147 & other Alfa owners

In article >,
says...
> if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting them
> over here!
>
Thing is.
I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
thirsty and expensive to maintain.

I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last owner
totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.

The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives great,
and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.
--
Carl Robson
Car PC Build starts again. http://smallr.com/rz
Homepage: http://www.bouncing-czechs.com

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:22:38 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:

> In article >,
> says...
>> Unless you're really strapped for cash, though, I would stay away from ANY
>> Diesel! I don't think there is a company out there that has their sh!t
>> together on Diesles!
>>
> Europe is a totally different ball game for oil burners.
> They are the biggest sellers in the non-luxury large car markets, making
> grounds in the luxury large car markets, and the medium family car
> markets.
> Even some of the "Hot Hatch" small hatch back models by
> VW/Seat/Skoda/Audi have the best performance model being a turbo diesel.
>
> With petrol in europe being so expensive, performance diesels are just
> as popular because of the better fuel consumption. Oh and some of them
> "run fine" of Veg oils and bio diesel fuels.

Yeah, I know diesels are a lot more popular in Yurrip, but our experience
over here is that, unless you're running a Kenworth or something with a
Cummins in it, stay away.

The exception being the Rabbit ('75-82 Golf) diesels, esp the little
trucklet they made. Those seem to run forever with about the same
maintenance one would put into a Corolla...sometimes, that is. I've seen
them with a half a mil on them!

Thanks, Skoda-Sleeker-NeedFor...

I guess the meatballs are ON, eh?

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:26:09 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:

> In article >,
> says...
>> if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting them
>> over here!
>>
> Thing is.
> I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
> thirsty and expensive to maintain.
>
> I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
> about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last owner
> totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.
>
> The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
> convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives great,
> and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.

Saabs, and most Euro cars over here, seem to be a 50/50 proposition for
some reason.

The most you ever see a Euro car over here is sitting outside the repair
center...

Even the Big Boys, M-B and BMW spend more time on the lift than on the
road.

BTW, I saw a NICE, REALLY NICE 2002 yesterday. Some young lady owns it,
says it's her second.

i am trusting she will park it before the first snowflakes...

In article >,
says...
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:22:38 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>
> > In article >,
> > says...
> >> Unless you're really strapped for cash, though, I would stay away from ANY
> >> Diesel! I don't think there is a company out there that has their sh!t
> >> together on Diesles!
> >>
> > Europe is a totally different ball game for oil burners.
> > They are the biggest sellers in the non-luxury large car markets, making
> > grounds in the luxury large car markets, and the medium family car
> > markets.
> > Even some of the "Hot Hatch" small hatch back models by
> > VW/Seat/Skoda/Audi have the best performance model being a turbo diesel.
> >
> > With petrol in europe being so expensive, performance diesels are just
> > as popular because of the better fuel consumption. Oh and some of them
> > "run fine" of Veg oils and bio diesel fuels.
>
> Yeah, I know diesels are a lot more popular in Yurrip, but our experience
> over here is that, unless you're running a Kenworth or something with a
> Cummins in it, stay away.
>
> The exception being the Rabbit ('75-82 Golf) diesels, esp the little
> trucklet they made. Those seem to run forever with about the same
> maintenance one would put into a Corolla...sometimes, that is. I've seen
> them with a half a mil on them!
>
> Thanks, Skoda-Sleeker-NeedFor...
>
> I guess the meatballs are ON, eh?
>
>
Yep.
Yep, topless, leather and a fine old girl
All in a car related topic.

Thing is, while I'm trying to sell it, I take the Celica out for the odd
quick run to make sure that the battery stays charged etc. And while it
does my back (Sciatica and yes it can get you in your 30's), it feels so
tight and flat cornering, and drives so well.

