is250 vs. 325i

I am interested in trading my Acura TL, and have
narrowed the most likely possible replacements to
the Lexus is250 and the BMW 325i, both with manual
transmission.

I am interested in whatever input anyone might
have. I have owned a number of Toyotas over the
years, but no Lexus and no BMW.

I have heard that Lexus takes Toyota's quality and
attention to detail to the next level, and that in
the long run BMW is very expensive to maintain. I
have friends who own both - and swear they
wouldn't drive anything else.

Suggestions, pros, cons, all info would be
appreciated.

Many thanks.

Robert

"Robert A. Cibiras" > wrote
>I am interested in trading my Acura TL, and have narrowed the most likely
>possible replacements to the Lexus is250 and the BMW 325i, both with manual
>transmission.
>
> I am interested in whatever input anyone might have. I have owned a number
> of Toyotas over the years, but no Lexus and no BMW.
>
> I have heard that Lexus takes Toyota's quality and attention to detail to
> the next level, and that in the long run BMW is very expensive to
> maintain. I have friends who own both - and swear they wouldn't drive
> anything else.

I don't know why people say that BMWs are expensive to maintain.
The Camry that I bought my mom has cost about the same as my 330xi.
Some parts for my T100 cost *MORE* than the same part for my 330xi -
for instance the starter solenoid went out and the entire starter had to be
replaced; the O2 sensor is TWICE as expensive as those on BMWs.
My wife's Highlander has more often maintenance intervals; in aggregate
they cost what it does for my 330xi. And the maintenance on the BMW
is free for 4yrs/50K.

YMMV.

FloydR

Floyd Rogers wrote:
> "Robert A. Cibiras" > wrote
>
>>I am interested in trading my Acura TL, and have narrowed the most likely
>>possible replacements to the Lexus is250 and the BMW 325i, both with manual
>>transmission.
>>
>>I am interested in whatever input anyone might have. I have owned a number
>>of Toyotas over the years, but no Lexus and no BMW.
>>
>>I have heard that Lexus takes Toyota's quality and attention to detail to
>>the next level, and that in the long run BMW is very expensive to
>>maintain. I have friends who own both - and swear they wouldn't drive
>>anything else.
>
>
> I don't know why people say that BMWs are expensive to maintain.
> The Camry that I bought my mom has cost about the same as my 330xi.
> Some parts for my T100 cost *MORE* than the same part for my 330xi -
> for instance the starter solenoid went out and the entire starter had to be
> replaced; the O2 sensor is TWICE as expensive as those on BMWs.
> My wife's Highlander has more often maintenance intervals; in aggregate
> they cost what it does for my 330xi. And the maintenance on the BMW
> is free for 4yrs/50K.

....in the US.


--
-Fred W

In article >,
Floyd Rogers > wrote:
>I don't know why people say that BMWs are expensive to maintain.

This is the way my father in law explained it to me 30 years ago: "the
Germans are quite up front about maintenance costs. The Japanese want you
to believe their cars are cheaspre cheap to maintain but in reality they cost
about the same".

Volvo parts seem the be THE most expensive.

--
Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

In article >,
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

> >I don't know why people say that BMWs are expensive to maintain.
>
> This is the way my father in law explained it to me 30 years ago: "the
> Germans are quite up front about maintenance costs. The Japanese want you
> to believe their cars are cheaspre cheap to maintain but in reality they cost
> about the same".

I wouldn't buy a German car with YOUR money. (Been there, done that.)

And yes, I "get" German cars. German cars are the expensive, pouty, and
high-maintenance mistresses of the road. Damn, they are a fine, fine
ride...

.....but then the maintenance and pouting kicks in.

At some point, without unlimited funds, you are at a decision point:
continue the high-priced, high-maintenance fun, or go back home and
enjoy your reliable Lexus wife of a car, patiently sitting there waiting
for you to get over the midlife crisis.

Oh sure, she's not as sexy as the German car, and she doesn't handle at
the edge like the German car. She's also not as fickle and high
maintenance and pouty, and she agrees with you much more of the time.
She's always there and never complains, and you come to realize there's
more to life than a high-maintenance relationship with a pouty,
high-maintenance woman--no matter how sexy she is or how fun the nights
out with her can be. Because when she lets you down and demands more of
you than you have to give, and treats you like dirt, you're standing
there all alone outside the club, looking and feeling like an idiot.

Your Lexus wife would never, ever do that to you.

And the occasional fun night out isn't worth what you end up paying for
it, both financially and in time wasted while you wait for the German
car mistress to be in the mood to play.

Do this: start paying attention to cars with tail light and headlight
problems. What brands of cars are you seeing? That's right--VW, M-B, and
BMW. And pay attention to how old, or rather how new, those problem cars
are.

The reality of electrical issues with German cars make Lucas electrics
look reliable.

Now *try* to find a Honda or Toyota, either low brand or high brand, no
matter how old, with non-working tail lights. Good luck.

It's a small thing, but it represents the reality of the situation. You
want to buy a German car? Just buy a GM car. At least the money you're
throwing away stays more inside the country--and you get just as
reliable a car.

