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Tyres: Best foot forward? or back?



 
 
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  #21  
Old August 18th 04, 09:17 PM
Tony Rickard
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"Gareth Tuckwell" wrote:

> The reason I noticed the anomoly with my car was when I parked my car on a
> friends driveway (slight slope), then came out later to find my car had

run
> down the drive onto the flat area of the road - front brake discs heat up
> when driving, I apply the handbrake, then discs cool down, contract and

come
> away from the wheels. No damage was done, but I always park in gear now!!


This problem is not uncommon with the increasing number of vehicles with
rear disc brakes. These contract and can allow the vehicle to move with the
handbrake on as you describe. I would be surprised if your 156 hand brake
operates on the front wheels as I thought only the Sud had that arrangement



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  #22  
Old August 19th 04, 04:08 PM
Buzzardous Cross
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Oh boy, this thread is evolving:

I ask where I should put the better pair of tyres - front or back; and
I get a great answer and explanation (no sarcasm here): at the back to
save the average driver; at the front if your surname's Schumacher.
And get all 4 good tyres if you can afford it!

But maybe now I should ask:
Is it better to have the handbrakes at the front or back!!!

Arguably I'd say it's better at the back cause handbrake turns are
that much easier when you got a lever-operated handbrake on the rear
wheels/axle

But from a safety perspective if a loony passenger yanked the
handbrake mid-turn, you would get a tail-out situation pretty fast! -
which makes the case for Front.

Though living with it daily, it would be quite loony having
cable-driven brakes on the front discs - they're always so bloody hot
anyway, you'd need chocks to keep the car in place for anything longer
than a couple of minutes - discs cool, and car goes for a walk!
  #23  
Old August 19th 04, 04:37 PM
Tom Boltwood
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> From: Zathras >
> Organization: NTL
> Newsgroups: alt.autos.alfa-romeo
> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 16:25:41 GMT
> Subject: Tyres: Best foot forward? or back?
>
> On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 19:52:37 GMT, "Gareth Tuckwell"
> > wrote:
>
>> I must apologise to you - the manual definitely says the handbrake applies
>> to the rear wheels.

>
> ..correct!
>
>> However, I know mine applies to the front wheels...

>
> ..false!
>
>> I thought it was strange when I bought the car, but I was not too surprised
>> because the Citroen Xantia has the same setup, so I thought nothing more of
>> it. I mentioned it to a mechanic friend of mine and he was surprised, but
>> confirmed that the handbrake is acting on the front wheels.

>
> I'd call this person a *friend* not a *mechanic* I'm afraid.
>
> <Snip>
>> The reason I noticed the anomoly with my car was when I parked my car on a
>> friends driveway (slight slope), then came out later to find my car had run
>> down the drive onto the flat area of the road - front

>
> ..nope..if you change the word 'front' to 'rear', this whole paragraph
> becomes correct...
>
>> brake discs heat up
>> when driving, I apply the handbrake, then discs cool down, contract and come
>> away from the wheels. No damage was done, but I always park in gear now!!

>
> Parking in gear is what you should do anyway. Also, it's *absolutely
> essential* for ANY car that has a handbrake that operates on the disk
> brakes for, roughly, the reason you give.
>
>> I will enquire about this at the garage, the next time I am in - I had never
>> read that section of the manual before, but the handbrake works OK (except
>> when I don't apply it hard enough).

>
> Sounds like a perfectly normal 156 to me.
>
>> I'll post something about this in a couple of months, when the car gets
>> serviced.

>
> They'll do a routine adjustment and you won't have to pull the
> handbrake lever up quite as far to get the same effect. However, NEVER
> trust it..not even on the flat! You've got to get into a 100% habit of
> leaving these things in gear these days. The alternative is to find
> your car wrecked at the bottom of a hill one day.
>

My dad does that with the result that whenever he has borrowed my car or I
borrow his, I start the ignition and jolt forward. Luckily I haven't hit
anything yet!

  #24  
Old August 19th 04, 05:25 PM
Zathras
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On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 19:52:37 GMT, "Gareth Tuckwell"
> wrote:

>I must apologise to you - the manual definitely says the handbrake applies
>to the rear wheels.


...correct!

> However, I know mine applies to the front wheels...


...false!

>I thought it was strange when I bought the car, but I was not too surprised
>because the Citroen Xantia has the same setup, so I thought nothing more of
>it. I mentioned it to a mechanic friend of mine and he was surprised, but
>confirmed that the handbrake is acting on the front wheels.


I'd call this person a *friend* not a *mechanic* I'm afraid.

<Snip>
>The reason I noticed the anomoly with my car was when I parked my car on a
>friends driveway (slight slope), then came out later to find my car had run
>down the drive onto the flat area of the road - front


...nope..if you change the word 'front' to 'rear', this whole paragraph
becomes correct...

