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#1
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
Dear Everyone,
as you know the price of the Oil is more and more increasing, while the oil supply is decreasing. Moreover Oil is causing wars, terror, oil spills and a lot of greenhouse gases. By upgrading your car to flex fuel, you will continue to be able to use oil. However you will also have the opportunity to use E85, that means more freedom of choice. The conversion cost is about 200-250 USD. By choosing ethanol, you choose local fuel production, which means labour for farmers, labour for enginneers and workers in the ethanol plant, labour for transportation. Moreover you also help for indirect labour. Since the money stays in your country, this money will turn and produce indirect labour. Since the farmer will gain your additional fuel money, he will buy other things (labour is again needed for their production), which in case of oil the oil-Sheikhs or their people would do. That ethanol production increases the food prices is also not totally right, first there is a by-product called "distillers dried grains with solubles", which is used as feed for livestock, that is also nothing else than food. Moreover, by using ethanol, you put pressure on oil prices, which has also an important effect on food prices. You also give your money for more research (again labour), which will yield in higher efficiency of production and alternative production methods like cellulosic ethanol, which will change the whole equation. Again in case of oil this money would be spent for oil rigs, oil- infrastructure, but also for weapons to defend the oil. By using ethanol, you produce less CO2, since it is produced by corn, which actually consumed the CO2 in the air for its growing. The more people use ethanol, the higher the efficiencies will come for production (similar to solar cells). The prices will go further down, and much less CO2 will be produced during production in the plant. Do you know that the production efficiencies already improved 30% ?* Another reason for using ethanol is that oil prices will come up again, when the barrel price of 150 USD is back you will be very happy to have your vehicle converted. The conversion also increases the value of your vehicle. Yours sincerely. Sources: *http://brownfieldagnews.com/2010/09/...on-efficiency- improves/ |
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#2
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
......... wrote:
> Dear Everyone, > as you know the price of the Oil is more and more increasing, while > the oil supply is decreasing. Moreover Oil > is causing wars, terror, oil spills and a lot of greenhouse gases. > By upgrading your car to flex fuel, you will continue to be able to > use oil. However you will also have the > opportunity to use E85, that means more freedom of choice. The > conversion cost is about 200-250 USD. > By choosing ethanol, you choose local fuel production, which means > labour for farmers, labour for enginneers > and workers in the ethanol plant, labour for transportation. Moreover > you also help for indirect labour. Since > the money stays in your country, this money will turn and produce > indirect labour. Since the farmer will gain > your additional fuel money, he will buy other things (labour is again > needed for their production), which in case > of oil the oil-Sheikhs or their people would do. > That ethanol production increases the food prices is also not totally > right, first there is a by-product called > "distillers dried grains with solubles", which is used as feed for > livestock, that is also nothing else than > food. Moreover, by using ethanol, you put pressure on oil prices, > which has also an important effect on food > prices. You also give your money for more research (again labour), > which will yield in higher efficiency of > production and alternative production methods like cellulosic ethanol, > which will change the whole equation. > Again in case of oil this money would be spent for oil rigs, oil- > infrastructure, but also for weapons to > defend the oil. > By using ethanol, you produce less CO2, since it is produced by corn, > which actually consumed the CO2 in the air > for its growing. The more people use ethanol, the higher the > efficiencies will come for production (similar to > solar cells). The prices will go further down, and much less CO2 will > be produced during production in the plant. > Do you know that the production efficiencies already improved 30% ?* > Another reason for using ethanol is that oil prices will come up > again, when the barrel price of 150 USD is back > you will be very happy to have your vehicle converted. The conversion > also increases the value of your vehicle. > > Yours sincerely. > > > Sources: > *http://brownfieldagnews.com/2010/09/...on-efficiency- > improves/ If ethanol is so damn great why don't the farmers growing the corn convert their tractors, trucks and pickups to ethanol? Until that happens nothing is going to convince me ethanol is any cheaper or better. |
#3
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
FatterDumber& Happier Moe > wrote in
