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Reducing Intake Air Temps



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 3rd 10, 07:46 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chris D'Agnolo[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 587
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

Ok, the Scangauge II has made one thing abundantly clear, intake air temp
is a problem I need to tend to, to improve the performance of my car (even
though I've only noticed the problem in stop and go driving in 90+ degree
weather, I'm seeing that intake air temps are 20~50 degrees above ambient
air now, with weather in the 70's which results in 90 ~130 degrees! I can't
imagine what a power killer that is in the summer when, to make it even
worse, I'm likely to be running the AC also!

I know that there 100's of thousands of words written about this topic on
Miata.net (trust me, I've read ALLOT of them) however, this group has many
intelligent people and I would like their (YOUR!) input on a few questions
that remain;

1) Is 10~20 degrees above ambient, a reasonable 'goal' (while at speed)?

2) I have a header (no heat shield), does the muffler tape (thermal wrap) do
much to alleviate under hood temps?

3) Assuming it does, is there a down side?

4) Assuming there is not, how far should the wrap extend, to the lower
'floor' of the engine bay?

5) I believe my best bet is a 'Randal Cowl' type of set up pulling air from
behind the firewall however, I'm trying to minimize my cost for this
improvement and think this might entail buying allot of stuff.

6) I believe my next best bet is to shield the intake (I have a Monsterflow,
cone type that breathes from behind the drivers side headlight), and try to
direct cool air from the front of the car, into this area.

7) While I've been researching this, I've also seen some people installing
thermal protection on the brake and clutch master cylinders, Is this
overkill or 'track day' necessary kind of stuff or might this be a good idea
for everyday use too?

Any / all input appreciated including if you know of a thread on a
particularly good set up (for an NB w/ Monsterflow please).

Thanks,
Chris
99BBB


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  #2  
Old April 4th 10, 01:48 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Lanny Chambers
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Posts: 832
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

In article >,
"Chris D'Agnolo" > wrote:

> 2) I have a header (no heat shield), does the muffler tape (thermal wrap) do
> much to alleviate under hood temps?


If it's stock, put the heat shield back on. If not, make one. The forum
is full of stories of tape wraps eventually causing header rot.

> 5) I believe my best bet is a 'Randal Cowl' type of set up pulling air from
> behind the firewall however, I'm trying to minimize my cost for this
> improvement and think this might entail buying allot of stuff.


Yes, the Randall is the best solution. Plenty of owners have made DIY
versions cheaply, and while they're probably not as efficient as the FM
product, they have to be better than any scheme involving a cone filter.
Hope you still have your OEM airbox. Search miataforum for examples.

--
Lanny Chambers
St. Louis, MO
'94C
  #3  
Old April 4th 10, 03:41 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

Lanny Chambers wrote:
> In article >,
> "Chris D'Agnolo" > wrote:
>
>> 2) I have a header (no heat shield), does the muffler tape (thermal wrap) do
>> much to alleviate under hood temps?

>
> If it's stock, put the heat shield back on. If not, make one. The forum
> is full of stories of tape wraps eventually causing header rot.
>
>> 5) I believe my best bet is a 'Randal Cowl' type of set up pulling air from
>> behind the firewall however, I'm trying to minimize my cost for this
>> improvement and think this might entail buying allot of stuff.

>
> Yes, the Randall is the best solution. Plenty of owners have made DIY
> versions cheaply, and while they're probably not as efficient as the FM
> product, they have to be better than any scheme involving a cone filter.
> Hope you still have your OEM airbox. Search miataforum for examples.


Based on your experience with the Randall unit, do you think it could be
made to help the under-hood temperature with a turbo.

My idea was to have it draw air to a point right above the air filter.

Obviously this would not as good as a direct connection to the OEM
airbox, but maybe better than just drawing in the hot air from under the
hood?

Assuming I keep the car, I also plan to add a turn signal intake, maybe
on both sides.
When the car is running hot, I can take the driver-side turn signal out
and it knocks the temperature down a few degrees according to one
infrared thermometer I have used to measure the difference.

Pat

  #4  
Old April 4th 10, 04:44 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chris D'Agnolo[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 587
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps


"Lanny Chambers" > wrote in message > If it's stock,
put the heat shield back on. If not, make one. The forum
> is full of stories of tape wraps eventually causing header rot.
>
>> 5) I believe my best bet is a 'Randal Cowl' type of set up pulling air
>> from
>> behind the firewall however, I'm trying to minimize my cost for this
>> improvement and think this might entail buying allot of stuff.

>
> Yes, the Randall is the best solution. Plenty of owners have made DIY
> versions cheaply, and while they're probably not as efficient as the FM
> product, they have to be better than any scheme involving a cone filter.
> Hope you still have your OEM airbox. Search miataforum for examples.
>
> --
> Lanny Chambers
> St. Louis, MO
> '94C


Previous owner installed the monsterflow and didn't pass along the OEM part.
Maybe I can find someone interested in trading.

Header is J.R.so, no bolt up points. I'll have to get creative here.

Chris
99BBB

  #5  
Old April 4th 10, 06:27 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Lanny Chambers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 832
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

In article >,
pws > wrote:

> Based on your experience with the Randall unit, do you think it could be
> made to help the under-hood temperature with a turbo.


Probably not. The Randall is rigid carbon fiber, made to connect to the
OEM snorkel hole in the airbox. Every Miata turbo I've seen is smack in
the way.