The Saab is wallowy (in comparison) and rolls through corners, but isn't
actually that much slower. It actually hangs on very well for a fwd soft
convertible cruiser.
--
Carl Robson
Car PC Build starts again. http://smallr.com/rz
Homepage: http://www.bouncing-czechs.com

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 15:00:08 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:

> In article >,
> says...
>> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:22:38 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>>
>> > In article >,
>> > says...
>> >> Unless you're really strapped for cash, though, I would stay away from ANY
>> >> Diesel! I don't think there is a company out there that has their sh!t
>> >> together on Diesles!
>> >>
>> > Europe is a totally different ball game for oil burners.
>> > They are the biggest sellers in the non-luxury large car markets, making
>> > grounds in the luxury large car markets, and the medium family car
>> > markets.
>> > Even some of the "Hot Hatch" small hatch back models by
>> > VW/Seat/Skoda/Audi have the best performance model being a turbo diesel.
>> >
>> > With petrol in europe being so expensive, performance diesels are just
>> > as popular because of the better fuel consumption. Oh and some of them
>> > "run fine" of Veg oils and bio diesel fuels.
>>
>> Yeah, I know diesels are a lot more popular in Yurrip, but our experience
>> over here is that, unless you're running a Kenworth or something with a
>> Cummins in it, stay away.
>>
>> The exception being the Rabbit ('75-82 Golf) diesels, esp the little
>> trucklet they made. Those seem to run forever with about the same
>> maintenance one would put into a Corolla...sometimes, that is. I've seen
>> them with a half a mil on them!
>>
>> Thanks, Skoda-Sleeker-NeedFor...
>>
>> I guess the meatballs are ON, eh?
>>
>>
> Yep.
> Yep, topless, leather and a fine old girl
> All in a car related topic.
>
> Thing is, while I'm trying to sell it, I take the Celica out for the odd
> quick run to make sure that the battery stays charged etc. And while it
> does my back (Sciatica and yes it can get you in your 30's), it feels so
> tight and flat cornering, and drives so well.

Yeah, I've had it since my 20's!

All it takes is bending the wrong way ONCE! Then it's an
on-again-off-again thing for therest of your life.

I work it out riding a 10 speed.

Why sell the Celica? Run it into the ground if you can.

>
> The Saab is wallowy (in comparison) and rolls through corners, but isn't
> actually that much slower. It actually hangs on very well for a fwd soft
> convertible cruiser.

"Hachiroku" > wrote in message
news
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:26:09 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> says...
>>> if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting
>>> them
>>> over here!
>>>
>> Thing is.
>> I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
>> thirsty and expensive to maintain.
>>
>> I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
>> about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last owner
>> totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.
>>
>> The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
>> convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives great,
>> and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.
>
> Saabs, and most Euro cars over here, seem to be a 50/50 proposition for
> some reason.
>
> The most you ever see a Euro car over here is sitting outside the repair
> center...
>
> Even the Big Boys, M-B and BMW spend more time on the lift than on the
> road.
>
> BTW, I saw a NICE, REALLY NICE 2002 yesterday. Some young lady owns it,
> says it's her second.
>
> i am trusting she will park it before the first snowflakes...


I am from Pennsylvania, over here in the states, and I was wondering how
everyone in Europe gets along without driving a pickup. I never see any
pickups on the road over there whenever I watch "The Amazing Race" or news
stories involving Europe. Are we Americans addicted to pickups for no
reason? I know most American families survived without them during the '50s
and most of the '60s. I love small economical vehicles. I am amazed at the
different makes and models available to Europeans and not to the US market.
A majority of the vehicles over here that are on the road are gas guzzling
bricks on wheels.

On another note, remember that Mercedes has been contaminated by Chrysler -
but I don't know why BMW is having reliability problems as of late.

