A New Category of Sloth

Arif Khokar wrote:
> gpsman wrote:
>
> > No, everyone is NOT speeding, at *anytime* of day, *anywhere* in the
> > country.
>
> I have a speed survey conducted by the WVDOT on I-64/I-77 through
> Charleston WV in late 1997. It states that 0% are going below 50 mph,
> 23% are going below 55 mph, 73 percent are going below 60 and 85 percent
> are going below 62 mph.
>
> The posted limit at the time was 50 mph.
-----

And your point is... that you are well versed in the art of
misinterpreting statistics?

0% does not imply the number zero, it's proportional.
-----

- gpsman

"gpsman" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Arif Khokar wrote:
>> gpsman wrote:
>>
>> > No, everyone is NOT speeding, at *anytime* of day, *anywhere* in the
>> > country.
>>
>> I have a speed survey conducted by the WVDOT on I-64/I-77 through
>> Charleston WV in late 1997. It states that 0% are going below 50 mph,
>> 23% are going below 55 mph, 73 percent are going below 60 and 85 percent
>> are going below 62 mph.
>>
>> The posted limit at the time was 50 mph.
> -----
>
> And your point is... that you are well versed in the art of
> misinterpreting statistics?

give it up, gpsman. You are trying to convince everybody that the sky is
yellow. In your head it is, but everybody else lives in the real
orld. -Dave

Mike T. wrote:

> give it up, gpsman. You are trying to convince everybody that the sky is
> yellow. In your head it is, but everybody else lives in the real
> orld. -Dave
-----
Perhaps... but I like arguing with people who rationalize their
behavior a'cause it's easy pickin's? I mean, duh? It's ok if I break
the law... because... I don't agree with it, it's "supposed" to be
different, the majority of others do, the law is wrong, it's perfectly
safe, most people don't crash, etc.? Sloths are the major problem with
traffic and have no right to drive because... I don't like it, it's
dangerous, they're MFFY's, they slow traffic, they're a minority (!),
blah-blahblah-blahblah'blahblah....

It's like shooting fish in a barrel and the fish are bailing with
everything they got! It's fun.
-----

- gpsman

"One with the law is a majority."- Calvin Coolidge

"That the desires of the majority of the people are often for injustice
and inhumanity against the minority, is demonstrated by every page of
the history of the whole world"- John Adams

(Brent P) wrote in
:

> In article >, DYM wrote:
>> (Brent P) wrote in
>
>>> According to what you wrote, you won't stand up and defend your
>>> right of way, you'll let them have it.
>
>> And you're just going to slam into the idiot that "thinks" they have
>> the right of way when you know you do?
>
> You don't seem to understand that the other person is looking for
> someone he can push around. Just showing you can't be pushed causes
> them to back down.
And when the other driver doesn't back down. You get that race to the
tollbooth picture that was posted not long ago.

Is it really worth risking a crash to prove you're the Alpha Male?

>
>> Yeah, the other driver will get the
>> ticket and pay for the damages. But when gpsman or I go into a Safety
>> Review Meeting we have to show that the collision was unavoidable.
>> Was there anyhting we could have done to not collid with that other
>> vehicle. Yeah, don't assume the other driver is going to yield. Make
>> sure they are yielding. (Don't trust the yahoo four-wheeler when he
>> says you can fit in that parking lot, no problem. But that's another
>> scenario.)
>
> I could make a nearly endless list of the moves I've seen by truckers
> throwing the weight of their vehicle around as a tool of intimidation
> or just plain MFFY behaviors.

I'm on the road 8-9 hours per day. The VAST majority of bonehead moves
are executed by four-wheelers. When I encounter a big truck, 9 times out
of ten I can predict exactly what he is going to do. Are there bad truck
drivers out there, yeah (most driving for BFI, most just steering wheel
holders). But there are far fewer good drivers of POVs.

Go look at the crash stats and tell me what class of driver is the best
and which are the worst. It comes out that school bus drivers are the
safest drivers around, it's not even close. Then come the other CDL
holders. For 2004, school buses had 0.01 passenger deaths per 100,000,000
miles, passenger cars 0.94. In that year over 37,000 fatalities to
occupants of motor vehicles as a whole. Of those, 5 where on school
buses.

I don't care how many racing schools you've attended, it doesn't teach
you to drive safely in traffic. A non-CDL holder just isn't held up to
the scrutiny of a CDL driver. Unless you are a professional driver, you
just don't get it. You don't understand what it is to have safety as your
number one concern, always. Being safe enough isn't good enough. If you
are concerned with how much time you're wasting in traffic, your mind is
not on safety. If you are ****ed off at the idiot that just cut you off,
your mind is not on safety. If you are trying to get ahead of the LLB,
your mind is not on safety. You've just put in a 12 hour day and all you
want to do is get home and get some food, your mind is not on safety.

