Followup-- 2000 JGC V-8 still overheating

On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:12:34 -0500, Mike Romain >
wrote:

>There is this 20 mile
>long up hill on the way to a relative's cottage on a 70 mph in the slow
>lane highway that causes both our Cherokee and CJ7 to run hotter than
>normal to the point I pulled over in the same garage to check it out
>thinking I was having problems.


I am a big beleiver is properly designed cooling systems. Lot of newer
vehicals come with marginal cooling systems to reduce production cost
and that cannot cope with higher engine outputs for sustained periods
of times because they have less reserve. If I had a vehical that
heated on a long climb I would fix it via either improved fan clutch a
bigger radiator or both. I am one of these old fashsion guys that
beleive a truck or 4x4 should be able to keep its cool no matter what.
While I have not been happy with my 2000 K3500 in some ways because of
a lot of warranty issue., none of them have been about drivabilty or
cooling. Once a towed a 8K trailer when it was 95 plus out with A/C on
full chill blowing snowflake in cab and it never even got close to 210
even on long highway hills with that load and even stopped in traffic
too. Why, because that is one thing GM got right on it. It has a big
raditor and a massive 10 blade clutch fan with agressive timing that
keeps it cool no matter what. Even my old 89 burb has NEVER been above
210 in its life and it has seen 0ver 105 degrees and in 2003 it was
climbing through Mesa Verade when it was in high 90's at low speed
with heavy load and full A/C. Vehicle only run hot when the cooling
system is not up to the job, not because they have too. Good cooling
with stable temps equal longer drive train life.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com

The problem is the loss of fins due to road salt 'and' a marginal system.

In the Cherokee is is so marginal that a second fan is needed if you
have AC. Ours doesn't but I just got a parts machine that has 'more'
but not all of the fins on the rad and it and the second fan I am going
to move over.

My CJ7, well...., I have too much stuff out front, a winch and Hella
lights and need a V8 3 core rad instead of the 'marginal' stock 2 core
one. When I can't fix that rad anymore, (have snapped it in half twice)
I will go with the bigger one, otherwise I keep the speed down below 75
mph on hot days...

Mike

SnoMan wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:12:34 -0500, Mike Romain >
> wrote:
>
>> There is this 20 mile
>> long up hill on the way to a relative's cottage on a 70 mph in the slow
>> lane highway that causes both our Cherokee and CJ7 to run hotter than
>> normal to the point I pulled over in the same garage to check it out
>> thinking I was having problems.
>
>
> I am a big beleiver is properly designed cooling systems. Lot of newer
> vehicals come with marginal cooling systems to reduce production cost
> and that cannot cope with higher engine outputs for sustained periods
> of times because they have less reserve. If I had a vehical that
> heated on a long climb I would fix it via either improved fan clutch a
> bigger radiator or both. I am one of these old fashsion guys that
> beleive a truck or 4x4 should be able to keep its cool no matter what.
> While I have not been happy with my 2000 K3500 in some ways because of
> a lot of warranty issue., none of them have been about drivabilty or
> cooling. Once a towed a 8K trailer when it was 95 plus out with A/C on
> full chill blowing snowflake in cab and it never even got close to 210
> even on long highway hills with that load and even stopped in traffic
> too. Why, because that is one thing GM got right on it. It has a big
> raditor and a massive 10 blade clutch fan with agressive timing that
> keeps it cool no matter what. Even my old 89 burb has NEVER been above
> 210 in its life and it has seen 0ver 105 degrees and in 2003 it was
> climbing through Mesa Verade when it was in high 90's at low speed
> with heavy load and full A/C. Vehicle only run hot when the cooling
> system is not up to the job, not because they have too. Good cooling
> with stable temps equal longer drive train life.
> -----------------
> TheSnoMan.com

I belive that's what I said. Your vehicleS are an exception, because they
are maintained. 99% of vehicles on the road are NOT properly maintined.

