HELP: 93 Toyota Corolla vibration problem!

wrote:
> On Apr 8, 12:21 pm, wrote:
>> I have a 1993ToyotaCorollawith 265k miles on it. There is a
>> vibration that has the following symptoms:
> <snip>
>
> Well, I did replace the calipers 3k ago. Could it be that the
> passenger-front one is bad? They were rebuilds after all... and that
> is the side that is heating up...


Yes, that is certainly a possibility. If you did something to the
brakes, then things started heating up, then chances are something that
you did to the brakes caused the problem.

Jeff

On Apr 21, 11:03 am, Jeff > wrote:
> wrote:
> > On Apr 8, 12:21 pm, wrote:
> >> I have a 1993ToyotaCorollawith 265k miles on it. There is a
> >> vibration that has the following symptoms:
> > <snip>
>
> > Well, I did replace the calipers 3k ago. Could it be that the
> > passenger-front one is bad? They were rebuilds after all... and that
> > is the side that is heating up...
>
> Yes, that is certainly a possibility. If you did something to the
> brakes, then things started heating up, then chances are something that
> you did to the brakes caused the problem.
>
> Jeff

That's going to be my next test. The mechanic will replace that
caliper under warranty. Then I'll see if the problem persists. that
will be Thursday.

On Apr 21, 10:29*am, wrote:
> On Apr 19, 7:52 am, " krp" > wrote:
>
> > And so *the rotor will be a pretty MIDNIGHT BLUE. Do you think the guys in
> > the tire store would likely miss that?
>
> Well, the rotor was bluing, which is why i replaced them about 1000
> miles ago. *But, I think that is the symptom and not the disease.
> What can be causing the dragging? *could a bad booster cause it?

If it's only one wheel, I'd strongly suspect the hose. Second choice
would be frozen up mounting hardware causing a single piston caliper
not to float freely. A booster, master cylinder, or pushrod
adjustment issue would show up on at least two if not all four wheels.

nate

On Apr 21, 10:45*am, wrote:
> On Apr 19, 7:43 am, " krp" > wrote:
>
> > some stuff...
>
> Well, at one point like the rotors were bluing like 1000 miles ago and
> I replaced them. *The hoses were replaced 3 days ago, this did not fix
> it either. *The calipers are 3k old. *Could it be the brake booster
> since the problem is intermitten and only shows up once in a while?
>
> Also, could the vibration be caused by the hot wheel overheating the
> tire? *How warped would a wheel have to be to cause this? *There is
> only vibration when the brakes are dragging. *The other day i drove to
> the airport (60 miles with no traffic at 3AM) and it only did it once
> for 10 miles. *I did not have to use my brakes at all for the entire
> highway portion of the trip, but it still started to drag and then
> vibrate half way into the trip. *Please notice that i said it drags
> THEN vibrates. *You can feel that you need more gas pedal effort to
> move the car and then the vibration starts gradually shortly
> thereafter and builds up in intensity. *Does this extra info help you?

Hmm. disregard my last post then. Did you thoroughly clean the
mounting hardware (esp. sliders) when you replaced the calipers?
Assuming, of course, that these are single piston type with sliders.

Do you have any noticeable play in that wheel bearing? I can't see
how that would cause the brakes to drag/rotor to overheat, but it
seems like you've covered the likely culprits already.

nate

> wrote in message
...
> On Apr 18, 3:48 am, " krp" > wrote:
>> "Ray O" <rokigawaATtristarassociatesDOTcom> wrote in message
>
>> 1. Bent wheel.
> The tire shop showed me how the wheels turn on a machine. There is a
> small bit of run-out. But it was slight. Also, wouldn't run out
> cause a constant vibration?

Yes

>
>> 2. Bad wheel balance.
> The rebalanced when they put new tires on under waranty. The
> vibration still intermitently.
>
>> 3. Bad bearing.
> My mechanic says that when a bearing is shot, you can wobble the wheel
> when it is on the lift by pulling on it. The wheel didn't exhibit
> this behavior.

A bad bearing will not always have play in it but it should be noisy. I have
never seen a bad bearing cause a vibration.

>
>> 4. Bad rotor or worn spindle.
> Rotors are 3k old. Never turned before.

Even thought the rotor is fairly new if it was warped from the brakes being
applied it needs to be machined or possibly even replaced.


>
>> 5. Suspension parts. (there are several high failure parts on thecorolla)
> Mechanic says he checked thoroughly through all of them...

"N8N" > wrote in message
...
On Apr 21, 10:29 am, wrote:
> On Apr 19, 7:52 am, " krp" > wrote:
>
> > And so the rotor will be a pretty MIDNIGHT BLUE. Do you think the guys
> > in
> > the tire store would likely miss that?
>
> Well, the rotor was bluing, which is why i replaced them about 1000
> miles ago. But, I think that is the symptom and not the disease.
> What can be causing the dragging? could a bad booster cause it?

