94 Explorer EB A/C issue

Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
vehicle.
Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
meaning serious problem with the system.

I decided not to put any refrigerant in the system. I am now trying
to gather as much info as possible from the group as to what my
problem might be, etc.
I have used those recharge cans before on other vehicles and they are
in the ballpark as far as reading the status. (please do not point
out to me how inferior these cans are.)



Anyway I look forward to your help in my troubleshooting/solving
endeavor.

Thanks,

Sam in Raleigh

Sam wrote:
> Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
> fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
> the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
> vehicle.
> Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
> to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
> that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
> low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
> meaning serious problem with the system.
>

What does red mean- too much pressure? That would indicate some sort
of blockage, I should think. How that could happen on the low side of
the system beats me. Maybe it was overfilled in the past?
-Paul

Now... how can I avoid telling you how inferior these cans are yet tell you
how to reliably and effectively repair your system?

Your can "tells" you that there is a serious problem with your system....
Taking the can back for a refund and having the system repaired correctly is
a viable option.

In the shop, we use some simple tests to determine our course of action...
none of which include "topping off" the system. If the system is low there
is a leak. Without proper testing, there is no way to judge the severity.
There are other possible causes as well. Without the proper knowledge you
run the risk of adding more damage to the system as well as releasing
compounds into the atmosphere that could affect future generations.

For troubleshooting, I can only suggest that you gain a working knowledge of
the system before you attempt further repairs.

"Sam" > wrote in message
...
> Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
> fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
> the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
> vehicle.
> Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
> to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
> that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
> low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
> meaning serious problem with the system.
>
> I decided not to put any refrigerant in the system. I am now trying
> to gather as much info as possible from the group as to what my
> problem might be, etc.
> I have used those recharge cans before on other vehicles and they are
> in the ballpark as far as reading the status. (please do not point
> out to me how inferior these cans are.)
>
>
>
> Anyway I look forward to your help in my troubleshooting/solving
> endeavor.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Sam in Raleigh

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 04:54:28 GMT, "Jim Warman"
> wrote:

>Now... how can I avoid telling you how inferior these cans are yet tell you
>how to reliably and effectively repair your system?
>
>Your can "tells" you that there is a serious problem with your system....
>Taking the can back for a refund and having the system repaired correctly is
>a viable option.
>
>In the shop, we use some simple tests to determine our course of action...
>none of which include "topping off" the system. If the system is low there
>is a leak. Without proper testing, there is no way to judge the severity.
>There are other possible causes as well. Without the proper knowledge you
>run the risk of adding more damage to the system as well as releasing
>compounds into the atmosphere that could affect future generations.
>
>For troubleshooting, I can only suggest that you gain a working knowledge of
>the system before you attempt further repairs.
>

Look why did you reply to my post. How helpfull have you been? Are
you that person at work that finds something wrong with everything
that anyone does?

Proper testing as you say is something that is understood in the back
of my mind. I have spent thousands of dollars to pay someone such as
yourself. I merely figured that I could get some feedback from
people about what kinds of problems they have seen in the past with
the symptoms being High Pressure on the low side. That is it. Not a
lecture on how back yard mechanic my method is and what the correct
way to troubleshoot the problem is.

I am so glad you made me aware of my options and the possible problems
that I may encounter if I continue. I had no idea.......NOT.


Thank you but no thanks.


Sam in Raleigh.


To the others who posted a reply...THANK YOU.

Make sure that you are connected to the "low" side of the system. On
my 93 it is on the paassenger side, near the fuse box and has a blue
cap.
On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 15:39:32 -0400, Sam > wrote:

> Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
>fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
>the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
>vehicle.
>Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
>to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
>that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
>low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
>meaning serious problem with the system.
>
>I decided not to put any refrigerant in the system. I am now trying
>to gather as much info as possible from the group as to what my
>problem might be, etc.
>I have used those recharge cans before on other vehicles and they are
>in the ballpark as far as reading the status. (please do not point
>out to me how inferior these cans are.)
>
>
>
>Anyway I look forward to your help in my troubleshooting/solving
>endeavor.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Sam in Raleigh

Hey thanks. It is on the passenger side on my 94 also.
Thanks for the help!!
Sam in Raleigh

