Consumer Reports and Saturn

"marx404" > wrote in message
...
>I am actually not in sales but I have worked for Saturn, which would make
>me knowledgeable about the cars (how is that relevant anyways? Im not
>ashamed of it, so what?) , so with all due respect "Private" I know who you
>really are and outing me still even on here does not discredit me. I
>thought you got thrown off of SaturnFans for TROLLing people ? Only the
>name has changed but your bad behavior hasn't, too bad there's so much
>hating. I feel bad for you that you have to resort to such low blows.

With respect,
I was very careful to qualify my comments ("with respect and IMHO"), I am
entitled to and stand by them.
I neither made nor intended insult.
You are very knowledgeable and (to your credit) have never hidden your
connections/associations to the Saturn business. Some people (but not I)
might suggest that many of your comments verge on commercial use and are a
violation of (IMHO an overly strict interpretation of) the Usenet charter,
but I prefer to view (most of) them as helpfully intentioned and
unobjectionable.
We all have biases and should recognize and acknowledge them.
I do not recall EVER having posted on SaturnFans but I have visited and read
the site on occasion. If you consider my post (which I clearly qualified as
"with respect and IMHO") as "bad behaviour or low blows" then I respectfully
submit you should examine your ad hominem response.
You are, of course, entitled to your opinions.

I thank everyone for their input and this input is being added to other
sources. CR and in this group are the only negatives I have heard. Vue
owners I talked to have all been happy with the vehicle.

What started me looking at the Vue was my mechanic. I mentioned looking for
a SUV and he suggested the Vue. I joked with him that he is looking for
business and he replied that the only work he has done on a Vue is normal
maintenance. I have not made a decision yet, but if I buy the Vue, I will
post complaints/praises.

BTW, the SES light on my SL2 just turned on. It needs a Cat converter.


"Dan" > wrote in message
...
>I have a 1996 SL2 with 240k+ miles on it and just the normal wear & tear
>problems. It has been the best new car I have had. I am now looking for an
>SUV and the Consumer Reports negative view of the Saturn Vue concern me.
>Are the Vue's from 2007 and newer worthy of the negative opinion?
>
> My experience with the SL2 makes me want to stick with the Saturn but...
>
>
>

As you are entitled to you opinions. - but nobody asked you to out me, or
start a fight. that, my friend was a low blow. Your opinion that I have ever
advertised here is false and unfounded and again a low blow. If you do not
like my comments you are well entitled to ignore them, but I do not come
here or anywhere to fight with anyone, nor be picked upon or trolled upon.

--
marx404
<all gmail posts blocked>
_________________
"Private" > wrote in message
...
>
> "marx404" > wrote in message
> ...
>>I am actually not in sales but I have worked for Saturn, which would make
>>me knowledgeable about the cars (how is that relevant anyways? Im not
>>ashamed of it, so what?) , so with all due respect "Private" I know who
>>you really are and outing me still even on here does not discredit me. I
>>thought you got thrown off of SaturnFans for TROLLing people ? Only the
>>name has changed but your bad behavior hasn't, too bad there's so much
>>hating. I feel bad for you that you have to resort to such low blows.
>
> With respect,
> I was very careful to qualify my comments ("with respect and IMHO"), I am
> entitled to and stand by them.
> I neither made nor intended insult.
> You are very knowledgeable and (to your credit) have never hidden your
> connections/associations to the Saturn business. Some people (but not I)
> might suggest that many of your comments verge on commercial use and are a
> violation of (IMHO an overly strict interpretation of) the Usenet charter,
> but I prefer to view (most of) them as helpfully intentioned and
> unobjectionable.
> We all have biases and should recognize and acknowledge them.
> I do not recall EVER having posted on SaturnFans but I have visited and
> read the site on occasion. If you consider my post (which I clearly
> qualified as "with respect and IMHO") as "bad behaviour or low blows" then
> I respectfully submit you should examine your ad hominem response.
> You are, of course, entitled to your opinions.
>
>

