Tell them h--- no.......... police state.......Police want to scanlicense plates on I-15

On Sun, 20 May 2012 10:38:24 -0500, "Tom $herman (-_-)"
"> wrote:

>On 5/19/2012 9:02 PM, Jim Yanik wrote:
>> [...]
>> Worse,because police concentrate on speed traps,they aren't catching RL
>> runners,improper lane changers,left-lane bandits,tailgaters,all the stuff
>> that REALLY causes "accidents" or screws up traffic flow.
>>
>I think mobile car crushers should be implemented for tailgaters. Or
>allow the use of RPG's in self-defense.
>
>Of course, since radar guns, VASCAR, LIDAR, etc. produce a hard number
>rather than a subjective judgement, it makes it easier to get
>convictions, which raises revenue for the police and their governmental
>body (what traffic enforcement in the US is mostly about).

The main reason it's easy to get a conviction is because they made
them civil violations where all you need to the slightest hint of
guilt, not a preponderance of evidence like for a real crime. And
because they took away your right to a jury trial, and because they
make juries think they can't find you innocent if they feel the law is
being wrongly applied. They also made the mere fact that you exceeded
an arbitrary number civil offense whether it creates any danger or
not. Speeding tickets are 99% bull****.

On 5/20/2012 10:51 AM, John David Galt wrote:
> On 2012-05-20 08:38, Tom $herman (-_-)> wrote:
>> I think mobile car crushers should be implemented for tailgaters. Or allow
>> the use of RPG's in self-defense.
>
> When they invent tech that makes it possible to prevent anyone from stealing my
> space, I'll stop tailgating. Until then, live with it.
>
Many people tailgate on 2-lane rural highways, where someone cutting
into the space in front is not going to happen (particularly in all the
cases where no third vehicle is present).

Of course, by your postings, you live up to the anti-social nature of
the fictional John Galt.

>> Of course, since radar guns, VASCAR, LIDAR, etc. produce a hard number rather
>> than a subjective judgement, it makes it easier to get convictions, which
>> raises revenue for the police and their governmental body (what traffic
>> enforcement in the US is mostly about).
>
> They give the appearance of a hard number, but it is quite easy for the cop with
> the radar gun in his hand to get whatever results he wants (or misread the ones
> he gets) simply by aiming it wrong.
>
Or with a tuning fork.

> At any rate, both speeding and tailgating are victimless crimes. Until an actual
> crash takes place, no one has done wrong unless he violates right-of-way. The
> law will be rightly scoffed at by everyone until it adjusts to accept this fact.

Wrong buddy. Tailgating is illegal, and a violation of the space the
the driver in front has a right too.

But not a surprising attitude, considering the source.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731°N, 83.985007°W
Post Free or Die!

On 5/20/2012 11:06 AM, Ashton Crusher wrote:
> On Sun, 20 May 2012 10:38:24 -0500, "Tom $herman (-_-)"
> "> wrote:
>
>> On 5/19/2012 9:02 PM, Jim Yanik wrote:
>>> [...]
>>> Worse,because police concentrate on speed traps,they aren't catching RL
>>> runners,improper lane changers,left-lane bandits,tailgaters,all the stuff
>>> that REALLY causes "accidents" or screws up traffic flow.
>>>
>> I think mobile car crushers should be implemented for tailgaters. Or
>> allow the use of RPG's in self-defense.
>>
>> Of course, since radar guns, VASCAR, LIDAR, etc. produce a hard number
>> rather than a subjective judgement, it makes it easier to get
>> convictions, which raises revenue for the police and their governmental
>> body (what traffic enforcement in the US is mostly about).
>
> The main reason it's easy to get a conviction is because they made
> them civil violations where all you need to the slightest hint of
> guilt, not a preponderance of evidence like for a real crime. And
> because they took away your right to a jury trial, and because they
> make juries think they can't find you innocent if they feel the law is
> being wrongly applied. They also made the mere fact that you exceeded
> an arbitrary number civil offense whether it creates any danger or
> not. Speeding tickets are 99% bull****.

Of course, the insurance lobby loves speeding tickets, since they can
jack up rates.

But then, we (USians) live in a country where freedom is mostly an
illusion, unless you are super-rich or a corporation - then you can do
as you please.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731°N, 83.985007°W
Post Free or Die!

>> At any rate, both speeding and tailgating are victimless crimes. Until an actual
>> crash takes place, no one has done wrong unless he violates right-of-way. The
>> law will be rightly scoffed at by everyone until it adjusts to accept this fact.

> Wrong buddy. Tailgating is illegal, and a violation of the space the the driver
> in front has a right too [sic].

A motorcyclist complaining about "his" space being violated is the pot calling the
kettle black.