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 06:37:27 -0700, kc10 > wrote:

>Make sure that you are connected to the "low" side of the system. On
>my 93 it is on the paassenger side, near the fuse box and has a blue
>cap.
>On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 15:39:32 -0400, Sam > wrote:
>
>> Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
>>fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
>>the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
>>vehicle.
>>Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
>>to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
>>that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
>>low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
>>meaning serious problem with the system.
>>
>>I decided not to put any refrigerant in the system. I am now trying
>>to gather as much info as possible from the group as to what my
>>problem might be, etc.
>>I have used those recharge cans before on other vehicles and they are
>>in the ballpark as far as reading the status. (please do not point
>>out to me how inferior these cans are.)
>>
>>
>>
>>Anyway I look forward to your help in my troubleshooting/solving
>>endeavor.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Sam in Raleigh

On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 15:39:32 -0400, Sam > wrote:

> Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
>fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
>the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
>vehicle.
>Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
>to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
>that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
>low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
>meaning serious problem with the system.
>

Is it red showing high or red showing too low a pressure. When you
lose freon it can make the low side go lower and I suppose they could
show that as a low side red zone. If you feel the metal parts of the
hose assembly as each pipe comes out of the compressor the high side
should be hot and the low side should be relatively cool to cold. You
can also feel the pipes where they go into the evap case by the
firewall. The high pressure should be hot just before it gets to the
junction where the orifice tube is and on the other side of the
orifice tube it should be cold. If it's not pretty hot right on the
inlet side but seems relatively cool it could indicate a restriction
upstream in the high side. Don't recall if you can feel both sides on
the 94's, I know I can on my S-10. You can also feel the outlet pipe
from the evap and it should be roughly the same temp as the cold side
on the input side. My memory says that if it seems significantly
warmer in the outlet it's probably low on freon.

The other thing to look at is the amount of cycling the system is
doing. If all is well and you run the engine at 2000 rpm and it's a
moderate temperature day the clutch should cycle several times a
minute. If it's really hot it might not cycle at all unless you are
spraying water on the condenser. They cycle when the low side
pressure drops below around 24 psi and come back on when it goes up to
about 40 psi. The pressure is pretty close to the temp the evap core
is at. So you see if you average 24 and 40 you get right at 32
degrees. Just at the freezing point of water. If it gets low on
freon the pressures go low and on moderate temp days it can make the
core too cold and that's why cars with low freon charges may freeze up
on moderate temp fairly humid days.



>I decided not to put any refrigerant in the system. I am now trying
>to gather as much info as possible from the group as to what my
>problem might be, etc.
>I have used those recharge cans before on other vehicles and they are
>in the ballpark as far as reading the status. (please do not point
>out to me how inferior these cans are.)
>
>
>
>Anyway I look forward to your help in my troubleshooting/solving
>endeavor.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Sam in Raleigh

My reply was, by no means, a lecture... when I lecture someone, they
generally know they have been LECTURED.

My advice stands... gain a working knowledge of the system... if you want to
fix it, you HAVE to know how it works.

If you look back, you did not mention anything about "high pressure on the
low side"... this makes me bad??? If there is high pressure on the low side,
it is going to be nothing higher than static pressure. At this time it would
be real handy to know what the high side pressure is - but, since you appear
to be an expert. there is no need of this piffling information... I'm bad...
You don't mention if the clutch is engaging or not.... this also makes me
bad....

Your original post is almost totally bereft of the information that will
lead to a timely repair of your concern.... You are now in the realm of "it
COULD be this" or "it COULD be that". Enjoy...