: > ........ wrote: >> Dear Everyone, >> as you know the price of the Oil is more and more increasing, while >> the oil supply is decreasing. Moreover Oil >> is causing wars, terror, oil spills and a lot of greenhouse gases. >> By upgrading your car to flex fuel, you will continue to be able to >> use oil. However you will also have the >> opportunity to use E85, that means more freedom of choice. The >> conversion cost is about 200-250 USD. >> By choosing ethanol, you choose local fuel production, which means >> labour for farmers, labour for enginneers >> and workers in the ethanol plant, labour for transportation. Moreover >> you also help for indirect labour. Since >> the money stays in your country, this money will turn and produce >> indirect labour. Since the farmer will gain >> your additional fuel money, he will buy other things (labour is again >> needed for their production), which in case >> of oil the oil-Sheikhs or their people would do. >> That ethanol production increases the food prices is also not totally >> right, first there is a by-product called >> "distillers dried grains with solubles", which is used as feed for >> livestock, that is also nothing else than >> food. Moreover, by using ethanol, you put pressure on oil prices, >> which has also an important effect on food >> prices. You also give your money for more research (again labour), >> which will yield in higher efficiency of >> production and alternative production methods like cellulosic ethanol, >> which will change the whole equation. >> Again in case of oil this money would be spent for oil rigs, oil- >> infrastructure, but also for weapons to >> defend the oil. >> By using ethanol, you produce less CO2, since it is produced by corn, >> which actually consumed the CO2 in the air >> for its growing. The more people use ethanol, the higher the >> efficiencies will come for production (similar to >> solar cells). The prices will go further down, and much less CO2 will >> be produced during production in the plant. >> Do you know that the production efficiencies already improved 30% ?* >> Another reason for using ethanol is that oil prices will come up >> again, when the barrel price of 150 USD is back >> you will be very happy to have your vehicle converted. The conversion >> also increases the value of your vehicle. >> >> Yours sincerely. >> >> >> Sources: >> *http://brownfieldagnews.com/2010/09/...on-efficiency- >> improves/ > > If ethanol is so damn great why don't the farmers growing the corn > convert their tractors, trucks and pickups to ethanol? Until that > happens nothing is going to convince me ethanol is any cheaper or better. > > > well first of all the trucks and tractors run on diesel not gasoline so no converting there. (we do run a soyoil mix though) and I have used a 10% ethanol mix in my gas for at least 20 years now. Also just bought a flex fuel pkup, because often e85 is cheeper to run. KB |
#4
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
Kevin Bottorff wrote:
> FatterDumber& Happier Moe > wrote in > : > >> ........ wrote: >>> Dear Everyone, >>> as you know the price of the Oil is more and more increasing, while >>> the oil supply is decreasing. Moreover Oil >>> is causing wars, terror, oil spills and a lot of greenhouse gases. >>> By upgrading your car to flex fuel, you will continue to be able to >>> use oil. However you will also have the >>> opportunity to use E85, that means more freedom of choice. The >>> conversion cost is about 200-250 USD. >>> By choosing ethanol, you choose local fuel production, which means >>> labour for farmers, labour for enginneers >>> and workers in the ethanol plant, labour for transportation. Moreover >>> you also help for indirect labour. Since >>> the money stays in your country, this money will turn and produce >>> indirect labour. Since the farmer will gain >>> your additional fuel money, he will buy other things (labour is again >>> needed for their production), which in case >>> of oil the oil-Sheikhs or their people would do. >>> That ethanol production increases the food prices is also not totally >>> right, first there is a by-product called >>> "distillers dried grains with solubles", which is used as feed for >>> livestock, that is also nothing else than >>> food. Moreover, by using ethanol, you put pressure on oil prices, >>> which has also an important effect on food >>> prices. You also give your money for more research (again labour), >>> which will yield in higher efficiency of >>> production and alternative production methods like cellulosic ethanol, >>> which will change the whole equation. >>> Again in case of oil this money would be spent for oil rigs, oil- >>> infrastructure, but also for weapons to >>> defend the oil. >>> By using ethanol, you produce less CO2, since it is produced by corn, >>> which actually consumed the CO2 in the air >>> for its growing. The more people use ethanol, the higher the >>> efficiencies will come for production (similar to >>> solar cells). The prices will go further down, and much less CO2 will >>> be produced during production in the plant. >>> Do you know that the production efficiencies already improved 30% ?* >>> Another reason for using ethanol is that oil prices will come up >>> again, when the barrel price of 150 USD is back >>> you will be very happy to have your vehicle converted. The conversion >>> also increases the value of your vehicle. >>> >>> Yours sincerely. >>> >>> >>> Sources: >>> *http://brownfieldagnews.com/2010/09/...on-efficiency- >>> improves/ >> If ethanol is so damn great why don't the farmers growing the corn >> convert their tractors, trucks and pickups to ethanol? Until that >> happens nothing is going to convince me ethanol is any cheaper or > better. >> >> > > well first of all the trucks and tractors run on diesel not gasoline so > no converting there. (we do run a soyoil mix though) and I have used a > 10% ethanol mix in my gas for at least 20 years now. Also just bought a > flex fuel pkup, because often e85 is cheeper to run. KB That was my point, when is John Deer going to make an ethonol powered tractor? I'd think the farmers would want such a thing. |