Buyers buy the vehicles they want and can afford. In Europe vehicles and
fuel are heavy taxed to pay for their socialist system of government so they
can get FREE medical care etc, making it more expensive to own a operate a
car. There are plenty of vehicles available in the US from domestic and
import brands, for those the choose to buy them, but apparently few choose
to do so. If buyers can afford to buy larger safer vehicles they will do
so. The recent spike in gas prices did not slow larger vehicle sales as much
as it increased small vehicle sales. Apparently those that could afforded
to buy the vehicles they wanted continued to do so and some went out a
bought a small vehicles to use as well. It was the poorer folks, that can
not afford to buy larger safer vehicles, that were effect by high gas prices
not those that drive the larger safer vehicles. It was the small car buyers
that cut back on their driving or converted some of their discressionary
spending over to fuel.. WalMart and McDonalds were effected butt upper
class stores and restaurants. Unlike Europe, Americas population is more
spread out over the country where their is little or no public
transportation and people need cars and trucks in their daily work and
lives.



"Bob Palmer" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Hachiroku" > wrote in message
> news
>> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:26:09 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>>
>>> In article >,
>>> says...
>>>> if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting
>>>> them
>>>> over here!
>>>>
>>> Thing is.
>>> I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
>>> thirsty and expensive to maintain.
>>>
>>> I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
>>> about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last owner
>>> totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.
>>>
>>> The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
>>> convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives great,
>>> and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.
>>
>> Saabs, and most Euro cars over here, seem to be a 50/50 proposition for
>> some reason.
>>
>> The most you ever see a Euro car over here is sitting outside the repair
>> center...
>>
>> Even the Big Boys, M-B and BMW spend more time on the lift than on the
>> road.
>>
>> BTW, I saw a NICE, REALLY NICE 2002 yesterday. Some young lady owns it,
>> says it's her second.
>>
>> i am trusting she will park it before the first snowflakes...
>
>
> I am from Pennsylvania, over here in the states, and I was wondering how
> everyone in Europe gets along without driving a pickup. I never see any
> pickups on the road over there whenever I watch "The Amazing Race" or news
> stories involving Europe. Are we Americans addicted to pickups for no
> reason? I know most American families survived without them during the
> '50s and most of the '60s. I love small economical vehicles. I am amazed
> at the different makes and models available to Europeans and not to the US
> market. A majority of the vehicles over here that are on the road are gas
> guzzling bricks on wheels.
>
> On another note, remember that Mercedes has been contaminated by
> Chrysler - but I don't know why BMW is having reliability problems as of
> late.
>

Mike Hunter wrote:
> Buyers buy the vehicles they want and can afford. In Europe vehicles and
> fuel are heavy taxed to pay for their socialist system of government so they
> can get FREE medical care etc, making it more expensive to own a operate a
> car. There are plenty of vehicles available in the US from domestic and
> import brands, for those the choose to buy them, but apparently few choose
> to do so. If buyers can afford to buy larger safer vehicles they will do
> so.

i'd /love/ to know where this "larger safer vehicles" myth comes from.
have you ever looked at any of the insurer or nhtsa fatality stats?
suvs kill many more times the number of their occupants than cars. it's
because they're so unstable and because there are no rules regarding
cabin crush safety like there are cars. c'mon guy, get with the facts.