If it's only one wheel, I'd strongly suspect the hose. Second choice
would be frozen up mounting hardware causing a single piston caliper
not to float freely. A booster, master cylinder, or pushrod
adjustment issue would show up on at least two if not all four wheels.

nate

<JS>
I agree with N8. Since the claim is that only one corner is affected, I'd go
with a failure that is local to only that corner, not a failure that leads
to all four corners.

Having said that, the rear brakes are drum type, and if they were
maladjusted (too loose), then they could be held partially activated and you
would never know. This would tend to suggest the master cylinder. The linked
rear brake would be the diagonal corner, by the way.

I'd be looking at the local problems though before I looked at systemic
problems.


</JS>

> wrote in message
...
> On Apr 19, 7:52 am, " krp" > wrote:
>> And so the rotor will be a pretty MIDNIGHT BLUE. Do you think the guys in
>> the tire store would likely miss that?
>
> Well, the rotor was bluing, which is why i replaced them about 1000
> miles ago. But, I think that is the symptom and not the disease.
> What can be causing the dragging?

You stated that it is only one front wheel that is getting hot so it would
have to be the caliper, pads, brake hose or steel line going to that
particular wheel.


could a bad booster cause it?

No. A bad booster would affect all wheels. When a booster fails it will
generally make the brake pedal hard to depress.

On Apr 21, 11:53*am, "Jeff Strickland" > wrote:
> "N8N" > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Apr 21, 10:29 am, wrote:
>
> > On Apr 19, 7:52 am, " krp" > wrote:
>
> > > And so the rotor will be a pretty MIDNIGHT BLUE. Do you think the guys
> > > in
> > > the tire store would likely miss that?
>
> > Well, the rotor was bluing, which is why i replaced them about 1000
> > miles ago. But, I think that is the symptom and not the disease.
> > What can be causing the dragging? could a bad booster cause it?
>
> If it's only one wheel, I'd strongly suspect the hose. *Second choice
> would be frozen up mounting hardware causing a single piston caliper
> not to float freely. *A booster, master cylinder, or pushrod
> adjustment issue would show up on at least two if not all four wheels.
>
> nate
>
> <JS>
> I agree with N8. Since the claim is that only one corner is affected, I'd go
> with a failure that is local to only that corner, not a failure that leads
> to all four corners.
>
> Having said that, the rear brakes are drum type, and if they were
> maladjusted (too loose), then they could be held partially activated and you
> would never know. This would tend to suggest the master cylinder. The linked
> rear brake would be the diagonal corner, by the way.
>
> I'd be looking at the local problems though before I looked at systemic
> problems.
>
> </JS>


Good point, but that would also imply that the self-adjusting hardware
was frozen up on at least one rear wheel. Not impossible, but would
imply two simultaneous problems. That said, it might not be a bad
idea to check anyway, since the OP has apparently tried all the
obvious stuff.

nate

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
>
> > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Apr 19, 7:52 am, " krp" > wrote:
>>> And so the rotor will be a pretty MIDNIGHT BLUE. Do you think the guys
>>> in
>>> the tire store would likely miss that?
>>
>> Well, the rotor was bluing, which is why i replaced them about 1000
>> miles ago. But, I think that is the symptom and not the disease.
>> What can be causing the dragging?
>
> You stated that it is only one front wheel that is getting hot so it
> would have to be the caliper, pads, brake hose or steel line going to that
> particular wheel.
>
>
> could a bad booster cause it?
>
> No. A bad booster would affect all wheels. When a booster fails it will
> generally make the brake pedal hard to depress.
>
>

The Booster would not give the symptoms. The Master Cylinder _might_ (but
very doubtful) give the symptom because the rear brake is a drum, and one
would not notice it being bound if it was not adjusted well. And, even if it
was adjusted well, the springs pulling the shoes open could overpower the
pressure tryuing to close them, while the front disc brakes are held against
the rotor causing heat build up and rapid pad wear at the same time.

> wrote in message
...
> On Apr 19, 7:43 am, " krp" > wrote:
>> some stuff...
>
> Well, at one point like the rotors were bluing like 1000 miles ago and
> I replaced them. The hoses were replaced 3 days ago, this did not fix
> it either. The calipers are 3k old. Could it be the brake booster
> since the problem is intermitten and only shows up once in a while?

No

>
> Also, could the vibration be caused by the hot wheel overheating the
> tire?

No

How warped would a wheel have to be to cause this?

Extremely warped.


There is
> only vibration when the brakes are dragging.

Then your problem is with the brakes.


The other day i drove to
> the airport (60 miles with no traffic at 3AM) and it only did it once
> for 10 miles. I did not have to use my brakes at all for the entire
> highway portion of the trip, but it still started to drag and then
> vibrate half way into the trip. Please notice that i said it drags
> THEN vibrates.

Right, the brakes drag causing the rotor to get hot and warp which causes
the vibration.


You can feel that you need more gas pedal effort to
> move the car and then the vibration starts gradually shortly
> thereafter and builds up in intensity. Does this extra info help you?
>

Not really, you have covered this at least a half dozen times already.