Driving With Two Brakes

>> Yes, but that's the price at the store. The shop would mark it up about
>> 100%, so it would be much more.
>
> Probably not... the garage gets a discount from their supplier, so they
> pay even less. then they mark them back up again when you buy from them.
>>

Yes, you're probably right. I was just thinking about a time that I paid
like $12 apiece for spark plugs at Goodyear, where the same ones were $8
apiece at AutoZone. But Goodyear tends to overcharge, anyway.

> Forgot to mention, to the OP: a Bentley repair manual for your car will
> cost about the same as an hour's labor charge, and is an invaluable
> resource for DIY maintenance. If you are starting from ground zero you
> will need some basic hand tools and a set of flare wrenches, that's about
> it. That said I think the price you were quoted was fair so if you're not
> inclined to DIY just pay it and be done with it.

Thanks. Per the message I just left in a new thread ("Driving With Two
Brakes - Part Two"), the price was just for the cylinders, not the shoes
(and it was $130, not $110, as I had previously thought).

Neil wrote:

> Yes, you're probably right. I was just thinking about a time that I paid
> like $12 apiece for spark plugs at Goodyear, where the same ones were $8
> apiece at AutoZone. But Goodyear tends to overcharge, anyway.

What kind of spark plugs were these? Most of what I've seen are around
$5 or less per spark plug.

Scott in SoCal wrote:
> On Sat, 05 Apr 2008 10:42:01 +0100, Eeyore
> > wrote:
>
>
>>
>>Neil wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I spoke with his mother after speaking to the mechanic and after posting
>>>here. Apparently, she was unaware that the rear brakes were not working. She
>>>said, one, the place didn't tell her it was an unsafe situation. And, two,
>>>she said she thought the emergency brake had a different brake shoe than the
>>>rear brake. Thus, until I spoke with her, she thought the situation was
>>>restricted to only the emergency brake, and not the rear brake itself.
>>
>>Why would you expect the average woman to know how car brakes work ?
>
>
> Well, since the failure condition is indicated to the driver via an
> IDIOT LIGHT, there is no need to understand how they work.
>
> We also know that this woman's intelligence level is somewhere below
> "idiot."

A seeping wheel cylinder won't light the light unless it is let go for a
dangerously long time (long enough for the MC reservoir to empty.)

nate

--
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Arif Khokar wrote:
> Neil wrote:
>
>> Yes, you're probably right. I was just thinking about a time that I
>> paid like $12 apiece for spark plugs at Goodyear, where the same ones
>> were $8 apiece at AutoZone. But Goodyear tends to overcharge, anyway.
>
>
> What kind of spark plugs were these? Most of what I've seen are around
> $5 or less per spark plug.

I know the Bosch 4-electrode plugs spec'd for the VW G60 are quite a bit
more expensive than that, and the car won't run well on much else. The
regular old Champion RJ12YC's for a Stude are about $2 apiece, but then
again you need eight of them

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Nate Nagel > wrote in
:

> Arif Khokar wrote:
>> Neil wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, you're probably right. I was just thinking about a time that I
>>> paid like $12 apiece for spark plugs at Goodyear, where the same ones
>>> were $8 apiece at AutoZone. But Goodyear tends to overcharge, anyway.
>>
>>
>> What kind of spark plugs were these? Most of what I've seen are around
>> $5 or less per spark plug.
>
> I know the Bosch 4-electrode plugs spec'd for the VW G60 are quite a bit
> more expensive than that, and the car won't run well on much else. The
> regular old Champion RJ12YC's for a Stude are about $2 apiece, but then
> again you need eight of them
>
> nate
>

platinum and iridium plugs cost more,then if you want the OEM Denso or NGK
plugs used on many imports,add more.
some people really don't trust the Bosch or domestic spark plug
brands,too;don't feel they are reliable and lasting.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