> The recent spike in gas prices did not slow larger vehicle sales as much
> as it increased small vehicle sales. Apparently those that could afforded
> to buy the vehicles they wanted continued to do so and some went out a
> bought a small vehicles to use as well. It was the poorer folks, that can
> not afford to buy larger safer vehicles, that were effect by high gas prices
> not those that drive the larger safer vehicles. It was the small car buyers
> that cut back on their driving or converted some of their discressionary
> spending over to fuel.. WalMart and McDonalds were effected butt upper
> class stores and restaurants. Unlike Europe, Americas population is more
> spread out over the country where their is little or no public
> transportation and people need cars and trucks in their daily work and
> lives.
>
>
>
> "Bob Palmer" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>"Hachiroku" > wrote in message
>>news >>
>>>On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:26:09 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>In article >,
>>>>says...
>>>>
>>>>>if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting
>>>>>them
>>>>>over here!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Thing is.
>>>>I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
>>>>thirsty and expensive to maintain.
>>>>
>>>>I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
>>>>about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last owner
>>>>totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.
>>>>
>>>>The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
>>>>convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives great,
>>>>and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.
>>>
>>>Saabs, and most Euro cars over here, seem to be a 50/50 proposition for
>>>some reason.
>>>
>>>The most you ever see a Euro car over here is sitting outside the repair
>>>center...
>>>
>>>Even the Big Boys, M-B and BMW spend more time on the lift than on the
>>>road.
>>>
>>>BTW, I saw a NICE, REALLY NICE 2002 yesterday. Some young lady owns it,
>>>says it's her second.
>>>
>>>i am trusting she will park it before the first snowflakes...
>>
>>
>>I am from Pennsylvania, over here in the states, and I was wondering how
>>everyone in Europe gets along without driving a pickup. I never see any
>>pickups on the road over there whenever I watch "The Amazing Race" or news
>>stories involving Europe. Are we Americans addicted to pickups for no
>>reason? I know most American families survived without them during the
>>'50s and most of the '60s. I love small economical vehicles. I am amazed
>>at the different makes and models available to Europeans and not to the US
>>market. A majority of the vehicles over here that are on the road are gas
>>guzzling bricks on wheels.
>>
>>On another note, remember that Mercedes has been contaminated by
>>Chrysler - but I don't know why BMW is having reliability problems as of
>>late.
>>
>
>
>

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 11:45:12 -0400, Bob Palmer wrote:

>
> "Hachiroku" > wrote in message
> news
>> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:26:09 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>>
>>> In article >,
>>> says...
>>>> if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting
>>>> them
>>>> over here!
>>>>
>>> Thing is.
>>> I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
>>> thirsty and expensive to maintain.
>>>
>>> I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
>>> about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last owner
>>> totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.
>>>
>>> The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
>>> convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives great,
>>> and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.
>>
>> Saabs, and most Euro cars over here, seem to be a 50/50 proposition for
>> some reason.
>>
>> The most you ever see a Euro car over here is sitting outside the repair
>> center...
>>
>> Even the Big Boys, M-B and BMW spend more time on the lift than on the
>> road.
>>
>> BTW, I saw a NICE, REALLY NICE 2002 yesterday. Some young lady owns it,
>> says it's her second.
>>
>> i am trusting she will park it before the first snowflakes...
>
>
> I am from Pennsylvania, over here in the states, and I was wondering how
> everyone in Europe gets along without driving a pickup. I never see any
> pickups on the road over there whenever I watch "The Amazing Race" or news
> stories involving Europe. Are we Americans addicted to pickups for no
> reason? I know most American families survived without them during the '50s
> and most of the '60s. I love small economical vehicles. I am amazed at the
> different makes and models available to Europeans and not to the US market.
> A majority of the vehicles over here that are on the road are gas guzzling
> bricks on wheels.
>
> On another note, remember that Mercedes has been contaminated by Chrysler -
> but I don't know why BMW is having reliability problems as of late.


LOL. I thought Chryslr was getting a leg up from M-B!

My college roommate had a 2002 Tii. Amazing car! Drove like on rails. Was
3 years old. Couldn't pass the local BMW dealer...

Same with my '73 Volvo 1800ES, 3 years old, 52,000 miles.

Amazing cars, nickle and dime you (well, a couple Franklins here and
there) out of your bank account!

Wife (er, EX, that is) has a '94 325i with 45,000 when she bought it, now
has 80,000, always calling me with issues. Is on it's THIRD tranny...

