Newsflash: Future Generation Cobra is All-Wheel-Drive!

Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
$80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD?

Thoughts?

Patrick

In article .com>, wrote:

> difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
> a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD?
> Thoughts?

Is this based on some source or just your random thoughts?

Would AWD even be possible on the current platform?

wrote:
> Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
> know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
> That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
> 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
> Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
> $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
> won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
> without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
> GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
> performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
> Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
> won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
> only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
> this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
> and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
> dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
> difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
> a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD?
>
> Thoughts?

To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they
will ruin a good thing.

As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact
I read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised
with the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a
car that is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD,
IRS, etc. is not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and
money trying to make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type
of car I won't be buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure
and that is coming from a true Mustang fan.

"Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message
...
> wrote:
>> Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
>> know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
>> That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
>> 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
>> Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
>> $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
>> won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
>> without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
>> GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
>> performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
>> Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
>> won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
>> only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
>> this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
>> and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
>> dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
>> difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
>> a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD? Thoughts?
>
> To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
> Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
> even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
> just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
> is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they will
> ruin a good thing.
>
> As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
> Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
> Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact I
> read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised with
> the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a car that
> is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD, IRS, etc. is
> not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and money trying to
> make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type of car I won't be
> buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure and that is coming
> from a true Mustang fan.


As a mustang variant, NO.

As the reintroduction of the original AC Cobra with 600+ Horsepower & AWD,
now that could work You know, put Ford back on top of the best bang for the
buck raw performance heap for another couple decades...

My Name Is Nobody wrote:
> "Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message
> ...
>> wrote:
>>> Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
>>> know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
>>> That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
>>> 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
>>> Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
>>> $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
>>> won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
>>> without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
>>> GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
>>> performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
>>> Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
>>> won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
>>> only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
>>> this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
>>> and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
>>> dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
>>> difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
>>> a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD? Thoughts?
>> To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
>> Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
>> even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
>> just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
>> is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they will
>> ruin a good thing.
>>
>> As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
>> Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
>> Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact I
>> read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised with
>> the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a car that
>> is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD, IRS, etc. is
>> not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and money trying to
>> make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type of car I won't be
>> buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure and that is coming
>> from a true Mustang fan.
>
>
> As a mustang variant, NO.
>
> As the reintroduction of the original AC Cobra with 600+ Horsepower & AWD,
> now that could work You know, put Ford back on top of the best bang for the
> buck raw performance heap for another couple decades...

If you are talking about a successor to the Ford GT then that is a whole
different matter, and car. For a MUSTANG Cobra to be AWD and a
technological tour-de-force is a huge stretch, IMO. I don't think it
will sell or be economically viable for Ford.

"Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message
...
> My Name Is Nobody wrote:
>> "Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> wrote:
>>>> Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
>>>> know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
>>>> That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
>>>> 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
>>>> Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
>>>> $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
>>>> won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
>>>> without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
>>>> GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
>>>> performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
>>>> Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
>>>> won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
>>>> only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
>>>> this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
>>>> and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
>>>> dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
>>>> difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
>>>> a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD? Thoughts?
>>> To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
>>> Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
>>> even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
>>> just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
>>> is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they
>>> will ruin a good thing.
>>>
>>> As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
>>> Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
>>> Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact
>>> I read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised
>>> with the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a
>>> car that is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD,
>>> IRS, etc. is not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and
>>> money trying to make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type
>>> of car I won't be buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure
>>> and that is coming from a true Mustang fan.
>>
>>
>> As a mustang variant, NO.
>>
>> As the reintroduction of the original AC Cobra with 600+ Horsepower &
>> AWD, now that could work You know, put Ford back on top of the best bang
>> for the buck raw performance heap for another couple decades...
>
> If you are talking about a successor to the Ford GT then that is a whole
> different matter, and car. For a MUSTANG Cobra to be AWD and a
> technological tour-de-force is a huge stretch, IMO. I don't think it will
> sell or be economically viable for Ford.

Not a Mustang, or the GT successor, something along the lines of the 2005
Ford Shelby Cobra concept, with the 605-horsepower, all-aluminum V-10 engine
and AWD...

http://www.stangnet.com/2005shelbycobraconcept/

My Name Is Nobody wrote:
> "Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message
> ...
>> My Name Is Nobody wrote:
>>> "Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
>>>>> know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
>>>>> That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
>>>>> 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
>>>>> Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
>>>>> $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
>>>>> won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
>>>>> without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
>>>>> GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
>>>>> performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
>>>>> Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
>>>>> won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
>>>>> only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
>>>>> this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
>>>>> and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
>>>>> dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
>>>>> difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
>>>>> a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD? Thoughts?
>>>> To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
>>>> Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
>>>> even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
>>>> just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
>>>> is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they
>>>> will ruin a good thing.
>>>>
>>>> As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
>>>> Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
>>>> Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact
>>>> I read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised
>>>> with the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a
>>>> car that is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD,
>>>> IRS, etc. is not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and
>>>> money trying to make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type
>>>> of car I won't be buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure
>>>> and that is coming from a true Mustang fan.
>>>
>>> As a mustang variant, NO.
>>>
>>> As the reintroduction of the original AC Cobra with 600+ Horsepower &
>>> AWD, now that could work You know, put Ford back on top of the best bang
>>> for the buck raw performance heap for another couple decades...
>> If you are talking about a successor to the Ford GT then that is a whole
>> different matter, and car. For a MUSTANG Cobra to be AWD and a
>> technological tour-de-force is a huge stretch, IMO. I don't think it will
>> sell or be economically viable for Ford.
>
> Not a Mustang, or the GT successor, something along the lines of the 2005
> Ford Shelby Cobra concept, with the 605-horsepower, all-aluminum V-10 engine
> and AWD...
>
> http://www.stangnet.com/2005shelbycobraconcept/

