G35 vs. 330i sedans why did you choose one over the other?

"Jeff Strickland" > wrote
> "fbloogyudsr" > wrote
>> Wrong. The G35 is RWD.
>>
>> Floyd
>>
> I didn't know that. I guess I need to get out more ...

Well, many of us BMW drivers were driven to the marque when
Nissan (and Toyota) and the rest of the world were making very
forgettable vanilla FWD cars. Nissan (and Cadillac and others)
have only in the last 2-3 years gone back to RWD.

The G35 (and 350Z and FX35 and Murano and Maxima) are
in their 2nd model year. Nissan always made great V6 engines;
now they have a chassis to match.

Floyd

"Jeff Strickland" > wrote in message >...
> One, these are Text Only groups, you should reset your newsreader to post in
> Plain Text, not rich text or HTML.
>
> Two, I don't buy your view on automatics. Your view that owners of
> automatics are missing alot is just plain idiotic. Autos have come along
> way, and driving an auto can be a very spirited experience, and it is easier
> to use in heavy traffic where the speeds are closer to 0 than 80.
>
> Three, the Infinity is FWD, I think, whereas the BMW is RWD. There is a
> significant difference. I don't take a position that one is better than the
> other, only that they are significantly different than each other.
> Personally, I like being pushed around by RWD, but there is a very good
> argument to be made for being pulled around by FWD.
>
>
>
>
> "GRL" > wrote in message
> ...
> I have a short list for manual sport sedans that is down to a new 2004 G35
> (Premium, Sport, and spoiler packages) sedan or a nice late model 330i sedan
> (Premium, Sport Packages). They are basically equipped alike.
>
> Have driven both, like both, but am torn between the two because each has
> its advantages. Both make me smile wide. Neither has a dealer nearby.
>
> For example, the G35 would doubtless be a bit less troublesome, has a better
> gear shift, is new, is a bit quicker, is noticeably roomier inside and in
> trunk space, and is not a BMW (remember the how do you tell the difference
> between a BMW and a mosquito joke?)
>
> The 330i is more tossable, handles a little better, has a better clutch
> action, looks a bit nicer (not Bangle-ized), is a BMW (lower depreciation,
> snob appeal), gets better mileage.
>
> OK you folks who were in a similar position, which did you choose and why?
>
> Surprising thing in looking at used 330i's is how few manual models there
> are available. There are loads of automatics, on the other hand. A BMW
> dealer told me that his dealership only sells about 5% of their new Beemers
> with manuals. Virtually everybody buys automatics. For the "ultimate driving
> machine" that is very surprising. Makes me think that lots of BMW customers
> buy the brand (prestige) and not the car.
>
> No way is an automatic is as much fun to drive as a manual, in my view. Poor
> saps buying all those automatics are missing a lot.
>
> (Manual G35's are hard to find, too.)
>
>
> GRL
>
> "It's good to want things."
>
> S. Barr (philosopher, poet, humorist, chemist, Visual Basic.Net programmer)

Well, gee, Jeff, I guess that all the car buff books in the U.S. ar
run by idiots because they invariably prefer a manual transmission in
sporting machinerey to a slush pump. A manual takes skill to drive
well, and rewards the talented student with better control,
performance and even mileage...and loads more fun. Automatics are nice
for use in heavy traffic, but that's it. Anyone who fails to see the
pleasure in a well executed manual down-shift coming out of a turn
might as well be "steering" a Taurus as fine sporting machinery is
wasted on her. Just another pitiful poser. People who have to get
automatics because they must deal with stop/go city commutes have my
sympathy, and I would get the same in their place, but I would still
miss the fun of good manual gear box.

No, it isn't.

"dizzy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 20:49:50 -0400, "GRL" >
> wrote:
>
> >Looks are a matter of taste, and you are welcome to your opinion.
> >
> >As far as driving fun, you are so wrong about the G35 that there is no
pint
> >in arguing with you. You clearly never drove a G35. The car book editors
who
> >drive more cars in a lifetime than you or I will drive in a lifetime and
who
> >are very familiar with 330i's rate the two very close, with the G35
usually
> >winning on price.
> >
> >You sound awfully threatened by the G35. Try to remember that they are
both
> >just cars in the end.
>
> Yes, but what's with the top posting? Is that the norm in the q45
> group?
>

"GRL" > wrote in message
om...

> Automatics are nice
> for use in heavy traffic, but that's it. Anyone who fails to see the
> pleasure in a well executed manual down-shift coming out of a turn
> might as well be "steering" a Taurus as fine sporting machinery is
> wasted on her. Just another pitiful poser. People who have to get
> automatics because they must deal with stop/go city commutes have my
> sympathy, and I would get the same in their place, but I would still
> miss the fun of good manual gear box.