>brake discs heat up
>when driving, I apply the handbrake, then discs cool down, contract and come
>away from the wheels. No damage was done, but I always park in gear now!!


Parking in gear is what you should do anyway. Also, it's *absolutely
essential* for ANY car that has a handbrake that operates on the disk
brakes for, roughly, the reason you give.

>I will enquire about this at the garage, the next time I am in - I had never
>read that section of the manual before, but the handbrake works OK (except
>when I don't apply it hard enough).


Sounds like a perfectly normal 156 to me.

>I'll post something about this in a couple of months, when the car gets
>serviced.


They'll do a routine adjustment and you won't have to pull the
handbrake lever up quite as far to get the same effect. However, NEVER
trust it..not even on the flat! You've got to get into a 100% habit of
leaving these things in gear these days. The alternative is to find
your car wrecked at the bottom of a hill one day.

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)
  #25  
Old August 19th 04, 06:46 PM
Catman
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Tom Boltwood wrote:

<snip>
>> They'll do a routine adjustment and you won't have to pull the
>> handbrake lever up quite as far to get the same effect. However, NEVER
>> trust it..not even on the flat! You've got to get into a 100% habit of
>> leaving these things in gear these days. The alternative is to find
>> your car wrecked at the bottom of a hill one day.
>>

> My dad does that with the result that whenever he has borrowed my car or I
> borrow his, I start the ignition and jolt forward. Luckily I haven't hit
> anything yet!


I was always taught to check that a vehicle was in neutral, and depress the
clutch as well, before turning the key

1) To avoid the lurch if you mistake sloppy gear knob for neutral
2) Puts less strain on the battery while cranking
--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 75 2.0 TS
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk
  #26  
Old August 19th 04, 07:05 PM
Alfistagj
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"Buzzardous Cross" > schreef in bericht
om...
> Oh boy, this thread is evolving:
>
> Arguably I'd say it's better at the back cause handbrake turns are
> that much easier when you got a lever-operated handbrake on the rear
> wheels/axle
>


Handbrake turns??
I do my turns with the steering wheel ;-)

Where are you all driving where you can do this kind of driving?
Are you alone on the road?
What will that poor old lady think when you are doing this kind of circus
trick just in front of her?

Grow up, and learn how to drive safely and not a danger to yourself and your
fellow "roadrunners"!
--
Ciao from Holland
AlfistaGJ (Gert-Jan)
Alfa red 156 SW 1.8 Madeno tuned (2000)
Golden Montreal 1428700 (1973/4)


  #27  
Old August 19th 04, 07:58 PM
Zathras
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On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 16:37:34 +0100, Tom Boltwood >
wrote:

>
>
>> From: Zathras >
>> Organization: NTL
>> Newsgroups: alt.autos.alfa-romeo
>> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 16:25:41 GMT
>> Subject: Tyres: Best foot forward? or back?
>>
>> On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 19:52:37 GMT, "Gareth Tuckwell"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I must apologise to you - the manual definitely says the handbrake applies
>>> to the rear wheels.

>>
>> ..correct!
>>
>>> However, I know mine applies to the front wheels...

>>
>> ..false!
>>
>>> I thought it was strange when I bought the car, but I was not too surprised
>>> because the Citroen Xantia has the same setup, so I thought nothing more of
>>> it. I mentioned it to a mechanic friend of mine and he was surprised, but
>>> confirmed that the handbrake is acting on the front wheels.

>>
>> I'd call this person a *friend* not a *mechanic* I'm afraid.
>>
>> <Snip>
>>> The reason I noticed the anomoly with my car was when I parked my car on a
>>> friends driveway (slight slope), then came out later to find my car had run
>>> down the drive onto the flat area of the road - front

>>
>> ..nope..if you change the word 'front' to 'rear', this whole paragraph
>> becomes correct...
>>
>>> brake discs heat up
>>> when driving, I apply the handbrake, then discs cool down, contract and come
>>> away from the wheels. No damage was done, but I always park in gear now!!

>>
>> Parking in gear is what you should do anyway. Also, it's *absolutely
>> essential* for ANY car that has a handbrake that operates on the disk
>> brakes for, roughly, the reason you give.
>>
>>> I will enquire about this at the garage, the next time I am in - I had never
>>> read that section of the manual before, but the handbrake works OK (except
>>> when I don't apply it hard enough).

>>
>> Sounds like a perfectly normal 156 to me.
>>
>>> I'll post something about this in a couple of months, when the car gets
>>> serviced.

>>
>> They'll do a routine adjustment and you won't have to pull the
>> handbrake lever up quite as far to get the same effect. However, NEVER
>> trust it..not even on the flat! You've got to get into a 100% habit of
>> leaving these things in gear these days. The alternative is to find
>> your car wrecked at the bottom of a hill one day.
>>

>My dad does that with the result that whenever he has borrowed my car or I
>borrow his, I start the ignition and jolt forward. Luckily I haven't hit
>anything yet!