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
>I thank everyone for their input and this input is being added to other
>sources. CR and in this group are the only negatives I have heard. Vue
>owners I talked to have all been happy with the vehicle.
>
> What started me looking at the Vue was my mechanic. I mentioned looking
> for a SUV and he suggested the Vue. I joked with him that he is looking
> for business and he replied that the only work he has done on a Vue is
> normal maintenance. I have not made a decision yet, but if I buy the Vue,
> I will post complaints/praises.
>
> BTW, the SES light on my SL2 just turned on. It needs a Cat converter.
>
>
> "Dan" > wrote in message
> ...
>>I have a 1996 SL2 with 240k+ miles on it and just the normal wear & tear
>>problems. It has been the best new car I have had. I am now looking for an
>>SUV and the Consumer Reports negative view of the Saturn Vue concern me.
>>Are the Vue's from 2007 and newer worthy of the negative opinion?
>>
>> My experience with the SL2 makes me want to stick with the Saturn but...

Aside of the bickering a couple people are having, I can give you my opinion
as a Vue owner...
(but I can't speak for the latest '08's and newer Opel versions),

I have an '06, 4 cyl, 5-speed stick and my father has a '06, 6cyl auto FWD
fully loaded, so I am familiar with those versions.

With mine, I live on flat Long Island and the Vue is my daily driver and
family trip vehicle. A lot of highway miles at 76K miles already.
Everything on the car is great except the ongoing issue with my front wheel
bearings. I replaced the originals at 55K and have only put another 20K on
and they're making that "snow tire" noise again. If you are handy, they are
not that bad to change yourself and you can get the Timken bearings online
for $110 each. The point however is that you should not have to replace the
wheels bearings before the tires or brakes. Other than that, I get 30-32
MPG (hwy) in the warm weather and 25-27 in the cold, so that is worth the
aggravation right there. I rotated the original tires every 3K and got 68K
out of them. All in all, a great, solid SUV with really great gas mileage.
The mileage trade-off (or con if you look at it that way) is that it is
underpowered and sluggish in the 20-40 MPH range and can't get out of it's
own way. Once you get over 40-45, it responds well to what you ask of it.

My father's got about 40K on it and has never had a bearing issue, and I
figured with the extra weight he would have. I guess it's hit and miss
thing. Jumping in his after being in mine, it feels like a sports car. He
has had to have the front brakes done already (but after riding with him,
that's not necessarily the cars fault - heh) He never rotates the tires and
has had to get new fronts. The drivers side seat warmer broke and had to be
fixed, but other than that he seems to be happy with it as he knows the
tires and brakes are his fault and not the cars. He only gets about 20 MPG
with it.

All in all, a good, solid little SUV. Only disappointment is this !#$%ing
wheel bearing issue on mine. I thought I'd be OK with the Timken's, but
they only lasted 20K. Anyone know why they went so fast again and have a
better suggestion with regards to brand or installation tip? (by that I mean
going outside the Saturn specs for torque on the hub when installing or
something to get a longer life out of them. I'm a highway driver and not
aggressive, while my dad is local and hard on it and guess who has the
issue?)

Good luck with your decision,

IYM

marx404 turned on the Etch-A-Sketch and wrote:

> As you are entitled to you opinions. - but nobody asked you to out me, or
> start a fight. that, my friend was a low blow. Your opinion that I have
> ever advertised here is false and unfounded and again a low blow. Â*If you
> do not like my comments you are well entitled to ignore them, but I do not
> come here or anywhere to fight with anyone, nor be picked upon or trolled
> upon.

Huh?

--
www.perfectreign.com
Clean out a corner of your mind and creativity will instantly fill it. - Dee
Hock

"PerfectReign" > wrote in message ...
> marx404 turned on the Etch-A-Sketch and wrote:
>
>> As you are entitled to you opinions. - but nobody asked you to out me, or
>> start a fight. that, my friend was a low blow. Your opinion that I have
>> ever advertised here is false and unfounded and again a low blow. If you
>> do not like my comments you are well entitled to ignore them, but I do not
>> come here or anywhere to fight with anyone, nor be picked upon or trolled
>> upon.
>
> Huh?
>
> --
> www.perfectreign.com
> Clean out a corner of your mind and creativity will instantly fill it. - Dee
> Hock

Like PerfectReign, I was wondering the same thing. I took Private's comments as perfectly respectful of marx404,
although differencing in opinion. And I think they both offer very good suggestions for the OP.