You better do a bit more research, if that is what you believe, because your
information is not based on facts. Only around 2% of ALL of the hundreds of
thousand accidents in the US involve a rollover and the majority of
rollovers are the result of striking, or being struck by something, not from
instability.. The fast majority of ALL accidents are frontal collisions.
The larger the vehicle the less likely properly belted passengers will be
injured or killed. If a vehicles height actually made it more likely for it
to rollover one should expect to see six wheel trucks rolled over on a daily
basis.

mike



"jim beam" > wrote in message
...
> Mike Hunter wrote:
>> Buyers buy the vehicles they want and can afford. In Europe vehicles and
>> fuel are heavy taxed to pay for their socialist system of government so
>> they can get FREE medical care etc, making it more expensive to own a
>> operate a car. There are plenty of vehicles available in the US from
>> domestic and import brands, for those the choose to buy them, but
>> apparently few choose to do so. If buyers can afford to buy larger
>> safer vehicles they will do so.
>
> i'd /love/ to know where this "larger safer vehicles" myth comes from.
> have you ever looked at any of the insurer or nhtsa fatality stats? suvs
> kill many more times the number of their occupants than cars. it's
> because they're so unstable and because there are no rules regarding cabin
> crush safety like there are cars. c'mon guy, get with the facts.
>
>> The recent spike in gas prices did not slow larger vehicle sales as much
>> as it increased small vehicle sales. Apparently those that could
>> afforded to buy the vehicles they wanted continued to do so and some went
>> out a bought a small vehicles to use as well. It was the poorer folks,
>> that can not afford to buy larger safer vehicles, that were effect by
>> high gas prices not those that drive the larger safer vehicles. It was
>> the small car buyers that cut back on their driving or converted some of
>> their discressionary spending over to fuel.. WalMart and McDonalds were
>> effected butt upper class stores and restaurants. Unlike Europe,
>> Americas population is more spread out over the country where their is
>> little or no public transportation and people need cars and trucks in
>> their daily work and lives.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Bob Palmer" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>"Hachiroku" > wrote in message
>>>news >>>
>>>>On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 13:26:09 +0100, NeedforSwede2 wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>In article >,
>>>>>says...
>>>>>
>>>>>>if there ARE any nice, solid, dependable Euro cars, we AIN'T getting
>>>>>>them
>>>>>>over here!
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Thing is.
>>>>>I'm selling my Celica GT4/Alltrac. It has 147k miles on it. It is too
>>>>>thirsty and expensive to maintain.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've bought a Saab convertible. 2 years newer, 212k miles, body is in
>>>>>about same condition maybe better. Big ends were gone. So the last
>>>>>owner
>>>>>totally rebuilt it, fitted a recon box and turbo at the same time.
>>>>>
>>>>>The suspension is fine, the steering is good, because it is a
>>>>>convertible there is more rattle and scuttle shake, but it drives
>>>>>great,
>>>>>and uses far less fuel. Oh and they are reliable.
>>>>
>>>>Saabs, and most Euro cars over here, seem to be a 50/50 proposition for
>>>>some reason.
>>>>
>>>>The most you ever see a Euro car over here is sitting outside the repair
>>>>center...
>>>>
>>>>Even the Big Boys, M-B and BMW spend more time on the lift than on the
>>>>road.
>>>>
>>>>BTW, I saw a NICE, REALLY NICE 2002 yesterday. Some young lady owns it,
>>>>says it's her second.
>>>>
>>>>i am trusting she will park it before the first snowflakes...
>>>
>>>
>>>I am from Pennsylvania, over here in the states, and I was wondering how
>>>everyone in Europe gets along without driving a pickup. I never see any
>>>pickups on the road over there whenever I watch "The Amazing Race" or
>>>news stories involving Europe. Are we Americans addicted to pickups for
>>>no reason? I know most American families survived without them during the
>>>'50s and most of the '60s. I love small economical vehicles. I am amazed
>>>at the different makes and models available to Europeans and not to the
>>>US market. A majority of the vehicles over here that are on the road are
>>>gas guzzling bricks on wheels.
>>>
>>>On another note, remember that Mercedes has been contaminated by
>>>Chrysler - but I don't know why BMW is having reliability problems as of
>>>late.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>