That car, or the GR-1, was supposed to replace the GT when its
production run was over. I guess it isn't likely to happen now that
Ford is so far in the red.

Brent P wrote:
> In article .com>, wrote:

> > difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
> > a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD?
> > Thoughts?

> Is this based on some source or just your random thoughts?

Just my thoughts.

> Would AWD even be possible on the current platform?

I doubt it. My thoughts were based on an new/updated platform.

Patrick

Michael Johnson, PE wrote:
> wrote:

All replies contained good counterpoints. (I especially like the modern
2-seat Cobra with the 600HP/V10 and AWD idea.) And I have to agree an
AWD Mustang would be too expensive for it's place in the market.
However, I do see a future Viper and/or Vette going AWD simply because
there just isn't any way to effectively hook more than 500 horsepower
on street tires.

Patrick

> > Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
> > know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
> > That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
> > 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
> > Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
> > $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
> > won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
> > without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
> > GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
> > performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
> > Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
> > won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
> > only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
> > this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
> > and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
> > dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
> > difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
> > a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD?

> > Thoughts?

> To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
> Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
> even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
> just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
> is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they
> will ruin a good thing.

> As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
> Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
> Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact
> I read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised
> with the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a
> car that is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD,
> IRS, etc. is not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and
> money trying to make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type
> of car I won't be buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure
> and that is coming from a true Mustang fan.

well last I knew there were dodges built in the 60s with puny 15 inch tires
and Hemi engines that got down the street fairly well. My best recollection
is that they had understated HP on those engines and by today's standards
the tires back then sucked for traction. Not sure though that dodge ever
made a Hemi cuda with AWD unless I am a bit senile.

> wrote in message
ps.com...
> Michael Johnson, PE wrote:
>> wrote:
>
> All replies contained good counterpoints. (I especially like the modern
> 2-seat Cobra with the 600HP/V10 and AWD idea.) And I have to agree an
> AWD Mustang would be too expensive for it's place in the market.
> However, I do see a future Viper and/or Vette going AWD simply because
> there just isn't any way to effectively hook more than 500 horsepower
> on street tires.
>
> Patrick
>
>> > Sounds crazy, doesn't it? But let's look at the big picture. We do
>> > know Nissan will send the next generation Skyline GT-R to the States.
>> > That car will have a 3.8 liter twin-turbo V6 pumping out "in excess of
>> > 500 horsepower", and as with previous generations it will be AWD.
>> > Okay, we know the Mustang isn't going to compete head-to-head with an
>> > $80K sports car. But we do know Dodge's Viper and Chevy's Corvette
>> > won't take Nissan's attempt to become the new "King of the Hill"
>> > without a fight. So what can Dodge and Chevy do to keep up with the
>> > GT-R's expected blistering -- 500+ horsepower PLUS velco-like AWD --
>> > performance? They could try upping the horsepower, but unless the
>> > Viper and Corvette start getting issued factory slicks horsepower alone
>> > won't be the answer. And with that assessment, the answer is, and can
>> > only be, AWD Vipers and Corvettes. Now how does Ford's Cobra fit into
>> > this picture? The Cobra has always played second fiddle to the Viper
>> > and Vette, but it has always tried to at least stay in sight of the big
>> > dogs' tail lights. And with the current generation GT500 having
>> > difficulties harnessing its 500 horsepower would it not make sense for
>> > a future Shelby/Cobra to have AWD?
>
>> > Thoughts?
>
>> To be honest, I don't think it will fly. Ford can't sell a bargain base
>> Mustang or GT and morph that level of car into an AWD Corvette killer or
>> even Corvette/Viper wannabe. The chassis physics and bean counter math
>> just doesn't work, IMO. They know the formula for selling Mustangs. It
>> is exactly what they are doing RIGHT NOW. They get to fancy and they
>> will ruin a good thing.
>
>> As a case in point, remember when everyone got up in arms about the new
>> Stang retaining the solid axle? Many said it would be a huge mistake.
>> Guess what? It didn't matter at all that they went "old tech". In fact
>> I read many complimentary articles about how test drivers are surprised
>> with the performance of the solid axle design. Mustang owners want a
>> car that is a solid performer that is priced right. Things like AWD,
>> IRS, etc. is not a requirement and Ford is just wasting their time and
>> money trying to make a technologically fancy Cobra. If I want that type
>> of car I won't be buying a Mustang. Of that you can be absolutely sure
>> and that is coming from a true Mustang fan.
>