"PerfectReign" > wrote in message ...
> Dan turned on the Etch-A-Sketch and wrote:
>
>> I have a 1996 SL2 with 240k+ miles on it and just the normal wear & tear
>> problems. It has been the best new car I have had. I am now looking for an
>> SUV and the Consumer Reports negative view of the Saturn Vue concern me.
>> Are the Vue's from 2007 and newer worthy of the negative opinion?
>>
>> My experience with the SL2 makes me want to stick with the Saturn but...
>
> Consumer Reports has never said anything I've found valuable. However, YMMV.
> <snip>

CR *writers* may not but I find their customer reviews helpful. That's what prompted me to buy my first of two
Saturns (a 1994 SL)!

>>> Consumer Reports negative view of the Saturn Vue concern me.


>> Consumer Reports has never said anything I've found valuable. However, YMMV.


> CR *writers* may not but I find their customer reviews helpful.
> That's what prompted me to buy my first of two Saturns



I always laugh when a car company "brags" about being
MotorTrend Car Of The Year.
..... 71 Chevy Vega made it !
John T

Dan wrote:
> I have a 1996 SL2 with 240k+ miles on it and just the normal wear & tear
> problems. It has been the best new car I have had. I am now looking for an
> SUV and the Consumer Reports negative view of the Saturn Vue concern me. Are
> the Vue's from 2007 and newer worthy of the negative opinion?
>
> My experience with the SL2 makes me want to stick with the Saturn but...
>

Generally, most new cars being sold are infinitely more reliable than
any of the cars being sold 30 years ago. Consumer reports is a valuable
guideline but their reliability ratings tend to exaggerate problems in
my experience. I own a 2006 Prius that they said would be very reliable
and ...it has been. I also own a 2001 Chrysler minivan that they rated
as very unreliable and I have not seen any problems yet at the 112K
mileage mark. I have a '92 Saturn SL2 that I don't think ever got very
good reliability ratings either from CR but at 212K miles it's still
running strong, although I've put a new clutch in it, a new alternator,
new brake linings, new serpentine belt, etc. over the 17 years that
I've owned it. I owned an '82 Toyota Tercel that had very high CR
reliability ratings...and it was reliable...until it hit about 110,000
miles when basically everything on it started to break. Most of the
tercels of that vintage seemed to disappear from the road at about that
time so I don't think my experience with that car was unique. The
bottom line is...read the CR reports but try to distinguish between
minor flaws that all cars have, even highly rated ones, and those major
flaws that make a car a nightmare to own. I don't think that CR in its
current format does a very good job at that.

--
Posted with OS/2 Warp 4.52
and Sea Monkey 1.5a

I used to read all the Consumer Reports crap. And every time I purchased
something they recommended I was very disappointed. Especially cars.
Their Japanese cars recommendations have always been a problem and one
of the reasons we stopped buying Japanese cars. I've never had problems
with American cars. I think it is how the cars are maintained. Because
people pay more for Japanese cars they tend to maintain them better.
They tend not to maintain American cars as much as Japanese cars, so
they blame American cars. JMHO.

Buzz wrote:
> I also have a '96 SL with 175K on the clock and hopre to milk it for a
> few more years.
>
> Saturn has changed from those days........don't but anything
> Consumer Reports doesn't recommend - you will be sorry down the road.
>
> I owned a couple of Chrysler mini-vans that CR said were junk, and
> they were. All the stuff they said breaks did. I than bought a
> Toyota Sienna Van that was recommended and have not had a problem.
>
> I will not buy a vehicle that CR does not rate "Above Average" in
> reliability.