Carl

"SnoMan" > wrote in message
news
> On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:24:34 -0800, "Carl"
> > wrote:
>
>>With average maintenance, at 120K a radiator is usually ready to be
>>replaced. Your vehicles are the exception, not the rule.
>
>
> They all are then because none of them are bad. The rule is if you
> properly maintian them they will last the life of vehicle barring
> damge from impact. I have seen radiator fail in far few miles than
> 120K that were not properly maintained and age seem to be a bigger
> factor than miles too with improper maintainance because the water is
> reacting with it when it is just sitting there.
> -----------------
> TheSnoMan.com

How many of those people change thier diff lube, coolant, power steering
fluid, brake fluid, ect on time?

Carl


"Earle Horton" > wrote in message
m...
>I don't know where you get your information but I know plenty of people who
> take their vehicles in for 3000 mile oil changes and whatever it says in
> the
> owner's manual or what their favorite mechanic can sell them on. I would
> agree with "most" but "99%" seems like an exaggeration. There are systems
> and parts that are designed to last the normal life of the vehicle too.
> The
> radiator is one of them. Living near the ocean, overheating the engine,
> not
> replacing hoses and putting strange mixtures of coolants can shorten this
> considerably.
>
> Earle
>
> "Carl" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> I belive that's what I said. Your vehicleS are an exception, because they
>> are maintained. 99% of vehicles on the road are NOT properly maintined.
>>
>> Carl
>>
>> "SnoMan" > wrote in message
>> news
>> > On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:24:34 -0800, "Carl"
>> > > wrote:
>> >
>> >>With average maintenance, at 120K a radiator is usually ready to be
>> >>replaced. Your vehicles are the exception, not the rule.
>> >
>> >
>> > They all are then because none of them are bad. The rule is if you
>> > properly maintian them they will last the life of vehicle barring
>> > damge from impact. I have seen radiator fail in far few miles than
>> > 120K that were not properly maintained and age seem to be a bigger
>> > factor than miles too with improper maintainance because the water is
>> > reacting with it when it is just sitting there.
>> > -----------------
>> > TheSnoMan.com
>>
>>
>
>

I don't know where you get your information but I know plenty of people who
take their vehicles in for 3000 mile oil changes and whatever it says in the
owner's manual or what their favorite mechanic can sell them on. I would
agree with "most" but "99%" seems like an exaggeration. There are systems
and parts that are designed to last the normal life of the vehicle too. The
radiator is one of them. Living near the ocean, overheating the engine, not
replacing hoses and putting strange mixtures of coolants can shorten this
considerably.

Earle

"Carl" > wrote in message
. ..
> I belive that's what I said. Your vehicleS are an exception, because they
> are maintained. 99% of vehicles on the road are NOT properly maintined.
>
> Carl
>
> "SnoMan" > wrote in message
> news
> > On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:24:34 -0800, "Carl"
> > > wrote:
> >
> >>With average maintenance, at 120K a radiator is usually ready to be
> >>replaced. Your vehicles are the exception, not the rule.
> >
> >
> > They all are then because none of them are bad. The rule is if you
> > properly maintian them they will last the life of vehicle barring
> > damge from impact. I have seen radiator fail in far few miles than
> > 120K that were not properly maintained and age seem to be a bigger
> > factor than miles too with improper maintainance because the water is
> > reacting with it when it is just sitting there.
> > -----------------
> > TheSnoMan.com
>
>

hmmm
I always wondered what the factory means when they claim something is
"LIFETIME" lol
The vehicles I repair come from the factory saying that the fluids in the
transaxles (both auto and manual), cooling system are all lifetime fluids.
AFAIK They can even get away with oil changes every 2 years or 15,000 kms,
but not in the USA.

I would say only a few people change their brake fluid every 2 years though,
and I don't know any of them
Some people don't even read their owner's manuals to know what they need to
do! 8^)
They have to trust their repair shops which usually repair problems and
usually aren't focusing on maintenance. ;-(

You are right........most people don't "maintain" their vehicles on time not
even me! ;-)

JMHO
--
later,
dave AKA vwdoc1



"Carl" > wrote
> How many of those people change thier diff lube, coolant, power steering
> fluid, brake fluid, ect on time?
>
> Carl

I don't either.