If you drive mostly in heavy traffic and crowded freeways, an automatic
makes sense. For those times you get on the open road and need to
downshift, the kickdown will do it for you, and you can override the gear
with the gearshift lever, assuming you need an automatic for most driving.
I don't know how smoothly this works on the BMW specifically, and it won't
give you the control or flexibility of a manual transmission (the two
assumptions here are that the driver is good with it and the clutch and
transmission are in good shape, neither one of which I would make for any
random driver) but it will work surprisingly well and is not going to be
like a Taurus. I'd be surprised if anybody had trouble shifting down one
gear with a quick press of the gas peddle alone. Granted, that's not as
flexible as a manual, but with a powerful engine it may be an acceptable
compromise.

Anyone who fails to see the
> pleasure in a well executed manual down-shift coming out of a turn
> might as well be "steering" a Taurus as fine sporting machinery is
> wasted on her. Just another pitiful poser. People who have to get
> automatics because they must deal with stop/go city commutes have my
> sympathy, and I would get the same in their place, but I would still
> miss the fun of good manual gear box.

Having driven over a million miles in manual transmission cars, I
would like to add that a manual trans is only fun IF it is well
executed.
The trans in my SAAB Turbo, besides breaking every other year, sucked
all around for fun. Sloppy shifting and you had to double-clutch 1-2
shifts on a cold morning.
Both of my VWs had clunky transmissions, but the clutches were without
fault. Very satisfying to drive up to about 60K miles until the shift
linkages were worn out.
I think I drove one of the few manual Honda Accords when everyone else
bought their excellent electronically controlled automatic. Good gear
spacing, but synchros were shot by 75K miles. A few quarts of Redline
gear lube helped, but you never could shift above 4000 revs w/o drama.
I recently borrowed a 6-speed 540 Dinan to run some errands. Very
stiff shifter, and wierd clutch feel. Probably that dreaded BMW
hydraulic limiter in the clutch lines. I was dead tired after driving
it for an hour in traffic.
Bottom line is that I rather enjoy the Steptronic in my 528i. Maybe if
BMW or Infinity employed a solid-feeling cable clutch (like my VWs),
the clickety shifter of a Mazda RX-7, 5 well-spaced gears (like my
Honda), plus some good synchros (still elusive to me) I would go back
to a manual trans. But to labor over a manual trans in a modern
vehicle is "posing" to me.

Matthew
00 528i Sport

"GRL" > wrote in message
om...
> "Jeff Strickland" > wrote in message
>...
> Well, gee, Jeff, I guess that all the car buff books in the U.S. ar
> run by idiots because they invariably prefer a manual transmission in
> sporting machinerey to a slush pump. A manual takes skill to drive
> well, and rewards the talented student with better control,
> performance and even mileage...and loads more fun. Automatics are nice
> for use in heavy traffic, but that's it. Anyone who fails to see the
> pleasure in a well executed manual down-shift coming out of a turn
> might as well be "steering" a Taurus as fine sporting machinery is
> wasted on her. Just another pitiful poser. People who have to get
> automatics because they must deal with stop/go city commutes have my
> sympathy, and I would get the same in their place, but I would still
> miss the fun of good manual gear box.


I follow you on all of that, and I like a good manual gearbox just like you,
but I don't go around dissing people that drive automatics, and if I found a
good car in my price range with the options and color I wanted, and it had
an automatic instead of a stick, I would not disqualify it from my available
choices based on the trans alone.

My point was not that one or the other is better, my point was that you
shouldn't look down on people that make different choices in transmissions
than you would make. It is reasonable that you express dismay that a manual
is difficult to find, but in my opinion tha tis not what you did.

I hope you find what you are looking for, I got mine with a stick in it, but
I ain't sellin' ...

BTW,
Sorry for the misleading position in the G35 being FWD.

I thought it was, but probably because it is Japanese. I purposefully did
not place a value judgement on FWD vs RWD because there is a long list of
advantages and disadvantages of each, and some drivers clearly prefer one
over the other. I only wanted to suggest that if you were one of those
drivers, then perhaps you would want to look closer into the issue before
you made your purchase. It turns out that this is not an issue as both cars
are RWD. If you are one that gets wrapped up in the issue of automatic vs
manual transmissions, then certainly you would likely want to investigate
RWD vs FWD. That was my thinking, but I was obvioulsy in error.





