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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
Hi there.
I have been looking at the new Honda Civic, it's pretty sweet, and the welds and everything are as nice as anything I have ever seen. I just have a question about the "Drive by wire" system that they are supposed to have. What happens if the Engine dies on you? In my current car, my timing chip went once and the engine went out. I had enough steering control left, even without power steering, to pull my car over before it came to a stop. If the drive by wire system has no "real" or active connection, how can it work if the engine or electronics quit on you? Are there any backups built into the system in case any of that stuff happens? And what if your battery dies and you need to push the car? Can you turn the steering wheel to adjust your wheels when you push the car? Much thanks, sorry to bother. David |
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#2
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
On 18 Nov 2005 08:31:35 -0800, "David E. Powell"
> wrote: >Hi there. > >I have been looking at the new Honda Civic, it's pretty sweet, and the >welds and everything are as nice as anything I have ever seen. I just >have a question about the "Drive by wire" system that they are supposed >to have. > >What happens if the Engine dies on you? In my current car, my timing >chip went once and the engine went out. I had enough steering control >left, even without power steering, to pull my car over before it came >to a stop. If the drive by wire system has no "real" or active >connection, how can it work if the engine or electronics quit on you? >Are there any backups built into the system in case any of that stuff >happens? And what if your battery dies and you need to push the car? >Can you turn the steering wheel to adjust your wheels when you push the >car? > >Much thanks, sorry to bother. > >David This concern has been answered eloquently by a contributor to these newsgroups a few years ago. Sorry I can't name the author, but that person hit the nail squarely on the head with these words: ".........more importantly than that, you've got to have the insight and wisdom to know when something has been developed to the point where further development amounts to pointless engineering masturbation. "The hydraulic brake system is a textbook model of development to perfection. So was the hydromechanical automatic transmission -- computerisation of the automatic transmission has taken away three-for-one in durability, dependability and cost of repair what little it has given us. We know how to make steering systems that work and essentially never give trouble. There is, therefore, no valid reason for steer-by-wire." |
#3
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
I have always gotten a laugh out of such a foolish system.
The way I understand it, basically if the power fails when you are at speed, you crash, just like on an airplane. I guess you could also put your head between your legs and kiss your ass good-bye like they do on planes too... ;-) Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page) "David E. Powell" wrote: > > Hi there. > > I have been looking at the new Honda Civic, it's pretty sweet, and the > welds and everything are as nice as anything I have ever seen. I just > have a question about the "Drive by wire" system that they are supposed > to have. > > What happens if the Engine dies on you? In my current car, my timing > chip went once and the engine went out. I had enough steering control > left, even without power steering, to pull my car over before it came > to a stop. If the drive by wire system has no "real" or active > connection, how can it work if the engine or electronics quit on you? > Are there any backups built into the system in case any of that stuff > happens? And what if your battery dies and you need to push the car? > Can you turn the steering wheel to adjust your wheels when you push the > car? > > Much thanks, sorry to bother. > > David |
#4
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
"the fly" > wrote
> This concern has been answered eloquently by a contributor to > these newsgroups a few years ago. Sorry I can't name the author, but > that person hit the nail squarely on the head with these words: > > ".........more importantly than that, you've got to have the > insight and wisdom to know when something has been developed to the > point where further development amounts to pointless engineering > masturbation. > > "The hydraulic brake system is a textbook model of development > to perfection. So was the hydromechanical automatic transmission -- Ya, so was the horse and buggy, the bicycle, etc. > computerisation of the automatic transmission has taken away > three-for-one in durability, dependability and cost of repair what > little it has given us. We know how to make steering systems that work > and essentially never give trouble. There is, therefore, no valid > reason for steer-by-wire." This reminds me of Bill Gates comment a few decades ago that no one should ever need more than 64k of RAM on his/her computer. What you quote is incredibly short-sighted. It demonstrates a lack of willingness to do any kind of investigation of why fly-by-wire was considered. In short, these are the words not of an engineer, scientist, or technical person but a ninny, and a ninny tired of having more demanded of him for his labors, at that. He's happy with the status quo. Others are not. He should get out of the business or certainly never enter it. |
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
