Phew!

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 07:17:16 -0700, Scott en Aztl=E1n , said the following=
=20
in rec.autos.driving...=20

> Looks like gas prices are prepared to
> spike way WAY up from their already record highs.=20


Its doing more than that, Scott

http://tinyurl.com/a6dp4

--=20
Paul

Self-appointed unofficial overseer of kooks=20
and trolls in rec.autos.driving.=20

They love Spam:

In article >,
Scott en Aztlán <newsgroup> wrote:

>Fine by me. Gas prices have been so low for so long we've become
>completely and utterly spoiled. It's also made us dependent on
>imported oil, a situation that is extremely bad for us. A little dose
>of reality will only do this country good, and just maybe it will help
>spur the development of alternate sources of energy and help remove
>our national balls from the slimy grip of the oil sheiks.

Higher gas prices are good for the nation right now about like a
drenching thunderstorm would be good for New Orleans. It helps
nothing and only those slimy oil sheiks gain.

--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

In article >,
C. E. White > wrote:
>
>Problem is, at least until now, the Arab monarchies have had the ability to
>delay the development of alternate sources of petroleum (tar sands, shale
>oil, coal liquefaction) by opening the taps on their oil wells. If the US
>government wasn't run by the oil industry (at least the energy policy
>component of the government), we could have encouraged the development of
>these alternate energy sources in an orderly manner by selectively taxing
>imported oil.

Sure, we should have crippled our own economy and drawn down our
reserves of low-quality oil rather than burn all the cheap and easy
stuff the Arabs were selling. That would have been REAL smart.

--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 21:13:41 -0500,
(Matthew Russotto) wrote:

>>Fine by me. Gas prices have been so low for so long we've become
>>completely and utterly spoiled. It's also made us dependent on
>>imported oil, a situation that is extremely bad for us. A little dose
>>of reality will only do this country good, and just maybe it will help
>>spur the development of alternate sources of energy and help remove
>>our national balls from the slimy grip of the oil sheiks.
>
>Higher gas prices are good for the nation right now about like a
>drenching thunderstorm would be good for New Orleans.

Cheap gas for American drivers is like free Twinkies for the morbidly
obese or free cigarettes for addicted smokers. We need to CUT DOWN on
our consumption, not make it easier to binge.

In article >, C. E. White wrote:
> Problem is, at least until now, the Arab monarchies have had the ability to
> delay the development of alternate sources of petroleum

Well those days are long gone. The oil sands became profitable at US$40 a
bbl. It's now at US$70 bbl. The likelyhood of seeing US$40 again gets
smaller with each passing day. The profitability bet gets better and
better.

> imported oil. I have seen it estimated that the US has 62,000,000,000 metric
> tons of potential oil reserves in oil shale. Of course getting it out will
> be a problem.During the oil shocks of the 70's several companies invested
> heavily in developing techniques for extracting oil from shale, but these
> programs mostly atrophied in the face of low cost imported oil and
> environmental objections.

Yep. The saudis are well aware of this and it's why they've tried to keep
oil prices below the critical values where other sources become
profitable.

In article >,
Brent P > wrote:
>In article >, C. E. White wrote:
>> Problem is, at least until now, the Arab monarchies have had the ability to
>> delay the development of alternate sources of petroleum
>
>Well those days are long gone. The oil sands became profitable at US$40 a
>bbl. It's now at US$70 bbl. The likelyhood of seeing US$40 again gets
>smaller with each passing day. The profitability bet gets better and
>better.

Except that the oil sands are unlikely to be profitable even at
$70/barrel. These supposed alternatives are like a mirage in the
desert, always just on the horizon.

--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

In article >, Matthew Russotto wrote:

> Except that the oil sands are unlikely to be profitable even at
> $70/barrel. These supposed alternatives are like a mirage in the
> desert, always just on the horizon.

Read the article I cited. Profitable and already producing. The question
now is simply one building more infastructure to increase capacity.

They are expecting a large population increase in that area of Alberta.

In article >,
Brent P > wrote:
>In article >, Matthew Russotto wrote:
>
>> Except that the oil sands are unlikely to be profitable even at
>> $70/barrel. These supposed alternatives are like a mirage in the
>> desert, always just on the horizon.
>
>Read the article I cited. Profitable and already producing.

And I saw an article saying the same thing about the turkey-guts-to-oil
process that has now vanished without a trace.

I've been hearing about these supposed alternatives almost as long as
I've been alive; I won't believe in them until they're benchmarks on
a major commodities exchange.

(Cynical? Who, me?)
--
There's no such thing as a free lunch, but certain accounting practices can
result in a fully-depreciated one.

In article >, Matthew Russotto wrote:
> In article >,
> Brent P > wrote:
>>In article >, Matthew Russotto wrote:
>>
>>> Except that the oil sands are unlikely to be profitable even at
>>> $70/barrel. These supposed alternatives are like a mirage in the
>>> desert, always just on the horizon.
>>
>>Read the article I cited. Profitable and already producing.
>
> And I saw an article saying the same thing about the turkey-guts-to-oil
> process that has now vanished without a trace.

They are still there making oil. Changing world technologies. Google it.

> I've been hearing about these supposed alternatives almost as long as
> I've been alive; I won't believe in them until they're benchmarks on
> a major commodities exchange.

Again, the plant on the oil sands is up and running. producing 1 million
barrels a day.

"Already, one million barrels of petroleum a day are being spun out of
the
sand and pumped south, and that number is projected to triple within the
next decade. During that time, the oil sands will generate about 100,000
new jobs and billions of dollars in royalties and taxes to various levels
of government, not to mention billions more in dividends to investors.
But the significance of the oil sands beyond Canada's borders may be even
greater."

"Matthew Russotto" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> C. E. White > wrote:
> >
> >Problem is, at least until now, the Arab monarchies have had the ability
to
> >delay the development of alternate sources of petroleum (tar sands, shale
> >oil, coal liquefaction) by opening the taps on their oil wells. If the US
> >government wasn't run by the oil industry (at least the energy policy
> >component of the government), we could have encouraged the development of
> >these alternate energy sources in an orderly manner by selectively
taxing
> >imported oil.
>
> Sure, we should have crippled our own economy and drawn down our
> reserves of low-quality oil rather than burn all the cheap and easy
> stuff the Arabs were selling. That would have been REAL smart.

I guess you opinion prevails - we seem to be using a similar startegy when
it comes to building things - i.e. - "Why cripple our own economy and depend
on our reserves of low quality labor rather than take advantage of all the
cheap and hard working people the Chinese can supply."

A moderate, but escalating taw on imported oil could have been used to
encourage the development of US energy reserves while providing revenue to
the US government, If you are worried about such a tax crippling the US
economy, you could make it revenue neutral by reducing other taxes (i.e.,
the income tax on lower and middle class workers). Instead, the oil
companies that are tapped into cheap foriegn oil have worked to torpedo any
plan that might make there cheap oil less attactive.

Ed