Rip-off?

Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.

That service is:

Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.

Replace fuel filter, air filter

Change ATF

So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. Gee I
wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.

Harry K

On Oct 9, 2:45*pm, Harry K > wrote:
> Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>
> That service is:
>
> Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
> and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
> line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>
> Replace fuel filter, air filter
>
> Change ATF
>
> So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
> change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. *Gee I
> wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>
> Harry K

if it takes 2-3 hours, that is probably covering their labor

inflation is a cast iron female dog, I don't know how anyone can
afford to do anything service related for less than $100/hr (good
incentive to DIY)

nate

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
> wrote:

>Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>
>That service is:
>
>Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
>and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
>line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>
>Replace fuel filter, air filter
>
>Change ATF
>
>So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
>change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. Gee I
>wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>
>Harry K

Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. But unless
you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
ATF, just checking the level. And if there's been no sign of it
leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. All you
should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. Wouldn't hurt to
check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. But
if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
calipers for $400.

On Oct 9, 4:55*pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>
>
>
>
>
> > wrote:
> >Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>
> >That service is:
>
> >Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
> >and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
> >line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>
> >Replace fuel filter, air filter
>
> >Change ATF
>
> >So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
> >change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. *Gee I
> >wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>
> >Harry K
>
> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. *But unless
> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
> ATF, just checking the level. *And if there's been no sign of it
> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. *All you
> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. *Wouldn't hurt to
> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. *But
> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
> calipers for $400. *- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

That is about my take on it. The letter lists the same service items
plus several more at 45k. Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? I
think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. I think I will
take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.

As to taking a couple of hours? I don't see anything there that would
take that long. I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
bad. Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.

Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
routine lube/oil job.

Harry K

On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:18:49 -0700 (PDT), harry k
> wrote:

>On Oct 9, 4:55*pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > wrote:
>> >Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>>
>> >That service is:
>>
>> >Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
>> >and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
>> >line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>>
>> >Replace fuel filter, air filter
>>
>> >Change ATF
>>
>> >So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
>> >change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. *Gee I
>> >wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>>
>> >Harry K
>>
>> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. *But unless
>> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
>> ATF, just checking the level. *And if there's been no sign of it
>> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. *All you
>> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
>> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. *Wouldn't hurt to
>> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. *But
>> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
>> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
>> calipers for $400. *- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>That is about my take on it. The letter lists the same service items
>plus several more at 45k. Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? I
>think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. I think I will
>take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.
>
>As to taking a couple of hours? I don't see anything there that would
>take that long. I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
>bad. Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
>run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.
>
>Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
>routine lube/oil job.
>
>Harry K


Most shops have "service schedules" that go WAY beyond what is called
for in the owners manual. And most owners manuals have two service
schedules, one for "normal" use and one for "severe service". They
will tell about 90% of the people that their use constitutes severe
service. So "normal" is only 10%!!! Defies the definition of normal.
When the transmission went out on my 80 Pontiac at 25K they tried to
tell me that it wasn't covered because I didn't change the fluid at
15K like the sign they had posted on the wall said I should. A trip
thru the owners manual convinced them that they were going to pay for
it.

Ashton Crusher wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:18:49 -0700 (PDT), harry k
> > wrote:
>
>> On Oct 9, 4:55 pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
>>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > wrote:
>>>> Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>>>> That service is:
>>>> Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
>>>> and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
>>>> line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>>>> Replace fuel filter, air filter
>>>> Change ATF
>>>> So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
>>>> change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. Gee I
>>>> wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>>>> Harry K
>>> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. But unless
>>> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
>>> ATF, just checking the level. And if there's been no sign of it
>>> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. All you
>>> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
>>> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. Wouldn't hurt to
>>> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. But
>>> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
>>> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
>>> calipers for $400. - Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>> That is about my take on it. The letter lists the same service items
>> plus several more at 45k. Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? I
>> think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. I think I will
>> take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.
>>
>> As to taking a couple of hours? I don't see anything there that would
>> take that long. I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
>> bad. Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
>> run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.
>>
>> Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
>> routine lube/oil job.
>>
>> Harry K
>
>
> Most shops have "service schedules" that go WAY beyond what is called
> for in the owners manual. And most owners manuals have two service
> schedules, one for "normal" use and one for "severe service". They
> will tell about 90% of the people that their use constitutes severe
> service. So "normal" is only 10%!!! Defies the definition of normal.
> When the transmission went out on my 80 Pontiac at 25K they tried to
> tell me that it wasn't covered because I didn't change the fluid at
> 15K like the sign they had posted on the wall said I should. A trip
> thru the owners manual convinced them that they were going to pay for
> it.

