Hey Aunt Judy, this is why we're in Iraq, you retard..............

Saddam trial told of horror in Room 63 By Michael Georgy and Paul Tait
Mon Dec 5, 3:12 PM ET

BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Men and women were tortured for days and babies
left to die in an interrogation facility which featured a meat grinder
for human flesh, the first prosecution witness to face Saddam
Hussein told the court on Monday.

After weeks of delay and legal arguments over security and the
legitimacy of the court, the trial of Saddam and seven co- defendants
on charges of crimes against humanity heard confusing but graphic
witness evidence of torture and summary execution.

"I swear by God I walked by a room and on my left I saw a grinder with
blood coming out of it and human hair underneath," said 38-year-old
Ahmed Hassan, who said he had been kept in room 63 at the Hakmiya
intelligence headquarters in Baghdad.

Hassan, the first witness to face Saddam in court, said he was 15 when
Saddam visited the village in July 1982 and Shi'ite militants tried to
assassinate him.

Speaking technically as an individual plaintiff alongside the state,
which is pressing charges of crimes against humanity, Hassan said he
and his family were among hundreds of people rounded up in a security
operation run by Barzan Ibrahim al-Tikriti after an attempt on Saddam's
life in the village.

Barzan, one of Saddam's three younger half-brothers and the former head
of the feared Mukhabarat intelligence service, is one of Saddam's seven
co-accused in the case relating to the killings of 148 mostly Shi'ite
Muslim men from Dujail.

"Barzan was present. He had red cowboy boots and blue jeans and a
sniper rifle," Hassan, a stockily built worker with a round face and a
graying beard, told the heavily fortified court in central Baghdad.

He said Saddam, from the Sunni Arab minority, asked a 15-year-old boy
if he knew who he was. "He said 'Saddam'. Then Saddam hit him in the
head with an ash tray," Hassan said.

Hassan risked reprisals by letting his face appear on television as he
gave evidence.

Toward the end of his testimony he stood facing Saddam as the former
president challenged his testimony. Hassan held Saddam's gaze as Saddam
asked how he could possibly remember the names and birth dates of
people he said were killed, responding that he had memorized them as
they were read out by guards.

With Barzan constantly interjecting from the dock and calling the
testimony lies, Hassan said he was among hundreds of people taken from
the Shi'ite village to the Hakmiya intelligence headquarters, run by
Barzan.

He said it was while he was climbing the stairs there that he saw the
meat grinder. "No one escaped torture," he said.

"They would put a mask on my eyes and because I was young it would fall
down. I saw women being tortured," he said.

"My brother was given electric shocks while my 77-year-old father
watched," Hassan said. "They told us, 'why don't you confess, you will
be executed anyway'," he said.

"One man was shot in the leg with two bullets... Some people were
crippled because they had their arms and legs broken."

He said they were held in Hakmiya for 70 days. While they were there a
woman told a guard that her infant baby needed milk or he would die.

"He died and the guard threw him from the window," Hassan told the
court. "Pregnant women gave birth in the prison. Their babies died."

Saddam and his co-defendants have all pleaded not guilty to the
charges. They could be sentenced to death if found guilty.

Yeah, well, the Chinese do pretty much exactly the same stuff to political
dissidents, but we're more than happy to throw bargeloads of money at
China. Now, why do you think that might be...you retard?

Daniel J. Stern wrote:
> Yeah, well, the Chinese do pretty much exactly the same stuff to political
> dissidents, but we're more than happy to throw bargeloads of money at
> China. Now, why do you think that might be...you retard?

Sheer numbers might be one reason, retard.

> writes:

>Daniel J. Stern wrote:
>> Yeah, well, the Chinese do pretty much exactly the same stuff to
>> political dissidents, but we're more than happy to throw
>> bargeloads of money at China. Now, why do you think that might
>> be...you retard?

>Sheer numbers might be one reason, retard.

That'd be right. Disappear millions of dissidents and you get no
quibbles. Disappear a few thousand and you're in deep manure.
--
/"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
\ / ASCII ribbon campaign | Economist \E*con"o*mist\, n.
X against HTML mail | One with a ready explanation as to why
/ \ and postings | his last prediction was so wrong

On 5 Dec 2005 15:52:38 -0800,
wrote:

Apologies to everyone for the top post, but this post was so powerful
I couldn't snip it. This **** makes me sick, yet I feel even worse
after listening to the rabid far left defend SH as if he should have
been crowned or something.