For a CAI system to work, it must be sealed from the underhood
environment, so the intake receives only outside air, preferably under
positive pressure. As an engine bay air inlet, I'm not sure how well a
hole in the firewall would work. It might become an outlet.

For that matter, I've read claims that Miata TSIs actually act as air
outlets. Dunno if that's true, but airflow is complex, and may not
behave the way you'd think.

Hood louvers might work OK...unless they'd bleed off air needed to cool
the transmission or something. I suspect that nothing on the Miata was
done by accident, and everything is there for a good reason.

--
Lanny Chambers
St. Louis, MO
'94C
  #6  
Old April 4th 10, 01:36 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

Lanny Chambers wrote:
> In article >,
> pws > wrote:
>
>> Based on your experience with the Randall unit, do you think it could be
>> made to help the under-hood temperature with a turbo.

>
> Probably not. The Randall is rigid carbon fiber, made to connect to the
> OEM snorkel hole in the airbox. Every Miata turbo I've seen is smack in
> the way.
>
> For a CAI system to work, it must be sealed from the underhood
> environment, so the intake receives only outside air, preferably under
> positive pressure. As an engine bay air inlet, I'm not sure how well a
> hole in the firewall would work. It might become an outlet.
>
> For that matter, I've read claims that Miata TSIs actually act as air
> outlets. Dunno if that's true, but airflow is complex, and may not
> behave the way you'd think.
>
> Hood louvers might work OK...unless they'd bleed off air needed to cool
> the transmission or something. I suspect that nothing on the Miata was
> done by accident, and everything is there for a good reason.


Thank you, sir. That makes sense to me.

The previous owner claims to have modified the temperature gauge to be
more accurate.

Not sure how that was done, but it always shows a little higher than the
stock gauge does on other Miatas, and in the summer during the hottest
part of the day it climbs to an uncomfortably high point.

The infrared thermometer verified that the temperature was still within
normal operating range. It only takes a few degrees to move the needle a
good amount.

Removing the turn signal caused the needle to drop back down almost to
where it sits during the colder times of the year.

I am guessing that having no driver-side turn signal, or a turn signal
intake will increase the air flow going in to the engine compartment and
that this is a good thing on this car. I am not, however, positive on
anything even related to most simple matters, certainly not on complex
subjects like air flow. :-)

Thanks again!

Pat
  #7  
Old April 4th 10, 01:38 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

Chris D'Agnolo wrote:
>
> "Lanny Chambers" > wrote in message > If it's
> stock, put the heat shield back on. If not, make one. The forum
>> is full of stories of tape wraps eventually causing header rot.
>>
>>> 5) I believe my best bet is a 'Randal Cowl' type of set up pulling
>>> air from
>>> behind the firewall however, I'm trying to minimize my cost for this
>>> improvement and think this might entail buying allot of stuff.

>>
>> Yes, the Randall is the best solution. Plenty of owners have made DIY
>> versions cheaply, and while they're probably not as efficient as the FM
>> product, they have to be better than any scheme involving a cone filter.
>> Hope you still have your OEM airbox. Search miataforum for examples.
>>
>> --
>> Lanny Chambers
>> St. Louis, MO
>> '94C

>
> Previous owner installed the monsterflow and didn't pass along the OEM
> part. Maybe I can find someone interested in trading.
>
> Header is J.R.so, no bolt up points. I'll have to get creative here.
>
> Chris
> 99BBB


I will keep an eye out for a 1999 OEM intake for you.

Will an intake from any 1999-2005 Miata work? (excluding the MSM turbo
Miata, of course).

Pat
  #8  
Old April 4th 10, 04:30 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

pws wrote:

> The previous owner claims to have modified the temperature gauge to be
> more accurate.


Bad wording there, the temp gauge/sensor was modified to be more
sensitive to fluctuations.

Any idea how this would be done? The accuracy is actually off because it
shows a little hot when it is at normal operating temperatures, but
small temperature changes that would not register at all on my previous
stock temperature gauge will cause the needle to move on this one.

Pat
  #9  
Old April 6th 10, 12:11 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chris D'Agnolo[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 587
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps


"pws" > wrote in message news:hpa183>>
>> Previous owner installed the monsterflow and didn't pass along the OEM
>> part. Maybe I can find someone interested in trading.
>>
>> Header is J.R.so, no bolt up points. I'll have to get creative here.
>>
>> Chris
>> 99BBB

>
> I will keep an eye out for a 1999 OEM intake for you.
>
> Will an intake from any 1999-2005 Miata work? (excluding the MSM turbo
> Miata, of course).
>
> Pat



I think so. I know there were some variations but I don't think they would
be functionally different, would they?

Chris
99BBB

  #10  
Old April 6th 10, 02:48 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default Reducing Intake Air Temps

Chris D'Agnolo wrote:
>
> "pws" > wrote in message news:hpa183>>
>>> Previous owner installed the monsterflow and didn't pass along the
>>> OEM part. Maybe I can find someone interested in trading.
>>>
>>> Header is J.R.so, no bolt up points. I'll have to get creative here.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>> 99BBB

>>
>> I will keep an eye out for a 1999 OEM intake for you.
>>
>> Will an intake from any 1999-2005 Miata work? (excluding the MSM turbo
>> Miata, of course).
>>
>> Pat

>
>
> I think so. I know there were some variations but I don't think they
> would be functionally different, would they?
>
> Chris
> 99BBB


My NB knowledge is quite limited, especially compared to the NA.

Can someone who is more familiar with the 1999-2005 model Miatas offer
some advice on this?

Thanks,

Pat
 




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