15K shouldn't be necessary, but I agree with the statement that pretty
much everyone should be using the "severe service" maintenance schedule.
50K seems to be a common "severe service" interval for trans fluid
change.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

On Oct 11, 5:47*am, Nate Nagel > wrote:
> Ashton Crusher wrote:
> > On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:18:49 -0700 (PDT), harry k
> > > wrote:
>
> >> On Oct 9, 4:55 pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
> >>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>
> >>> > wrote:
> >>>> Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
> >>>> That service is:
> >>>> Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
> >>>> and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
> >>>> line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
> >>>> Replace fuel filter, air filter
> >>>> Change ATF
> >>>> So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
> >>>> change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. *Gee I
> >>>> wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
> >>>> Harry K
> >>> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. *But unless
> >>> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
> >>> ATF, just checking the level. *And if there's been no sign of it
> >>> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. *All you
> >>> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
> >>> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. *Wouldn't hurt to
> >>> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. *But
> >>> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
> >>> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
> >>> calipers for $400. *- Hide quoted text -
>
> >>> - Show quoted text -
> >> That is about my take on it. *The letter lists the same service items
> >> plus several more at 45k. *Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? *I
> >> think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. *I think I will
> >> take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.
>
> >> As to taking a couple of hours? *I don't see anything there that would
> >> take that long. *I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
> >> bad. *Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
> >> run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.
>
> >> Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
> >> routine lube/oil job.
>
> >> Harry K
>
> > Most shops have "service schedules" that go WAY beyond what is called
> > for in the owners manual. *And most owners manuals have two service
> > schedules, one for "normal" use and one for "severe service". *They
> > will tell about 90% of the people that their use constitutes severe
> > service. *So "normal" is only 10%!!! *Defies the definition of normal.
> > When the transmission went out on my 80 Pontiac at 25K they tried to
> > tell me that it wasn't covered because I didn't change the fluid at
> > 15K like the sign they had posted on the wall said I should. *A trip
> > thru the owners manual convinced them that they were going to pay for
> > it.
>
> 15K shouldn't be necessary, but I agree with the statement that pretty
> much everyone should be using the "severe service" maintenance schedule.
> * *50K seems to be a common "severe service" interval for trans fluid
> change.
>
> nate
>
> --
> replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

In my case, 'severe service' is called for. I live righton a busy 2
lane highway and have an uphill go for a mile as I leave the
driveway. All too often I have to get from 0 to 65 on a cold engine
in a quarter mile to fit into the stream. I do usually give a a
minute or so warmup first but even that doesn't help much.

Harry K

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:47:20 -0400, Nate Nagel >
wrote:

>Ashton Crusher wrote:
>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:18:49 -0700 (PDT), harry k
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Oct 9, 4:55 pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>> Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>>>>> That service is:
>>>>> Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
>>>>> and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
>>>>> line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>>>>> Replace fuel filter, air filter
>>>>> Change ATF
>>>>> So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
>>>>> change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. Gee I
>>>>> wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>>>>> Harry K
>>>> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. But unless
>>>> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
>>>> ATF, just checking the level. And if there's been no sign of it
>>>> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. All you
>>>> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
>>>> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. Wouldn't hurt to
>>>> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. But
>>>> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
>>>> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
>>>> calipers for $400. - Hide quoted text -
>>>>
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>> That is about my take on it. The letter lists the same service items
>>> plus several more at 45k. Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? I
>>> think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. I think I will
>>> take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.
>>>
>>> As to taking a couple of hours? I don't see anything there that would
>>> take that long. I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
>>> bad. Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
>>> run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.
>>>
>>> Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
>>> routine lube/oil job.
>>>
>>> Harry K
>>
>>
>> Most shops have "service schedules" that go WAY beyond what is called
>> for in the owners manual. And most owners manuals have two service
>> schedules, one for "normal" use and one for "severe service". They
>> will tell about 90% of the people that their use constitutes severe
>> service. So "normal" is only 10%!!! Defies the definition of normal.
>> When the transmission went out on my 80 Pontiac at 25K they tried to
>> tell me that it wasn't covered because I didn't change the fluid at
>> 15K like the sign they had posted on the wall said I should. A trip
>> thru the owners manual convinced them that they were going to pay for
>> it.
>
>15K shouldn't be necessary, but I agree with the statement that pretty
>much everyone should be using the "severe service" maintenance schedule.
> 50K seems to be a common "severe service" interval for trans fluid
>change.
>
>nate


Do you really think a car used as a taxi needs it's oil changed every
3000 miles??? Maybe in 1958 but not in 2009.

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 07:24:05 -0700 (PDT), harry k
> wrote:

