quality of corvettes

cris spoke thusly:


> However, very soon, things started to go wrong.

As we all know, American cars are not known for quality. That being
said, you had one big pile of doody, even for an American car. Maybe
the former owner did something to screw it up? I've heard of very few
cars that had a laundry list of problems like yours. Maybe you had one
of those "built on a Monday" cars? Before you guys go bananas on me,
yes, American cars have come a long way, especially in recent years, but
they are still lagging behind others in quality. My personal feeling is
that it's a cultural issue. It's hard to find factory workers that take
pride in what they do. I wonder what would happen if they put the name
and home phone number of everyone that assembled the car inside it
someplace? "hello? yea, you're the guy that put my glove box door on
crooked...what the hell were you thinking?" I bet that would cure a lot
of assembly problems... )

--

Shut up, Dave.

-|>|- Diode -|<|-
'68 L-79 Coupe
'79 Triumph Bonneville

"Diode" > wrote in message news:QMV4d.6539

> I wonder what would happen if they put the name
> and home phone number of everyone that assembled the car inside it
> someplace? "hello? yea, you're the guy that put my glove box door on
> crooked...what the hell were you thinking?" I bet that would cure a lot
> of assembly problems... )

I actually like this idea. Sure beats the little piece of paper with an
insepctor's number on it that I find the pocket when I buy a pair of pants.

But in a bit of blue-collar defense, I used to work in a factory in the
summers, back in my college years, and much depends on the goals and
priorities of the company and the quality of the engineering. They ran
those lines at speeds that, if the parts have extremely tight tolerances,
when something doesn't fit quite right it can be hard to keep up, and build
quality suffers not only for the unit with the obstinate parts but for some
units that followed.

AJM
'93 Ruby coupe, 6 sp

"Diode" > wrote in message news:QMV4d.6539

> I wonder what would happen if they put the name
> and home phone number of everyone that assembled the car inside it
> someplace? "hello? yea, you're the guy that put my glove box door on
> crooked...what the hell were you thinking?" I bet that would cure a lot
> of assembly problems... )

I actually like this idea. Sure beats the little piece of paper with an
insepctor's number on it that I find the pocket when I buy a pair of pants.

But in a bit of blue-collar defense, I used to work in a factory in the
summers, back in my college years, and much depends on the goals and
priorities of the company and the quality of the engineering. They ran
those lines at speeds that, if the parts have extremely tight tolerances,
when something doesn't fit quite right it can be hard to keep up, and build
quality suffers not only for the unit with the obstinate parts but for some
units that followed.

AJM
'93 Ruby coupe, 6 sp

Whoa there partner, backup the worker masher. If that part had the phone
number of the people that were responsible for the design, material
specifications, where it was purchased, and when it was delivered to me,
with the correct directions as to how I was to install it, and I had the
authority to kick the ass of any of the above, and the guy that thought the
line could run 6 foot per minute faster, then yes, put my phone number on
it. It was easy to find a factory worker that had pride, enthusiasm,
ability, and made an extra effort to make the best product out there. Now
comes the accountant, the management with the big golden parachute, the self
important engineer, and out the window goes the product quality in the name
of profit. To coin an old cliché, "You can't make a silk purse out of a
sow's ear". One thing that I noticed on the C5 was the changes that were
made over its life span, there were many improvements and my guess is that
most of them came from the floor.

Lincoln Welders in Cleveland area had a system that worked, the workers even
had impute into the construction of the plant. What did they do? They had it
built without windows so there would be no distractions. If a product went
out with a problem the worker that caused it got to fix it on his own time
and money. Employee turnover rate, less than 4%, layoff was unheard of.
Management was the prime reason and the employee was the catalyst that made
it work. All jobs were posted, including the top dogs and anyone could bid
on it. Most people were in jobs they liked and didn't move much because
there was very little wage difference if you did a good job, your bonus was
the same % of company profit as everybody else regardless of their/your
position or income level.