#5
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
On 11/15/2010 02:58 AM, FatterDumber& Happier Moe wrote:
> Kevin Bottorff wrote: >> FatterDumber& Happier Moe > wrote in >> : >> >>> ........ wrote: <snip spam crap> >>> If ethanol is so damn great why don't the farmers growing the corn >>> convert their tractors, trucks and pickups to ethanol? Until that >>> happens nothing is going to convince me ethanol is any cheaper or >> better. >>> >>> >> >> well first of all the trucks and tractors run on diesel not gasoline >> so no converting there. (we do run a soyoil mix though) and I have >> used a 10% ethanol mix in my gas for at least 20 years now. Also just >> bought a flex fuel pkup, because often e85 is cheeper to run. KB > > That was my point, when is John Deer going to make an ethonol powered > tractor? I'd think the farmers would want such a thing. basic math question: if E85 is 81,800 BTU/gal and diesel is 129,500 BTU/gal and given that national average diesel price is $3.116, <http://www.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/wohdp/diesel.asp> i. what is the break point for E85 being cheaper? ii. by what % is the e85 buyer being rorted? for bonus points, run the same numbers allowing for ethanol's taxpayer subsidy costs. for super bonus points, run the same numbers allowing for thermodynamic efficiency. -- nomina rutrum rutrum |
#6
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
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#8
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
jim beam wrote: > > whose words are these? > > "e85 is cheeper to run." > > so, show your math! > Math doesn't have anything to do with it. Nor does brain-dead belief in thermodynamics. Some engines do get better mileage with ethanol blends even though there is less heat energy contained in ethanol blends than there is in straight gasoline. The main problem is the EPA refuses to use ethanol blended fuel in the government fuel economy tests. Since 90% of the gasoline sold in the US now contains ethanol eventually the EPA will have to succumb to reality and start using ethanol blended gasoline in their fuel economy tests. When that happens all new cars will be designed to get better mileage on ethanol blends. This is because it is not hard to design engines to get better fuel economy with ethanol blended fuel. The only reason car manufacturers do not design their engines to perform better with ethanol is because there is no financial incentive to do so. -jim |
#9
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
On 11/15/2010 02:47 PM, jim wrote:
> > > jim beam wrote: > >> >> whose words are these? >> >> "e85 is cheeper to run." >> >> so, show your math! >> > > Math doesn't have anything to do with it. Nor does brain-dead belief in > thermodynamics. > > Some engines do get better mileage with ethanol blends even though there > is less heat energy contained in ethanol blends than there is in > straight gasoline. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????? > > The main problem is the EPA refuses to use ethanol blended fuel in the > government fuel economy tests. Since 90% of the gasoline sold in the US > now contains ethanol eventually the EPA will have to succumb to reality > and start using ethanol blended gasoline in their fuel economy tests. if they did, then there would be hard facts right in front of voters to say by how much they're getting ripped off with this ethanol rort. voters punish politicians when they realize they've been ripped, so that's why it hasn't happened. > When that happens all new cars will be designed to get better mileage on > ethanol blends. This is because it is not hard to design engines to get > better fuel economy with ethanol blended fuel. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????? > The only reason car > manufacturers do not design their engines to perform better with ethanol > is because there is no financial incentive to do so. for some people, smoking enough weed does indeed apparently change their laws of nature. -- nomina rutrum rutrum |
#10
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Why you should convert your vehicle to flex fuel
jim beam wrote: > > > if they did, then there would be hard facts right in front of voters to > say by how much they're getting ripped off with this ethanol rort. > voters punish politicians when they realize they've been ripped, so > that's why it hasn't happened. Or maybe - as usual - you don't have a clue. > > > > When that happens all new cars will be designed to get better mileage on > > ethanol blends. This is because it is not hard to design engines to get > > better fuel economy with ethanol blended fuel. > > ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????? > > > The only reason car > > manufacturers do not design their engines to perform better with ethanol > > is because there is no financial incentive to do so. > > for some people, smoking enough weed does indeed apparently change their > laws of nature. There is no violation of the laws of nature. You are just clueless. |
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