In article >,
Elmo P. Shagnasty > wrote:
>In article >,
> (Richard Sexton) wrote:
>
>> >I don't know why people say that BMWs are expensive to maintain.
>>
>> This is the way my father in law explained it to me 30 years ago: "the
>> Germans are quite up front about maintenance costs. The Japanese want you
>> to believe their cars are cheaspre cheap to maintain but in reality they cost
>> about the same".
>
>I wouldn't buy a German car with YOUR money. (Been there, done that.)
>
>And yes, I "get" German cars. German cars are the expensive, pouty, and
>high-maintenance mistresses of the road. Damn, they are a fine, fine
>ride...
>
>....but then the maintenance and pouting kicks in.
>
>At some point, without unlimited funds, you are at a decision point:
>continue the high-priced, high-maintenance fun, or go back home and
>enjoy your reliable Lexus wife of a car, patiently sitting there waiting
>for you to get over the midlife crisis.
>
>Oh sure, she's not as sexy as the German car, and she doesn't handle at
>the edge like the German car. She's also not as fickle and high
>maintenance and pouty, and she agrees with you much more of the time.
>She's always there and never complains, and you come to realize there's
>more to life than a high-maintenance relationship with a pouty,
>high-maintenance woman--no matter how sexy she is or how fun the nights
>out with her can be. Because when she lets you down and demands more of
>you than you have to give, and treats you like dirt, you're standing
>there all alone outside the club, looking and feeling like an idiot.
>
>Your Lexus wife would never, ever do that to you.

Try buying a German car that's not thrashed. I've had new Japanese cars
and old German cars and the Germans cars have been far far cheaper to
maintain.

Just another data point.

--
Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

There's no bias towards German cars at all in that post . . . from
someone that sells Mercedes parts. I am also biased, as I have an
IS350.

When thinking of long term costs, it is possible that German cars are
cheaper. Remember how mechanics/dealers get cheaper parts, other cars
that break. With more German cars breaking in the long term, there
will be more available parts, increasing the supply, and dropping the
price :-)

-b


Richard Sexton wrote:
> In article >,
> Elmo P. Shagnasty > wrote:
> >In article >,
> > (Richard Sexton) wrote:
> >
> >> >I don't know why people say that BMWs are expensive to maintain.
> >>
> >> This is the way my father in law explained it to me 30 years ago: "the
> >> Germans are quite up front about maintenance costs. The Japanese want you
> >> to believe their cars are cheaspre cheap to maintain but in reality they cost
> >> about the same".
> >
> >I wouldn't buy a German car with YOUR money. (Been there, done that.)
> >
> >And yes, I "get" German cars. German cars are the expensive, pouty, and
> >high-maintenance mistresses of the road. Damn, they are a fine, fine
> >ride...
> >
> >....but then the maintenance and pouting kicks in.
> >
> >At some point, without unlimited funds, you are at a decision point:
> >continue the high-priced, high-maintenance fun, or go back home and
> >enjoy your reliable Lexus wife of a car, patiently sitting there waiting
> >for you to get over the midlife crisis.
> >
> >Oh sure, she's not as sexy as the German car, and she doesn't handle at
> >the edge like the German car. She's also not as fickle and high
> >maintenance and pouty, and she agrees with you much more of the time.
> >She's always there and never complains, and you come to realize there's
> >more to life than a high-maintenance relationship with a pouty,
> >high-maintenance woman--no matter how sexy she is or how fun the nights
> >out with her can be. Because when she lets you down and demands more of
> >you than you have to give, and treats you like dirt, you're standing
> >there all alone outside the club, looking and feeling like an idiot.
> >
> >Your Lexus wife would never, ever do that to you.
>
> Try buying a German car that's not thrashed. I've had new Japanese cars
> and old German cars and the Germans cars have been far far cheaper to
> maintain.
>
> Just another data point.
>
> --
> Need Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org
> Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
> 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net
> 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

In article >,
Elmo P. Shagnasty > wrote:
> Now *try* to find a Honda or Toyota, either low brand or high brand, no
> matter how old, with non-working tail lights. Good luck.

You're saying the bulbs never blow on Japanese cars? They must be
different Hondas and Toyotas we get in London...

--
*Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
> In article >,
> Elmo P. Shagnasty > wrote:
>
>>Now *try* to find a Honda or Toyota, either low brand or high brand, no
>>matter how old, with non-working tail lights. Good luck.
>
>
> You're saying the bulbs never blow on Japanese cars? They must be
> different Hondas and Toyotas we get in London...
>

well, actually, now-a-days they don't use bulbs at all. L.E.D.s

--
-Fred W

On Mon, 14 Aug 2006 23:52:21 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
> wrote:

>In article >,
> Elmo P. Shagnasty > wrote:
>> Now *try* to find a Honda or Toyota, either low brand or high brand, no
>> matter how old, with non-working tail lights. Good luck.
>
>You're saying the bulbs never blow on Japanese cars? They must be
>different Hondas and Toyotas we get in London...


Oddly enough my 2000 Avalon has not lost a single light.
Probably some sort of statistical anomaly, but still...