Yes, there are some bad workers just as there is bad management, I've worked
with both and as both management and worker but the machine must work from
the top down, seldom from the bottom up.
--
Dad
04 C5 CE Z51
72 Shark Black/Black/4spd
"Diode" > wrote in message
t...
> cris spoke thusly:
>
>
>> However, very soon, things started to go wrong.
>
> As we all know, American cars are not known for quality. That being said,
> you had one big pile of doody, even for an American car. Maybe the former
> owner did something to screw it up? I've heard of very few cars that had
> a laundry list of problems like yours. Maybe you had one of those "built
> on a Monday" cars? Before you guys go bananas on me, yes, American cars
> have come a long way, especially in recent years, but they are still
> lagging behind others in quality. My personal feeling is that it's a
> cultural issue. It's hard to find factory workers that take pride in what
> they do. I wonder what would happen if they put the name and home phone
> number of everyone that assembled the car inside it someplace? "hello?
> yea, you're the guy that put my glove box door on crooked...what the hell
> were you thinking?" I bet that would cure a lot of assembly problems...
> )
>
> --
>
> Shut up, Dave.
>
> -|>|- Diode -|<|-
> '68 L-79 Coupe
> '79 Triumph Bonneville

Whoa there partner, backup the worker masher. If that part had the phone
number of the people that were responsible for the design, material
specifications, where it was purchased, and when it was delivered to me,
with the correct directions as to how I was to install it, and I had the
authority to kick the ass of any of the above, and the guy that thought the
line could run 6 foot per minute faster, then yes, put my phone number on
it. It was easy to find a factory worker that had pride, enthusiasm,
ability, and made an extra effort to make the best product out there. Now
comes the accountant, the management with the big golden parachute, the self
important engineer, and out the window goes the product quality in the name
of profit. To coin an old cliché, "You can't make a silk purse out of a
sow's ear". One thing that I noticed on the C5 was the changes that were
made over its life span, there were many improvements and my guess is that
most of them came from the floor.

Lincoln Welders in Cleveland area had a system that worked, the workers even
had impute into the construction of the plant. What did they do? They had it
built without windows so there would be no distractions. If a product went
out with a problem the worker that caused it got to fix it on his own time
and money. Employee turnover rate, less than 4%, layoff was unheard of.
Management was the prime reason and the employee was the catalyst that made
it work. All jobs were posted, including the top dogs and anyone could bid
on it. Most people were in jobs they liked and didn't move much because
there was very little wage difference if you did a good job, your bonus was
the same % of company profit as everybody else regardless of their/your
position or income level.

Yes, there are some bad workers just as there is bad management, I've worked
with both and as both management and worker but the machine must work from
the top down, seldom from the bottom up.
--
Dad
04 C5 CE Z51
72 Shark Black/Black/4spd
"Diode" > wrote in message
t...
> cris spoke thusly:
>
>
>> However, very soon, things started to go wrong.
>
> As we all know, American cars are not known for quality. That being said,
> you had one big pile of doody, even for an American car. Maybe the former
> owner did something to screw it up? I've heard of very few cars that had
> a laundry list of problems like yours. Maybe you had one of those "built
> on a Monday" cars? Before you guys go bananas on me, yes, American cars
> have come a long way, especially in recent years, but they are still
> lagging behind others in quality. My personal feeling is that it's a
> cultural issue. It's hard to find factory workers that take pride in what
> they do. I wonder what would happen if they put the name and home phone
> number of everyone that assembled the car inside it someplace? "hello?
> yea, you're the guy that put my glove box door on crooked...what the hell
> were you thinking?" I bet that would cure a lot of assembly problems...
> )
>
> --
>
> Shut up, Dave.
>
> -|>|- Diode -|<|-
> '68 L-79 Coupe
> '79 Triumph Bonneville

wrote in message >...
> I think you just got a lemon of a 2001. A quick look at Consumer
> Reports does indicate some real trouble areas though for earlier C5's
> .. so, youre not alone.

What you need to ask yourself proddy boy, is anyone ever interested in
what you think?

Shut up Dave

wrote in message >...
> I think you just got a lemon of a 2001. A quick look at Consumer
> Reports does indicate some real trouble areas though for earlier C5's
> .. so, youre not alone.

What you need to ask yourself proddy boy, is anyone ever interested in
what you think?

Shut up Dave

Diode spoke thusly:

>As we all know, American cars are not known for quality.

Tell everyone your car is "amish" then everyone will marvel at the flaws.

"It dripped on my head....waaaaaaaaah"

Corvettes and other real sports cars are not for whiners.

Be quiet, David.

Diode spoke thusly:

>As we all know, American cars are not known for quality.

Tell everyone your car is "amish" then everyone will marvel at the flaws.

"It dripped on my head....waaaaaaaaah"

Corvettes and other real sports cars are not for whiners.

Be quiet, David.