On Apr 5, 10:13 am, Ulf > wrote:
> Ed Pirrero wrote:
> > On Apr 5, 1:40 am, Eeyore >
> > wrote:
> >> Ed Pirrero wrote:
> >>> On Apr 4, 3:42 pm, "Neil" > wrote:
> >>>> An additional note re. this. The reason this came to light was because my
> >>>> son's emergency brake wasn't holding the wheels. He brought it in, asking
> >>>> them to adjust the emergency brake, and they told him that the reason the
> >>>> emergency brake wasn't working was because of brake fluid that was leaking
> >>>> out of the rear cyclinders. (They said that one cyclinder was leaking a
> >>>> little, and another was leaking a lot.)
> >>> Considering it's a mechanical hand brake mechanism, fluid (or lack
> >>> thereof) isn't going to do anything, unless both rears are so
> >>> contaminated the brake shoes won't hold in the drums.
> >>> Seems unlikely.
> >> That's exactly what happens. The friction material loses its friction when
> >> saturated with brake fluid. It is an oil of sorts after all !
>
> > You aren't really this dumb, are you?
>
> > Even oil-soaked shoes will provide SOME friction.
>
> > Enough to hold the car? I have no idea. Best not to test the
> > condition empirically, methinks.
>
> Considering many parking brakes are marginal to begin with, leaking
> brake fluid could easily make them next to useless. I ran my Jeep, which
> had a leaking axle seal at the time, through the brake tester at work,
> and on that wheel I had half the brake force compared the the other
> wheel. I know differential oil has different characteristics, but still...

Considering the mass of the Golf, and the quality of the handbrake
system, it's not a given that the handbrake won't work.

E.P.

"Arif Khokar" > wrote in message
...
> Neil wrote:
>
>> Yes, you're probably right. I was just thinking about a time that I paid
>> like $12 apiece for spark plugs at Goodyear, where the same ones were $8
>> apiece at AutoZone. But Goodyear tends to overcharge, anyway.
>
> What kind of spark plugs were these? Most of what I've seen are around $5
> or less per spark plug.


They were some kind of special whatevers -- platinum or gold tipped or
something. I don't recall. But clearly I overpaid.

"Brent P" > wrote in message
. ..
> In article >, Nate Nagel wrote:
>>Brent P wrote:
>>> In article >, Neil wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>The price they quoted was $110, but I don't know what that includes.
>>>
>>>
>>> It should include two wheel cylinders and at least relined shoes. Given
>>> the price of wheel cylinders and brake shoes for my old drum braked car
>>> that sounds like a decent price. It's nearly all parts unless 10 year
>>> old VW parts are ALOT cheaper than for a 35 year old ford.
>>>
>>
>>Maintenance parts are really cheap for older watercooled VW's. About
>>the only car I've ever worked on that was cheaper was an old MoPar
>>A-body. (several of them, mostly a '67 Dart and a '69 Valiant. I miss
>>the Valiant, too bad the owner wasn't speaking to me when she decided to
>>sell it...)
>
> I saw your price list there... the rear wheel cylinder I bought for the
> mav last year cost me around $40 at Napa.... Even more than a decade ago
> when I replaced the front ones they cost me $35 each or so....
>
>

Per the message I post in a new thread ("Driving With Two Brakes - Part
Two"), it was actually $130 they quoted, and it was ONLY for the wheel
cylinders. They say they're not going to replace the brake shoes, but only
clean them (even though there's brake fluid on the outside of the brake
cylinder).

In article >, Eeyore wrote:
>
>
>Ed Pirrero wrote:
>
>> On Apr 4, 3:42 pm, "Neil" > wrote:
>> > An additional note re. this. The reason this came to light was because my
>> > son's emergency brake wasn't holding the wheels. He brought it in, asking
>> > them to adjust the emergency brake, and they told him that the reason the
>> > emergency brake wasn't working was because of brake fluid that was leaking
>> > out of the rear cyclinders. (They said that one cyclinder was leaking a
>> > little, and another was leaking a lot.)
>>
>> Considering it's a mechanical hand brake mechanism, fluid (or lack
>> thereof) isn't going to do anything, unless both rears are so
>> contaminated the brake shoes won't hold in the drums.
>>
>> Seems unlikely.
>
>That's exactly what happens. The friction material loses its friction when
>saturated with brake fluid. It is an oil of sorts after all !

It would depend on the design of the back plate and drum I would guess.
The wheel cylinder that went on me last year was discovered in part by
'what's that puddle'. The shoes never got any brake fluid on them. It
just went along the back plate through the over lap with the drum and
down to the ground.

I would think it possible for the parking brake to slip because of
contamination, but it would be unlikely IMO... then again the car may
have a drum brake design that any leaking brake fluid goes on to the
shoes.