"Sam" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 04:54:28 GMT, "Jim Warman"
> > wrote:
>
>>Now... how can I avoid telling you how inferior these cans are yet tell
>>you
>>how to reliably and effectively repair your system?
>>
>>Your can "tells" you that there is a serious problem with your system....
>>Taking the can back for a refund and having the system repaired correctly
>>is
>>a viable option.
>>
>>In the shop, we use some simple tests to determine our course of action...
>>none of which include "topping off" the system. If the system is low there
>>is a leak. Without proper testing, there is no way to judge the severity.
>>There are other possible causes as well. Without the proper knowledge you
>>run the risk of adding more damage to the system as well as releasing
>>compounds into the atmosphere that could affect future generations.
>>
>>For troubleshooting, I can only suggest that you gain a working knowledge
>>of
>>the system before you attempt further repairs.
>>
>
> Look why did you reply to my post. How helpfull have you been? Are
> you that person at work that finds something wrong with everything
> that anyone does?
>
> Proper testing as you say is something that is understood in the back
> of my mind. I have spent thousands of dollars to pay someone such as
> yourself. I merely figured that I could get some feedback from
> people about what kinds of problems they have seen in the past with
> the symptoms being High Pressure on the low side. That is it. Not a
> lecture on how back yard mechanic my method is and what the correct
> way to troubleshoot the problem is.
>
> I am so glad you made me aware of my options and the possible problems
> that I may encounter if I continue. I had no idea.......NOT.
>
>
> Thank you but no thanks.
>
>
> Sam in Raleigh.
>
>
> To the others who posted a reply...THANK YOU.
>

"Ashton Crusher" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 15:39:32 -0400, Sam > wrote:
>
> > Need help from the group. My vehicle A/C has been working
> >fine this summer. Over the last week or two I have noticed a rise in
> >the temperature the A/C outputs into the passenger compartment of my
> >vehicle.
> >Today I thought I would take a simple step and try to add refrigerant
> >to the system. I hooked up one of those handy all in one refill cans
> >that has a gauge with color code. I hooked up the cheap gauge to the
> >low side of the system and the initial indication is in the red
> >meaning serious problem with the system.
> >
>
> Is it red showing high or red showing too low a pressure. When you
> lose freon

Freon. Isn't this the key word here? Doesn't a '94 have R12 in it? Isn't
it really, really bad to put R232 or whatever it's called in a Freon system
without completely evacuating it first?

Are we sure we have the right stuff?


it can make the low side go lower and I suppose they could
> show that as a low side red zone. If you feel the metal parts of the
> hose assembly as each pipe comes out of the compressor the high side
> should be hot and the low side should be relatively cool to cold. You
> can also feel the pipes where they go into the evap case by the
> firewall. The high pressure should be hot just before it gets to the
> junction where the orifice tube is and on the other side of the
> orifice tube it should be cold. If it's not pretty hot right on the
> inlet side but seems relatively cool it could indicate a restriction
> upstream in the high side. Don't recall if you can feel both sides on
> the 94's, I know I can on my S-10. You can also feel the outlet pipe
> from the evap and it should be roughly the same temp as the cold side
> on the input side. My memory says that if it seems significantly
> warmer in the outlet it's probably low on freon.
>
> The other thing to look at is the amount of cycling the system is
> doing. If all is well and you run the engine at 2000 rpm and it's a
> moderate temperature day the clutch should cycle several times a
> minute. If it's really hot it might not cycle at all unless you are
> spraying water on the condenser. They cycle when the low side
> pressure drops below around 24 psi and come back on when it goes up to
> about 40 psi. The pressure is pretty close to the temp the evap core
> is at. So you see if you average 24 and 40 you get right at 32
> degrees. Just at the freezing point of water. If it gets low on
> freon the pressures go low and on moderate temp days it can make the
> core too cold and that's why cars with low freon charges may freeze up
> on moderate temp fairly humid days.
>
>
>
> >I decided not to put any refrigerant in the system. I am now trying
> >to gather as much info as possible from the group as to what my
> >problem might be, etc.
> >I have used those recharge cans before on other vehicles and they are
> >in the ballpark as far as reading the status. (please do not point
> >out to me how inferior these cans are.)
> >
> >
> >
> >Anyway I look forward to your help in my troubleshooting/solving
> >endeavor.
> >
> >Thanks,
> >
> >Sam in Raleigh

The 1993 model year was the last Explorer year to have R-12.

The 1994 should have R-134A.
"Ulysses" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Freon. Isn't this the key word here? Doesn't a '94 have R12 in it?
> Isn't
> it really, really bad to put R232 or whatever it's called in a Freon
> system
> without completely evacuating it first?
>
> Are we sure we have the right stuff?
>
>