"cris" > wrote in message ...
I loved corvettes for as long as I can remember. As a young boy, I had corvette models and toy cars, shirts with corvettes on them, and any time I saw one on the road I would stare in wonder. I always said, someday, I will own a corvette.

About 2 and a half years ago, my finances and my luck came together at the same time and I found a 2001 Red Coupe used with only 7,000 miles on it. I looked the car over very closely and test drove it a couple times before deciding to buy it. The first 2 months were a joy. I loved the car. It was everything I thought it would be for that short time. However, very soon, things started to go wrong.

First, numerous water and air leaks developed in a short time in the targa top. This took at least 5 seperate trips to the dealer over the course of the first year to fix. Even when it was "completely fixed" according to GM, it would still occaisionally leak water and the wind noise was still bad.

Second, the brake rotors warped after about 10,000 miles. I complained enough to the dealer that they resurfaced them for free. This worked for about 1000 miles and the problem returned. It was so bad that when you stepped on the brake you could feel the vibration through your whole body and the whole car.

Third, the car burned oil. When I complained, I was told this happens with corvettes and to monitor it regulary.

Fourth, my computer would do very strange things. Sometimes in the middle of the interstate, it would flip from english to metric for no reason.

Fifth, after about 15000 miles, the left headlight made a horrible buzzing sound as it went up and down. A day later, it wouldnt go up at all anymore. It just stayed down.

Sixth, about 5000 miles later, the right headlight did the same thing.

Seventh, the driver seat would rock back and forth while driving. Was told this is a known problem.

Eighth, around 20000 miles, vibrating noises started to occur in the driver door window, the center console, the glove compartment, and somewhere in the dash. These were extremely annoying and difficult to nail down the cause.

Ninth, when accelerating quickly a small burst of smelly exhaust fumes would come through the AC vents. No one could figure this one out either.

Tenth, the recirc air feature never worked completely right. You could still smell trucks or cows or whatever was outside even with the recirc feature enabled. I was told this was functioning properly.

Eleventh, at about 10000 miles, the plastic covering on the passenger pillar started to peel away from the small vent there. The whole plastic pillar cover had to be replaced.

Twelfth, at about the same time as the pillar issue, the AC front panel started to bubble and had to be replaced.
Keep in mind, this car was kept in my garage at home and under covered parking at work. It hardly ever sat in the sun.

Thirteenth, the light switch in the glovebox developed a short and the switch had to be replaced.

Fourteenth, the radio reception was very poor and I was told this was because of the antenna in the windshield and was a known problem.

Fifteenth, the small plastic cover on the interior door panel just under the handle fell off somewhere. Had to buy a new one and replace it.

Sixteenth, sometimes, the transmission would slip when in lower gears. You could feel it very noticably. The dealer said they couldnt recreate the problem.

Seventeenth, sometimes the brake pedal stuck for a moment when it was released. Was told this was not reproducible either.

Lastly, the poor service. The chevy dealers I went to ranged from poor to about average when it came to service. Not to mention, when I complained about some of these issues directly to GM, they said there wasnt anything they could do and that I should work with my dealer.

Ok, add all these issues to the things that you knowingly accept when you buy a car like a corvette, things like the impracticality of a 2 seater vehicle, a rough ride, a loud ride, expensive parts, expensive gas, bad gas milage, expensive tires, higher insurance, and a higher than average car price tag and one can quickly go from loving the car to hating it.

I got rid of the car when it had about 34000 miles on it.

Dont get me wrong, even after this experience, I still watch with a smile every corvette that passes me by on the highway and I think about the days when that was me. There is just something about the car that makes me love it. But the quality of the craftsmenship for the price of the car and the customer service of GM are definately not part of that love and that may be enough to keep me from dropping the cash for another one ever again.

Please someone tell me. Did I just have a lemon or is this something that people who love vettes just put up with simply because of the nostalgia and love of the car?

Thanks for listening. Wish I was still driving my vette but it was a lemon. I hope they are not all that way because I would like to own one again someday.

My experience with a 69 and a 71 some 35 years ago was pretty much the same. Loved the cars, but.... and Chevy dealers were a big part of the problem. I can see that not much has changed. My 01 Honda Prelude with 47,000 on it has been completely troublefree and the local dealer is competant. If I had to replace the Prelude I would either buy an Acura RSX S or the Honda S2000. Still like Vettes, but too old to put up with the problems.