>On Oct 11, 5:47*am, Nate Nagel > wrote:
>> Ashton Crusher wrote:
>> > On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:18:49 -0700 (PDT), harry k
>> > > wrote:
>>
>> >> On Oct 9, 4:55 pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
>> >>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>>
>> >>> > wrote:
>> >>>> Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>> >>>> That service is:
>> >>>> Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
>> >>>> and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
>> >>>> line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>> >>>> Replace fuel filter, air filter
>> >>>> Change ATF
>> >>>> So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
>> >>>> change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. *Gee I
>> >>>> wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>> >>>> Harry K
>> >>> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. *But unless
>> >>> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
>> >>> ATF, just checking the level. *And if there's been no sign of it
>> >>> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. *All you
>> >>> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
>> >>> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. *Wouldn't hurt to
>> >>> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. *But
>> >>> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
>> >>> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
>> >>> calipers for $400. *- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >>> - Show quoted text -
>> >> That is about my take on it. *The letter lists the same service items
>> >> plus several more at 45k. *Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? *I
>> >> think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. *I think I will
>> >> take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.
>>
>> >> As to taking a couple of hours? *I don't see anything there that would
>> >> take that long. *I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
>> >> bad. *Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
>> >> run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.
>>
>> >> Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
>> >> routine lube/oil job.
>>
>> >> Harry K
>>
>> > Most shops have "service schedules" that go WAY beyond what is called
>> > for in the owners manual. *And most owners manuals have two service
>> > schedules, one for "normal" use and one for "severe service". *They
>> > will tell about 90% of the people that their use constitutes severe
>> > service. *So "normal" is only 10%!!! *Defies the definition of normal.
>> > When the transmission went out on my 80 Pontiac at 25K they tried to
>> > tell me that it wasn't covered because I didn't change the fluid at
>> > 15K like the sign they had posted on the wall said I should. *A trip
>> > thru the owners manual convinced them that they were going to pay for
>> > it.
>>
>> 15K shouldn't be necessary, but I agree with the statement that pretty
>> much everyone should be using the "severe service" maintenance schedule.
>> * *50K seems to be a common "severe service" interval for trans fluid
>> change.
>>
>> nate
>>
>> --
>> replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>In my case, 'severe service' is called for. I live righton a busy 2
>lane highway and have an uphill go for a mile as I leave the
>driveway. All too often I have to get from 0 to 65 on a cold engine
>in a quarter mile to fit into the stream. I do usually give a a
>minute or so warmup first but even that doesn't help much.
>
>Harry K


How will changing the oil more frequently help that situation? The
new oil will still be just as cold.

Ashton Crusher wrote:
> On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:47:20 -0400, Nate Nagel >
> wrote:
>
>> Ashton Crusher wrote:
>>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 20:18:49 -0700 (PDT), harry k
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Oct 9, 4:55 pm, Ashton Crusher > wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 9 Oct 2009 11:45:44 -0700 (PDT), Harry K
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>> Just got a letter sayign I need a 30,000 service on the Ford 500.
>>>>>> That service is:
>>>>>> Inspect, ATF level;brake pads,lines,hoses,etc; engine cooling sytem
>>>>>> and hoses; inspect and lubricate all non-sealed steering and drive
>>>>>> line items (ball joints, etc);inspect exhaust system.
>>>>>> Replace fuel filter, air filter
>>>>>> Change ATF
>>>>>> So for a quick look at a bunch of things and lube a few joints plus
>>>>>> change the ATF, fuel and air filters they want $500 plus. Gee I
>>>>>> wonder just how many parts they will find that need replacing.
>>>>>> Harry K
>>>>> Sounds like about a $150 worth of work including parts. But unless
>>>>> you are using your car for a Taxi it wouldn't include replacing teh
>>>>> ATF, just checking the level. And if there's been no sign of it
>>>>> leaking there is no reason the level would not be right. All you
>>>>> should need, under the normal service schedule, at 30K is a change of
>>>>> air filter and a lube and oil change and filter. Wouldn't hurt to
>>>>> check the front brakes for wear. That might add $35 to the bill. But
>>>>> if they are slightly under half worn you can be sure they will try to
>>>>> sell you new pads, machine the rotors and possible rebuild the
>>>>> calipers for $400. - Hide quoted text -
>>>>>
>>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>>> That is about my take on it. The letter lists the same service items
>>>> plus several more at 45k. Gee, ATF needs replacing every 15k? I
>>>> think I will pass on the 30K, have it doen at 45K. I think I will
>>>> take that list to my independant and have him bid on the same work.
>>>>
>>>> As to taking a couple of hours? I don't see anything there that would
>>>> take that long. I haven't replaced ATF before but it can't be that
>>>> bad. Inspecting all those parts using a magnifying glass shouldn't
>>>> run over an hour and can be done while the fluids are draining.
>>>>
>>>> Sounds like if things get much worse one will have to finance a
>>>> routine lube/oil job.
>>>>
>>>> Harry K
>>>
>>> Most shops have "service schedules" that go WAY beyond what is called
>>> for in the owners manual. And most owners manuals have two service
>>> schedules, one for "normal" use and one for "severe service". They
>>> will tell about 90% of the people that their use constitutes severe
>>> service. So "normal" is only 10%!!! Defies the definition of normal.
>>> When the transmission went out on my 80 Pontiac at 25K they tried to
>>> tell me that it wasn't covered because I didn't change the fluid at
>>> 15K like the sign they had posted on the wall said I should. A trip
>>> thru the owners manual convinced them that they were going to pay for
>>> it.
>> 15K shouldn't be necessary, but I agree with the statement that pretty
>> much everyone should be using the "severe service" maintenance schedule.
>> 50K seems to be a common "severe service" interval for trans fluid
>> change.
>>
>> nate
>
>
> Do you really think a car used as a taxi needs it's oil changed every
> 3000 miles??? Maybe in 1958 but not in 2009.

Read the owner's manual for your new car, they don't recommend 3000 mile
oil changes even for "severe service." And taxi service is likely
easier on a car than the way most people drive. Read the qualifications
for "severe service," you probably qualify.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel