 2.5 - 3
volts at the coil terminal WITH the points closed.


Now put a bit of gas in each cylinder, install the plugs and it should
fire and run a few seconds. If the carb is working it should run longer.
Carb wise, make sure you have clean fresh cas, and that you have fuel in
the carb, a stuck needle or plugged fuel line can cause a lot of problems.

--
Steve W.

On Monday, October 17, 2016 at 9:37:55 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Oct 2016 06:20:51 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
>
> >I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the thing is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following: gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing twice.
> >
> >I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a minute holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking, however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
> >
> >As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle control wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get it started. The following were the results I obtained:
> >1= 85psi
> >2= almost 90 psi
> >3= almost 90 psi
> >4= almost 80 psi
> >
> >I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes one at a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container, the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings were obtained after the addition of oil:
> >1= 120 psi
> >2= 130 psi
> >3= 105 psi
> >4= 95 psi
> >
> > I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the carb throat.
> >
> >I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a leak.
> >
> >I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.
>
> Others have pointed some of these things out, but you need to check
> timing, firing order, weak spark (someone mentioned reversed wiring on
> the primary side of the coil). You also need to set the points dwell,
> or properly set the gap. Spark testers are cheap, and will tell you if
> the spark is weak, and to be honest, that's what it really sounds
> like. Make sure you get the right tester (for points ignition
> systems).
>
> I guess this is a 6 volt system. Turn the ignition on, and check the
> voltage at both sides of the coil (with the points closed). One side
> should read the full 6 volts, and the other should be no more than
> about .2 V. If the ground side is too high, there is a bad ground, or
> bad wiring through the distributor to ground. If the power side is too
> low, there is resistance somewhere in the circuit. (Make sure the
> battery is fully charged.) And as someone else said, that should be a
> positive ground system. And again, make sure the wires are not
> reversed on the coil.

This has been converted to 12 volts. Here is a video last night of the spark I am getting: https://youtu.be/uD0WS6WOkFY

wrote in
:

> On Monday, October 17, 2016 at 9:37:55 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
>> On Mon, 17 Oct 2016 06:20:51 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
>>
>> >I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the
>> >thi
> ng is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able
> to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make
> it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following:
> gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang
> on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing
> twice.
>> >
>> >I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a
>> >minut
> e holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not
> restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it
> would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to
> restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort
> yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded
> to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like
> it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never
> takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking,
> however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not
> start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't
> think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and
> reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
>> >
>> >As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle
>> >control
> wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get
> it started. The following were the results I obtained:
>> >1= 85psi
>> >2= almost 90 psi
>> >3= almost 90 psi
>> >4= almost 80 psi
>> >
>> >I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes
>> >one at
> a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container,
> the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings
> were obtained after the addition of oil:
>> >1= 120 psi
>> >2= 130 psi
>> >3= 105 psi
>> >4= 95 psi
>> >
>> > I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the
>> > carb t
> hroat.
>> >
>> >I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a
>> >leak.
>> >
>> >I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.
>>
>> Others have pointed some of these things out, but you need to check
>> timing, firing order, weak spark (someone mentioned reversed wiring
>> on the primary side of the coil). You also need to set the points
>> dwell, or properly set the gap. Spark testers are cheap, and will
>> tell you if the spark is weak, and to be honest, that's what it
>> really sounds like. Make sure you get the right tester (for points
>> ignition systems).
>>
>> I guess this is a 6 volt system. Turn the ignition on, and check the
>> voltage at both sides of the coil (with the points closed). One side
>> should read the full 6 volts, and the other should be no more than
>> about .2 V. If the ground side is too high, there is a bad ground, or
>> bad wiring through the distributor to ground. If the power side is
>> too low, there is resistance somewhere in the circuit. (Make sure the
>> battery is fully charged.) And as someone else said, that should be a
>> positive ground system. And again, make sure the wires are not
>> reversed on the coil.
>
> This has been converted to 12 volts. Here is a video last night of the
> spark I am getting: https://youtu.be/uD0WS6WOkFY

if its been converted to 12 volts it should not be postive ground any
more. probably why you have a weak spark. KB

On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 at 12:09:17 PM UTC-5, Kevin Bottorff wrote:
> wrote in
> :
>
> > On Monday, October 17, 2016 at 9:37:55 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> >> On Mon, 17 Oct 2016 06:20:51 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
> >>
> >> >I have been working on this thing off and on for over a year and the
> >> >thi
> > ng is still not running. I started into it last year hoping to be able
> > to use it as a plow for my driveway. I still can not start it. To make
> > it what I thought would be more reliable, I replaced the following:
> > gas tank, spark plug wires, spark plugs, distributor (I broke the tang
> > on my old one), coil, points, fuel bowel, etc. I checked the timing
> > twice.
> >> >
> >> >I rebuilt the carb and installed it this weekend. It started for a
> >> >minut
> > e holding the choke in but then backfired and died and could not
> > restart. (The few times I have gotten it to run in the last year it
> > would run for a minute then backfire violently and not be able to
> > restart). I bought a new carb from TSC as a last ditch effort
> > yesterday. Still no start. Using an old spark plug yesterday grounded
> > to the engine it does fire. If I crank on it long enough it acts like
> > it fires for a split second because the starter disengages but never
> > takes off. I can feel suction on the throat of the carb when cranking,
> > however, I am not so sure the spark plugs are getting gas. It will not
> > start when spraying starting fluid in the throat of the carb. I don't
> > think spraying starting fluid in one of the spark plug holes and
> > reinstalling the spark plug made a difference either.
> >> >
> >> >As a last ditch effort, I checked compression with the throttle
> >> >control
> > wide open and no choke. Of course the engine was cold as I can not get
> > it started. The following were the results I obtained:
> >> >1= 85psi
> >> >2= almost 90 psi
> >> >3= almost 90 psi
> >> >4= almost 80 psi
> >> >
> >> >I then added 5w30 (all I had) motor oil into the spark plug holes
> >> >one at
> > a time. I probably used too much as I poured from a quart container,
> > the space was tight, and it was getting dark. The following readings
> > were obtained after the addition of oil:
> >> >1= 120 psi
> >> >2= 130 psi
> >> >3= 105 psi
> >> >4= 95 psi
> >> >
> >> > I did notice after doing the wet test, oil was coming out of the
> >> > carb t
> > hroat.
> >> >
> >> >I replaced the intake exhaust gasket last year because it had a
> >> >leak.
> >> >
> >> >I am just so frustrated and not sure what to do at this point.
> >>
> >> Others have pointed some of these things out, but you need to check
> >> timing, firing order, weak spark (someone mentioned reversed wiring
> >> on the primary side of the coil). You also need to set the points
> >> dwell, or properly set the gap. Spark testers are cheap, and will
> >> tell you if the spark is weak, and to be honest, that's what it
> >> really sounds like. Make sure you get the right tester (for points
> >> ignition systems).
> >>
> >> I guess this is a 6 volt system. Turn the ignition on, and check the
> >> voltage at both sides of the coil (with the points closed). One side
> >> should read the full 6 volts, and the other should be no more than
> >> about .2 V. If the ground side is too high, there is a bad ground, or
> >> bad wiring through the distributor to ground. If the power side is
> >> too low, there is resistance somewhere in the circuit. (Make sure the
> >> battery is fully charged.) And as someone else said, that should be a
> >> positive ground system. And again, make sure the wires are not
> >> reversed on the coil.
> >
> > This has been converted to 12 volts. Here is a video last night of the
> > spark I am getting: https://youtu.be/uD0WS6WOkFY
>
> if its been converted to 12 volts it should not be postive ground any
> more. probably why you have a weak spark. KB

It is negative ground