Safe driving = everyone staying in his own "box" (therefore no slot-riding).
I have yet to meet a motorcyclist or even bicyclist who accepts this principle.

(But the space between me and the guy ahead is part of MY "box", not his.)

On 5/20/2012 11:41 AM, John David Galt wrote:
>>> At any rate, both speeding and tailgating are victimless crimes. Until an actual
>>> crash takes place, no one has done wrong unless he violates right-of-way. The
>>> law will be rightly scoffed at by everyone until it adjusts to accept this fact.
>
>> Wrong buddy. Tailgating is illegal, and a violation of the space the the driver
>> in front has a right too [sic].
>
> A motorcyclist complaining about "his" space being violated is the pot calling the
> kettle black.
>
How so?

> Safe driving = everyone staying in his own "box" (therefore no slot-riding).
> I have yet to meet a motorcyclist or even bicyclist who accepts this principle.
>
> (But the space between me and the guy ahead is part of MY "box", not his.)

Bull**** on the last item. Legally and by every driving code.

Filtering or lane splitting is legal in California and most of Europe,
and should be legal in all places for motorcycles and scooters.

And bicycles being allowed to legally filter is the price you pay for
being allowed to share a lane with a bicycle, rather than always having
to change lanes to pass one.

You are just jealous of the superiority of 2 wheels compared to 4 wheels
in congested traffic. And highly selfish and anti-social to boot.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731°N, 83.985007°W
Post Free or Die!

clairbear > wrote in
:

> "Sid9" <sid9@ bellsouth.net> wrote in :
>
>>
>> "Wayne" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "hippy dippy dude" <""\"\"\"@bet sweet.bipy"> wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=2044...ant-to-scan-li
>>>> cense-plates-on-i-15&s_cid=featured-2
>>> Another bull**** government overreach program for those who want more
>>> government. After they scan your plate, the next step of course is
>>> to check your speed and issue computer generated tickets.
>>>
>>> Any time you have an agency, the agency will try to survive and grow.
>>> There is no end to the excuses they will use to justify any hair
>>> brained scheme.
>>>
>>> This looks like they have more people than tasks, and need people
>>> cut, instead of creating work.
>>>
>>
>> What's wrong with computer generated speeding tickets?
>> Speeders are a serious danger to the public.

"speeding" is NOT a "serious danger" to the public;
police wrongly attribute all sorts of accidents to "speeding".

the major problem is lane discipline.

>>
>>
>>
>
> So is drunk driving but you have,nt been caught yet
>



--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

Ashton Crusher > wrote in
:

> On Sun, 20 May 2012 10:38:24 -0500, "Tom $herman (-_-)"
"> wrote:
>
>>On 5/19/2012 9:02 PM, Jim Yanik wrote:
>>> [...]
>>> Worse,because police concentrate on speed traps,they aren't catching
>>> RL runners,improper lane changers,left-lane bandits,tailgaters,all
>>> the stuff that REALLY causes "accidents" or screws up traffic flow.
>>>
>>I think mobile car crushers should be implemented for tailgaters. Or
>>allow the use of RPG's in self-defense.

you obviously have never been stuck behind a LLB,a self-appointed "traffic
enforcer".

>>
>>Of course, since radar guns, VASCAR, LIDAR, etc. produce a hard number
>>rather than a subjective judgement, it makes it easier to get
>>convictions, which raises revenue for the police and their
>>governmental body (what traffic enforcement in the US is mostly
>>about).


radar guns have "clocked" houses at speed,and there's no knowing exactly
what the gun is measuring. Laser guns can read wrong because they can
measure off two different places on the vehicle or are subject to handheld
shaking(the certifications were done on a TRIPOD),and there's NO visible
indicator of where the beam is hitting(no boresighting to insure the
actual,invisible beam is hitting where the reticule indicates).
VASCAR depends on the officer pressing the measurement button at the right
time,they can be fudged to get whatver speed you want.(VASCAR is just a
fancy computerized stopwatch)
As for "hard numbers",the officer can write down any number he feels like
ON THE TICKET,as the speed guns do not print out any copy for evidence.