Carl

"dave AKA vwdoc1" > wrote in message
et...
> hmmm
> I always wondered what the factory means when they claim something is
> "LIFETIME" lol
> The vehicles I repair come from the factory saying that the fluids in the
> transaxles (both auto and manual), cooling system are all lifetime fluids.
> AFAIK They can even get away with oil changes every 2 years or 15,000 kms,
> but not in the USA.
>
> I would say only a few people change their brake fluid every 2 years
> though, and I don't know any of them
> Some people don't even read their owner's manuals to know what they need
> to do! 8^)
> They have to trust their repair shops which usually repair problems and
> usually aren't focusing on maintenance. ;-(
>
> You are right........most people don't "maintain" their vehicles on time
> not even me! ;-)
>
> JMHO
> --
> later,
> dave AKA vwdoc1
>
>
>
> "Carl" > wrote
>> How many of those people change thier diff lube, coolant, power steering
>> fluid, brake fluid, ect on time?
>>
>> Carl
>
>

When I went to Auto Zone for fluid for the XJ's diffs, the guy looked at
me funny and made some comment about not seeing the need for it until
the vehicle was like 30 years old.
I shrugged my shoulders and bought the fluid.
Of course, I guess he 'does' work at Auto Zone for a reason...

Carl wrote:
> I don't either.
>
> Carl
>
> "dave AKA vwdoc1" > wrote in message
> et...
>> hmmm
>> I always wondered what the factory means when they claim something is
>> "LIFETIME" lol
>> The vehicles I repair come from the factory saying that the fluids in the
>> transaxles (both auto and manual), cooling system are all lifetime fluids.
>> AFAIK They can even get away with oil changes every 2 years or 15,000 kms,
>> but not in the USA.
>>
>> I would say only a few people change their brake fluid every 2 years
>> though, and I don't know any of them
>> Some people don't even read their owner's manuals to know what they need
>> to do! 8^)
>> They have to trust their repair shops which usually repair problems and
>> usually aren't focusing on maintenance. ;-(
>>
>> You are right........most people don't "maintain" their vehicles on time
>> not even me! ;-)
>>
>> JMHO
>> --
>> later,
>> dave AKA vwdoc1
>>
>>
>>
>> "Carl" > wrote
>>> How many of those people change thier diff lube, coolant, power steering
>>> fluid, brake fluid, ect on time?
>>>
>>> Carl
>>
>
>

He's a grade A moron. Every 50,000 miles for a street vehicle, 10,000 if you
wheel, and every time you get water in there.

Carl


"The Merg" > wrote in message
...
> When I went to Auto Zone for fluid for the XJ's diffs, the guy looked at
> me funny and made some comment about not seeing the need for it until the
> vehicle was like 30 years old.
> I shrugged my shoulders and bought the fluid.
> Of course, I guess he 'does' work at Auto Zone for a reason...
>
> Carl wrote:
>> I don't either.
>>
>> Carl
>>
>> "dave AKA vwdoc1" > wrote in message
>> et...
>>> hmmm
>>> I always wondered what the factory means when they claim something is
>>> "LIFETIME" lol
>>> The vehicles I repair come from the factory saying that the fluids in
>>> the transaxles (both auto and manual), cooling system are all lifetime
>>> fluids.
>>> AFAIK They can even get away with oil changes every 2 years or 15,000
>>> kms, but not in the USA.
>>>
>>> I would say only a few people change their brake fluid every 2 years
>>> though, and I don't know any of them
>>> Some people don't even read their owner's manuals to know what they need
>>> to do! 8^)
>>> They have to trust their repair shops which usually repair problems and
>>> usually aren't focusing on maintenance. ;-(
>>>
>>> You are right........most people don't "maintain" their vehicles on time
>>> not even me! ;-)
>>>
>>> JMHO
>>> --
>>> later,
>>> dave AKA vwdoc1
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Carl" > wrote
>>>> How many of those people change thier diff lube, coolant, power
>>>> steering fluid, brake fluid, ect on time?
>>>>
>>>> Carl
>>>
>>

I wonder if the factory even knows when they say "LIFETIME"! lol
I guess it means it will last until you need to replace it! ;-)

His JGC is already 6-7 years old and anything can go bad.
Things just need to make sense..................and the $64,000 question
is..........WHY???????????? :-)


"Carl" > wrote in message
. ..
>I don't either.
>
> Carl
>

> "dave AKA vwdoc1" > wrote in message
> et...
>> hmmm
>> I always wondered what the factory means when they claim something is
>> "LIFETIME" lol