>
>
>>> I can do a track stand, but not for minutes at a time.
>
>> Maybe put the training wheels back on?
>
> Let's see you do better.
>
Don't have a bicycle. But I'm still a safer driver than you.

Doug

DYM wrote:

> Go look at the crash stats and tell me what class of driver is the best
> and which are the worst. It comes out that school bus drivers are the
> safest drivers around, it's not even close. Then come the other CDL
> holders. For 2004, school buses had 0.01 passenger deaths per 100,000,000
> miles, passenger cars 0.94.

Do you happen to have stats (or know of a place that details them) that
detail the actual crash stats per 100 million miles (rather than
passenger deaths) for school buses and commercial vehicles?

Around 12/13/2005 2:04 PM, gpsman wrote:

> Mike T. wrote:
>
>
>>give it up, gpsman. You are trying to convince everybody that the sky is
>>yellow. In your head it is, but everybody else lives in the real
>>orld. -Dave
>
> It's like shooting fish in a barrel and the fish are bailing with
> everything they got! It's fun.

You actually /enjoy/ being the fish?? Weird.


--
~/Garth |"I believe that it is better to tell the truth than a lie.
Almgren | I believe it is better to be free than to be a slave.
******* | And I believe it is better to know than to be ignorant."
for secure mail info) --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956)

On 13 Dec 2005 10:12:13 -0800, "Motorhead Lawyer" > wrote:

>Dave Head wrote:
>>
>> Isn't it fun having a high performance car, tho? These guys that deliberately
>> drive slowly just to **** other people off get their asses passed before they
>> know what happened. Since I got my Subaru WRX, I can pass in much shorter
>> distances, when people have decided its OK to start slowing down because
>> there's a no passing zone soon and "He couldn't possibly pass me before the no
>> passing zone" and then I do it. And it doesn't much matter if they try to
>> speed up to keep me from passing them, because I then do it anyway. Having a
>> power to weight ratio as high as this one is, is a truly enjoyable thing.
>
>So you can imagine how much fun I have with a Jaguar 3.0 X-Type putting
>out the same amount of power through the same number of driven wheels
>as a WRX only *without* a turbo (Can you say, "no lag"? I knew you
>could.). Weight is only about 100 pounds more, so you need to be
>careful who you mess with. ;^) Some clown in an old Probe found that
>out last night while trying to 'stop light race' the Jag. All it took
>was first gear ...

Awesome!

>> Ding-dong last night turned onto the same sideroad I did, so proceeded to do 20
>> mph. Then turned onto a higher speed limit road, and proceeded to continue to
>> drive _way_ below the speed limit. The passing zone there is short, so he
>> expected that he could continue to hold me up some more. Lasted about 3
>> seconds. When I got done with the pass, of course he sped up - he had no one
>> to screw with once I wasn't behind him.
>
>Hostess® products just shouldn't be allowed to drive. =8^D

Yep!

DPH

In article .com>, gpsman wrote:

> No, everyone is NOT speeding, at *anytime* of day, *anywhere* in the
> country.

Spoken like a man who has never seen a 45mph speed limit on an interstate
that was not under construction or a 25mph speed limit sign on a major
arterial where there were no cross streets because of construction but
all lanes were open. (and a non-construction flow speed of 60mph)

> That assertion is so obviously exagerration that it detracts
> from the validity of damn near everything else you may post.

I'll gladly drive you around the chicago area at the speed limit. You can
count how many vehicles we pass. It will be a less than demanding job
though, you might get to one.

> Congratulations on your brief experience driving the speed limit. It
> wasn't that hard, was it?

I find it very difficult to drive the speed limit. It's very dangerous to
merge, change lanes, and do just about any move other than stay planted
where ever you happen to be if it is at all possible. It's also a
condition where one ends up watching the rear view mirror more than where
he is going, because the odds of running into something are comparitively
small compared to something running into you.