>
> The main reason it's easy to get a conviction is because they made
> them civil violations where all you need to the slightest hint of
> guilt, not a preponderance of evidence like for a real crime. And
> because they took away your right to a jury trial, and because they
> make juries think they can't find you innocent if they feel the law is
> being wrongly applied. They also made the mere fact that you exceeded
> an arbitrary number civil offense whether it creates any danger or
> not. Speeding tickets are 99% bull****.
>



--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

On 5/20/2012 12:11 PM, Jim Yanik wrote:
> Ashton > wrote in
> :
>
>> On Sun, 20 May 2012 10:38:24 -0500, "Tom $herman (-_-)"
>> "> wrote:
>>
>>> On 5/19/2012 9:02 PM, Jim Yanik wrote:
>>>> [...]
>>>> Worse,because police concentrate on speed traps,they aren't catching
>>>> RL runners,improper lane changers,left-lane bandits,tailgaters,all
>>>> the stuff that REALLY causes "accidents" or screws up traffic flow.
>>>>
>>> I think mobile car crushers should be implemented for tailgaters. Or
>>> allow the use of RPG's in self-defense.
>
> you obviously have never been stuck behind a LLB,a self-appointed "traffic
> enforcer".
>
So that explains why I have been tailgated in the following situations:

A. Far right or right-lane of controlled-access roads and expressways
(this is the US, so passing lane is on the left). Some have even gone
as far as to flash their brights - WTF, am I supposed to move over to
the passing lane to let them by?
B. In heavy traffic where I cannot go faster - WTF, am I supposed to
tailgate the vehicle ahead of me, or ram them off the road?
C. On two-lane rural roads where there are plenty of passing
opportunities, but the cager behind me is too chicken**** to pass. (I
actually used to use the first safe place to pull off to let people by,
until I got fed up with their rudeness. Still will pull off, if they do
not tailgate. [1], [2])
D. Right lane of rural freeways and expressways, where the cars are
separated by 1000+ feet, so passing on the left would be no issue. In
some cases the cager has caught up to me, and tailgated instead of passing.
E. On a narrow (two 9-foot wide lanes, no shoulder) steel-grate deck
bridge in the rain when I was on a moto. Actually stopped and got off
to tell the cager behind me how she was putting my life in danger, but
she took off in fear.

Notice, not a single goddamn incidence of being a LLB bandit here

This is why I speed for safety on a moto, so the slower cars become
effective blockers of the tailgating arseholes.

[1] Once when fed up with a tailgater at night making it hard to see, I
pulled off on the shoulder. Car tailgating pulls off after me and blue
and red lights come on. Female deputy asks why I pulled off, and I told
her that it was for safety, since she would hit me if I had to do an
emergency stop if a deer ran out or vehicle pulled out in front of me.
She went dumb, handed back my license and insurance card, and mumbled
"drive safely". Sometimes you do win one.

[2] Another time on Wisconsin Highway 69 (seriously - look at a map), I
pulled over into the truck climbing lane (temporary increase from 2-lane
to 3-lane road). Instead of passing in the regular lane, the tailgater
switched lanes with me. I slowed down from ~55 mph to ~20 mph, and
still they did not pass. I pulled over on the shoulder and stopped, and
they stopped in the truck lane about 20 feet behind me. I shifter into
reverse and hit the gas to get behind them before they could react.
Finally, after doing this, they went on their way ahead of me. WTF?

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731°N, 83.985007°W
Post Free or Die!

"Nate Nagel" > wrote in message
...
> On 05/19/2012 04:22 PM, Sid9 wrote:
>>
>> "Wayne" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "hippy dippy dude" <""\"\"\"@bet sweet.bipy"> wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=2044...cid=featured-2
>>>>
>>> Another bull**** government overreach program for those who want more
>>> government. After they scan your plate, the next step of course is to
>>> check your speed and issue computer generated tickets.
>>>
>>> Any time you have an agency, the agency will try to survive and grow.
>>> There is no end to the excuses they will use to justify any hair
>>> brained scheme.
>>>
>>> This looks like they have more people than tasks, and need people cut,
>>> instead of creating work.
>>>
>>
>> What's wrong with computer generated speeding tickets?
>> Speeders are a serious danger to the public.
>>
>
> Cite?
>
> --
> replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
> http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Cite what?
That speeders are a danger to the rest of us?

"clairbear" > wrote in message
...
> "Sid9" <sid9@ bellsouth.net> wrote in :
>
>>
>> "Wayne" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "hippy dippy dude" <""\"\"\"@bet sweet.bipy"> wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=2044...ant-to-scan-li
>>>> cense-plates-on-i-15&s_cid=featured-2
>>> Another bull**** government overreach program for those who want more
>>> government. After they scan your plate, the next step of course is
>>> to check your speed and issue computer generated tickets.
>>>
>>> Any time you have an agency, the agency will try to survive and grow.
>>> There is no end to the excuses they will use to justify any hair
>>> brained scheme.
>>>
>>> This looks like they have more people than tasks, and need people
>>> cut, instead of creating work.
>>>
>>
>> What's wrong with computer generated speeding tickets?
>> Speeders are a serious danger to the public.
>>
>>
>>
>
> So is drunk driving but you have,nt been caught yet
..
..
..
Still got that ADD?
The subject is speeding and it's inherent danger.
Seek help