Mike Romain wrote:
> > I have always gotten a laugh out of such a foolish system. > > The way I understand it, basically if the power fails when you are at > speed, you crash, just like on an airplane. I guess you could also put > your head between your legs and kiss your ass good-bye like they do on > planes too... ;-) > > Mike > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's > Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! > Aug./05 http://www.imagestation.com/album/in...?id=2120343242 > (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page) > Most of the fighter jets are fly-by-wire and they generally don't have problems with failures of this system. The fly-by-wire system is multiply redundant and rather expensive though. The main reason for it is the fact that it allows faster response and allows the computers to assist in stabilizing some inherently unstable aircraft designs. In the auto world drive-by-wire would be constrained by the price points and the multiple redundancy would probably be sacrificed. At auto speeds the faster response of by-wire technology is not needed, so the only possible reason to use the more expensive technology would be to allow the computer to try to compensate for a drivers lack of skill. Pete C. |
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
David E. Powell wrote:
> Hi there. > > I have been looking at the new Honda Civic, it's pretty sweet, and the > welds and everything are as nice as anything I have ever seen. I just > have a question about the "Drive by wire" system that they are supposed > to have. > > What happens if the Engine dies on you? In my current car, my timing > chip went once and the engine went out. I had enough steering control > left, even without power steering, to pull my car over before it came > to a stop. If the drive by wire system has no "real" or active > connection, how can it work if the engine or electronics quit on you? > Are there any backups built into the system in case any of that stuff > happens? And what if your battery dies and you need to push the car? > Can you turn the steering wheel to adjust your wheels when you push the > car? Only drive by wire tech I can find on the Honda is a Throttle System. I would hope that if there is a loss of power that the system supplies a small throttle input until you pull off the road and shut the car down??? |
#7
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
r2000swler wrote:
> Tuesday night we had some interesting weather. > > Real heavy lightening. > > A friend was comming back from Hazard on the Mt. Parkway and had a > nearby lightening strike. His engine car died and he was able to pull > offto the side safely. > > It wouldn't restart. The engine wouldn't even crank.The EMP from the > nearby lightning strike killed the ECM, igniton system, alternator > diodes and regulator, fuel pump and the fancy after market radio/sound > > system. It was a 2003 Civic. > > I don't want to think what would happen if it was a "die by wire" > system. > > Terry A friend of mine had a similar incident with her 2003 Hyundai Accent. Lightning struck the car and damaged the computer module and stereo I am skeptical of electronics in place of mechanicals for transmissions, throttle, etc. Electronics and software do not always equate into greater reliability. I am doing whatever I can to keep my '93 Accord going forever. At least my car is a mostly stripped down base model with a minimum of electronics. |
#8
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
In article > ,
High Tech Misfit > wrote: > I am skeptical of electronics in place of mechanicals for transmissions, > throttle, etc. Electronics and software do not always equate into greater > reliability. Which is why boats still have points. |
#9
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 17:15:19 GMT "Pete C." > wrote:
> so the only > possible reason to use the more expensive technology would be to allow > the computer to try to compensate for a drivers lack of skill. That would fit in this day-n-age of soccer-moms-driving-SUVs-with-a-phone-stuck-on-their-ear. -- remove MYSHOES to email |
#10
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Honda "Drive by Wire" question... what if the power goes out?
David E. Powell wrote:
> Hi there. > > I have been looking at the new Honda Civic, it's pretty sweet, and the > welds and everything are as nice as anything I have ever seen. I just > have a question about the "Drive by wire" system that they are > supposed to have. > > What happens if the Engine dies on you? In my current car, my timing > chip went once and the engine went out. I had enough steering control > left, even without power steering, to pull my car over before it came > to a stop. If the drive by wire system has no "real" or active > connection, how can it work if the engine or electronics quit on you? > Are there any backups built into the system in case any of that stuff > happens? And what if your battery dies and you need to push the car? > Can you turn the steering wheel to adjust your wheels when you push > the car? > The "drive by wire" refers to throttle butterfly control, not the steering. The usual connection between throttle and accelerator pedal is accomplished with a cable firmly affixed between the two. In the new "drive by wire" setup, the computer determines how to operate the throttle butterfly depending on several factors, only one of which is your foot. If your car dies, it will feel no different from what you're used to. Luckily, the steering still consists of solid metal connections. |
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