> I've driven at or about the limit since
> about 1980, from coast to coast and border to border and I haven't
> experienced any of your problems.

translation: since 1980 means before 1985, when speeds were much lower,
vehicles a lot crappier, the NMSL was still enforced heavily, and still
nearly everyone violated the posted speed limit and there was
considerably less traffic.

http://www.dot.state.az.us/ROADS/traffic/speed.htm
http://www.sha.state.md.us/safety/oo...eedlimits2.asp
http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/biz/traffico...ffic/rules.htm
http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/biz/traffico...fic/limits.htm
http://www.tfhrc.gov/safety/speed/speed.htm
http://www.ibiblio.org/rdu/sl-irrel.html
http://www.sense.bc.ca/research.htm
http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...ticleID=517195
http://channels.netscape.com/ns/auto.../speed_skills1

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov//////tfhrc/s...mages/fig1.gif
http://www.sha.state.md.us/images/85thchart.gif

http://www.americanautobahn.com/americanautobahng1.jpg
http://www.americanautobahn.com/americanautobahng2.jpg

http://www.wvdot.com/engineering/Man...shDataBook.pdf

Cirillo, J.A., Interstate System Accident Research Study II Interim
Report II. Public Roads, Vol 35, No 3, August 1969, pp. 71-75.
Federal Highway Administration. Synthesis of Speed Zoning Practice.
Report No. FHwA/RD-85/096. Washington, D.C. July 1985.
Federal Highway Administration. Traffic Speed Trends. Washington, D.C.
1969-1975.
Solomon, D., Accidents on Main Rural Highways Related to Speed, Driver,
and Vehicle. Bureau of Public Roads (precursor to FHwA). July 1964.
Federal Highway Administration. Effects of Raising and Lowering Speed
Limits. Report No. FHwA/RD-92/084. McLean, VA. June 1996.
Tignor, Samuel C. and Warren, Davey. Driver Speed Behavior on U.S.
Streets and Highways. Institute of Transportation Engineers, 1990
Compendium of Technical Papers. Orlando, FL August, 1990.
David L. Harkey, et. al., "Assessment of Current Speed Zoning
Criteria," Transportation Research Record, no. 1281, 1990.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/06/23/dan...ads/index.html

http://www.civ.utoronto.ca/sect/trae...mits-study.pdf
http://www.canadiandriver.com/articl...peedlimits.htm
http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/mapsdata/tdo...l%20Yr%202002%
20Speed%20Report.pdf

http://www.scienceservingsociety.com/ts/text/ch15.htm

In article >, DYM wrote:
> (Brent P) wrote in
> :
>
>> In article >, DYM wrote:
>>> (Brent P) wrote in
>>
>>>> According to what you wrote, you won't stand up and defend your
>>>> right of way, you'll let them have it.
>>
>>> And you're just going to slam into the idiot that "thinks" they have
>>> the right of way when you know you do?
>>
>> You don't seem to understand that the other person is looking for
>> someone he can push around. Just showing you can't be pushed causes
>> them to back down.

> And when the other driver doesn't back down. You get that race to the
> tollbooth picture that was posted not long ago.
> Is it really worth risking a crash to prove you're the Alpha Male?

It has zero to do with "Alpha Male".

Where has 'just let them do it' gotten us? A road system where anything
goes and rude selfish drivers have a huge sense of entitlement. I won't
honor that sense of entitlement and I simply refused to be pushed around.

>>> Yeah, the other driver will get the
>>> ticket and pay for the damages. But when gpsman or I go into a Safety
>>> Review Meeting we have to show that the collision was unavoidable.
>>> Was there anyhting we could have done to not collid with that other
>>> vehicle. Yeah, don't assume the other driver is going to yield. Make
>>> sure they are yielding. (Don't trust the yahoo four-wheeler when he
>>> says you can fit in that parking lot, no problem. But that's another
>>> scenario.)

>> I could make a nearly endless list of the moves I've seen by truckers
>> throwing the weight of their vehicle around as a tool of intimidation
>> or just plain MFFY behaviors.

> I'm on the road 8-9 hours per day. The VAST majority of bonehead moves
> are executed by four-wheelers.

Wooptie do. Doesn't change the two-trailer semi that cut me off and then
was later 3 feet off my rear bumper a few weeks ago. Or any of the other
things I see arsehole truckers do with their rigs because they can use
size to make people back down.

You might as well bring in some other irrelevant stat like the number
ufos landing on interstates.

On 13 Dec 2005 10:12:13 -0800, "Motorhead Lawyer" >
wrote:

>Dave Head wrote:

>> Ding-dong last night turned onto the same sideroad I did, so proceeded to do 20
>> mph. Then turned onto a higher speed limit road, and proceeded to continue to
>> drive _way_ below the speed limit. The passing zone there is short, so he
>> expected that he could continue to hold me up some more. Lasted about 3
>> seconds. When I got done with the pass, of course he sped up - he had no one
>> to screw with once I wasn't behind him.
>
>Hostess® products just shouldn't be allowed to drive. =8^D

This also proves my point about Sloth and MFFY going hand-in-hand. The
guys with the fast cars just want to escape from the MFFY Sloths who
are trying to block their passage.