Hmmm..I always start any vehicle with the clutch depressed. One reason
is that it avoids the scenario you describe but another is that it
takes the (smallish) gearbox load off the starter.

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)
  #28  
Old August 20th 04, 10:31 AM
Tom Boltwood
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Posts: n/a
Default



> From: Zathras >
> Organization: NTL
> Newsgroups: alt.autos.alfa-romeo
> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 18:58:03 GMT
> Subject: Tyres: Best foot forward? or back?
>
> On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 16:37:34 +0100, Tom Boltwood >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>> From: Zathras >
>>> Organization: NTL
>>> Newsgroups: alt.autos.alfa-romeo
>>> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 16:25:41 GMT
>>> Subject: Tyres: Best foot forward? or back?
>>>
>>> On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 19:52:37 GMT, "Gareth Tuckwell"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I must apologise to you - the manual definitely says the handbrake applies
>>>> to the rear wheels.
>>>
>>> ..correct!
>>>
>>>> However, I know mine applies to the front wheels...
>>>
>>> ..false!
>>>
>>>> I thought it was strange when I bought the car, but I was not too surprised
>>>> because the Citroen Xantia has the same setup, so I thought nothing more of
>>>> it. I mentioned it to a mechanic friend of mine and he was surprised, but
>>>> confirmed that the handbrake is acting on the front wheels.
>>>
>>> I'd call this person a *friend* not a *mechanic* I'm afraid.
>>>
>>> <Snip>
>>>> The reason I noticed the anomoly with my car was when I parked my car on a
>>>> friends driveway (slight slope), then came out later to find my car had run
>>>> down the drive onto the flat area of the road - front
>>>
>>> ..nope..if you change the word 'front' to 'rear', this whole paragraph
>>> becomes correct...
>>>
>>>> brake discs heat up
>>>> when driving, I apply the handbrake, then discs cool down, contract and
>>>> come
>>>> away from the wheels. No damage was done, but I always park in gear now!!
>>>
>>> Parking in gear is what you should do anyway. Also, it's *absolutely
>>> essential* for ANY car that has a handbrake that operates on the disk
>>> brakes for, roughly, the reason you give.
>>>
>>>> I will enquire about this at the garage, the next time I am in - I had
>>>> never
>>>> read that section of the manual before, but the handbrake works OK (except
>>>> when I don't apply it hard enough).
>>>
>>> Sounds like a perfectly normal 156 to me.
>>>
>>>> I'll post something about this in a couple of months, when the car gets
>>>> serviced.
>>>
>>> They'll do a routine adjustment and you won't have to pull the
>>> handbrake lever up quite as far to get the same effect. However, NEVER
>>> trust it..not even on the flat! You've got to get into a 100% habit of
>>> leaving these things in gear these days. The alternative is to find
>>> your car wrecked at the bottom of a hill one day.
>>>

>> My dad does that with the result that whenever he has borrowed my car or I
>> borrow his, I start the ignition and jolt forward. Luckily I haven't hit
>> anything yet!

>
> Hmmm..I always start any vehicle with the clutch depressed. One reason
> is that it avoids the scenario you describe but another is that it
> takes the (smallish) gearbox load off the starter.
>
> --

That all makes sense and is what I should do really, but I've just got in
the habit of leaping in and starting the car as I always park in neutral
like my driving instructor told me to.

  #29  
Old August 20th 04, 10:37 PM
Zathras
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On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 10:31:40 +0100, Tom Boltwood >
wrote:


<snip>
>That all makes sense and is what I should do really, but I've just got in
>the habit of leaping in and starting the car as I always park in neutral
>like my driving instructor told me to.


Keep up to date my man! Did you do your test when most cars had drum
brakes on the rear?

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)
  #30  
Old August 20th 04, 11:02 PM
Thomas Strandtoft
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Catman wrote:

> Not sure about that, old chap. I understood that the reason that front
> brakes are more powerful than rears was simply because when you brake, the
> weight of your vehicle shifts forwards, reducing the donwforce on the rear
> wheels. You learn about this in a hurry when biking.


Yeah, but as a biker you also know how important rear brakes are
for stability while stopping, they make quite a difference in
combination with the front brake even if they are lousy on their
own..

> There is simply no point in having more powerful brakes on the rear since
> they will always lock before the fronts (in a straight line of course)


And if the lock, you lose stability, again proving my point that
it is important to make sure they don't lock easily = put on good
tyres.. :-)

> However, I may have misunderstood / not explained very well. But I do have
> an excuse for the latter: It's my birthday and I'm rather well down this
> rather good bottle of wine


Greetings, mate..

> Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits


No more Monster 600?

--
Hygge..
Thomas

<http://www.carftp.com> - a library of car videos.
 




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