"GRL" > wrote in message
om...
> "Jeff Strickland" > wrote in message
>...
> > One, these are Text Only groups, you should reset your newsreader to
post in
> > Plain Text, not rich text or HTML.
> >
> > Two, I don't buy your view on automatics. Your view that owners of
> > automatics are missing alot is just plain idiotic. Autos have come along
> > way, and driving an auto can be a very spirited experience, and it is
easier
> > to use in heavy traffic where the speeds are closer to 0 than 80.
> >
> > Three, the Infinity is FWD, I think, whereas the BMW is RWD. There is a
> > significant difference. I don't take a position that one is better than
the
> > other, only that they are significantly different than each other.
> > Personally, I like being pushed around by RWD, but there is a very good
> > argument to be made for being pulled around by FWD.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "GRL" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > I have a short list for manual sport sedans that is down to a new 2004
G35
> > (Premium, Sport, and spoiler packages) sedan or a nice late model 330i
sedan
> > (Premium, Sport Packages). They are basically equipped alike.
> >
> > Have driven both, like both, but am torn between the two because each
has
> > its advantages. Both make me smile wide. Neither has a dealer nearby.
> >
> > For example, the G35 would doubtless be a bit less troublesome, has a
better
> > gear shift, is new, is a bit quicker, is noticeably roomier inside and
in
> > trunk space, and is not a BMW (remember the how do you tell the
difference
> > between a BMW and a mosquito joke?)
> >
> > The 330i is more tossable, handles a little better, has a better clutch
> > action, looks a bit nicer (not Bangle-ized), is a BMW (lower
depreciation,
> > snob appeal), gets better mileage.
> >
> > OK you folks who were in a similar position, which did you choose and
why?
> >
> > Surprising thing in looking at used 330i's is how few manual models
there
> > are available. There are loads of automatics, on the other hand. A BMW
> > dealer told me that his dealership only sells about 5% of their new
Beemers
> > with manuals. Virtually everybody buys automatics. For the "ultimate
driving
> > machine" that is very surprising. Makes me think that lots of BMW
customers
> > buy the brand (prestige) and not the car.
> >
> > No way is an automatic is as much fun to drive as a manual, in my view.
Poor
> > saps buying all those automatics are missing a lot.
> >
> > (Manual G35's are hard to find, too.)
> >
> >
> > GRL
> >
> > "It's good to want things."
> >
> > S. Barr (philosopher, poet, humorist, chemist, Visual Basic.Net
programmer)
>
> Well, gee, Jeff, I guess that all the car buff books in the U.S. ar
> run by idiots because they invariably prefer a manual transmission in
> sporting machinerey to a slush pump. A manual takes skill to drive
> well, and rewards the talented student with better control,
> performance and even mileage...and loads more fun. Automatics are nice
> for use in heavy traffic, but that's it. Anyone who fails to see the
> pleasure in a well executed manual down-shift coming out of a turn
> might as well be "steering" a Taurus as fine sporting machinery is
> wasted on her. Just another pitiful poser. People who have to get
> automatics because they must deal with stop/go city commutes have my
> sympathy, and I would get the same in their place, but I would still
> miss the fun of good manual gear box.

"Jeff Strickland" > wrote in message
...

> My point was not that one or the other is better, my point was that you
> shouldn't look down on people that make different choices in transmissions
> than you would make.

Nice thought Jeff, but unfortunately this is how people uncertain of their
own beliefs satisfy their insecurities.

It's the way of the world, and as it applies to this BMW ng:

1) don't like the way a car looks?....then harp on it for 6 months

2) like a manual?...then ridicule those who like automatics

3) got a little teeny-tiny dick...then be damn sure you make something else
the center of attention :^)

fbloogyudsr said the following on 9/28/2004 7:40 PM:


>
> The G35 (and 350Z and FX35 and Murano and Maxima) are
> in their 2nd model year. Nissan always made great V6 engines;
> now they have a chassis to match.
>
> Floyd

Of course you know that the G35 and FX35/45 are on the same RWD platform
while the Maxima and Murano are on the same FWD platform. All but
Maxima offer a AWD variant.
--
Doug Main
"It's never too late to have a happy childhood."

"Doug Main" > wrote
> fbloogyudsr said the following on 9/28/2004 7:40 PM:
>>
>> The G35 (and 350Z and FX35 and Murano and Maxima) are
>> in their 2nd model year. Nissan always made great V6 engines;
>> now they have a chassis to match.
>
> Of course you know that the G35 and FX35/45 are on the same RWD platform
> while the Maxima and Murano are on the same FWD platform. All but
> Maxima offer a AWD variant.

Huh; thought they converted the Maxima back to RWD - I see I'm wrong.

Floyd