>Saddam trial told of horror in Room 63 By Michael Georgy and Paul Tait
>Mon Dec 5, 3:12 PM ET
>
>BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Men and women were tortured for days and babies
>left to die in an interrogation facility which featured a meat grinder
>for human flesh, the first prosecution witness to face Saddam
>Hussein told the court on Monday.
>
>After weeks of delay and legal arguments over security and the
>legitimacy of the court, the trial of Saddam and seven co- defendants
>on charges of crimes against humanity heard confusing but graphic
>witness evidence of torture and summary execution.
>
>"I swear by God I walked by a room and on my left I saw a grinder with
>blood coming out of it and human hair underneath," said 38-year-old
>Ahmed Hassan, who said he had been kept in room 63 at the Hakmiya
>intelligence headquarters in Baghdad.
>
>Hassan, the first witness to face Saddam in court, said he was 15 when
>Saddam visited the village in July 1982 and Shi'ite militants tried to
>assassinate him.
>
>Speaking technically as an individual plaintiff alongside the state,
>which is pressing charges of crimes against humanity, Hassan said he
>and his family were among hundreds of people rounded up in a security
>operation run by Barzan Ibrahim al-Tikriti after an attempt on Saddam's
>life in the village.
>
>Barzan, one of Saddam's three younger half-brothers and the former head
>of the feared Mukhabarat intelligence service, is one of Saddam's seven
>co-accused in the case relating to the killings of 148 mostly Shi'ite
>Muslim men from Dujail.
>
>"Barzan was present. He had red cowboy boots and blue jeans and a
>sniper rifle," Hassan, a stockily built worker with a round face and a
>graying beard, told the heavily fortified court in central Baghdad.
>
>He said Saddam, from the Sunni Arab minority, asked a 15-year-old boy
>if he knew who he was. "He said 'Saddam'. Then Saddam hit him in the
>head with an ash tray," Hassan said.
>
>Hassan risked reprisals by letting his face appear on television as he
>gave evidence.
>
>Toward the end of his testimony he stood facing Saddam as the former
>president challenged his testimony. Hassan held Saddam's gaze as Saddam
>asked how he could possibly remember the names and birth dates of
>people he said were killed, responding that he had memorized them as
>they were read out by guards.
>
>With Barzan constantly interjecting from the dock and calling the
>testimony lies, Hassan said he was among hundreds of people taken from
>the Shi'ite village to the Hakmiya intelligence headquarters, run by
>Barzan.
>
>He said it was while he was climbing the stairs there that he saw the
>meat grinder. "No one escaped torture," he said.
>
>"They would put a mask on my eyes and because I was young it would fall
>down. I saw women being tortured," he said.
>
>"My brother was given electric shocks while my 77-year-old father
>watched," Hassan said. "They told us, 'why don't you confess, you will
>be executed anyway'," he said.
>
>"One man was shot in the leg with two bullets... Some people were
>crippled because they had their arms and legs broken."
>
>He said they were held in Hakmiya for 70 days. While they were there a
>woman told a guard that her infant baby needed milk or he would die.
>
>"He died and the guard threw him from the window," Hassan told the
>court. "Pregnant women gave birth in the prison. Their babies died."
>
>Saddam and his co-defendants have all pleaded not guilty to the
>charges. They could be sentenced to death if found guilty.

DTJ wrote:
> On 5 Dec 2005 15:52:38 -0800,
> wrote:
>
> Apologies to everyone for the top post, but this post was so powerful
> I couldn't snip it. This **** makes me sick, yet I feel even worse
> after listening to the rabid far left defend SH as if he should have
> been crowned or something.

That's why the rabid far left is so out of touch with reality.

Yet these "caring liberuls" think Saddam should have been left alone. I
wonder what these hypocrites would think if they were residents of Iraq
under his rule?

Perhaps that's why they are trying to ram their agenda down our
throats?

Aunt Judy likes it in the rear wrote:

> DTJ wrote:
> > On 5 Dec 2005 15:52:38 -0800,
> > wrote:
> >
> > Apologies to everyone for the top post, but this post was so powerful
> > I couldn't snip it. This **** makes me sick, yet I feel even worse
> > after listening to the rabid far left defend SH as if he should have
> > been crowned or something.
>
> That's why the rabid far left is so out of touch with reality.
>
> Yet these "caring liberuls" think Saddam should have been left alone. I
> wonder what these hypocrites would think if they were residents of Iraq
> under his rule?
>
> Perhaps that's why they are trying to ram their agenda down our
> throats?

Before you congratulate yourselves to much about the needless death of
amybe up to 100,000 Iraqi civilians since the US invaded be aware that the
situation is now no better than it was under Saddam.

" LONDON - Human rights abuses in Iraq are as bad now as they were
under Saddam Hussein and could become even worse, the country's former
interim prime minister said in an interview published Sunday...... "

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051127/...u/britain_iraq

Graham

wrote:

> <snip>

I vaguely remember something about WMD's?

Pooh Bear wrote:
> Aunt Judy likes it in the rear wrote:
>
> > DTJ wrote:
> > > On 5 Dec 2005 15:52:38 -0800,
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > Apologies to everyone for the top post, but this post was so powerful
> > > I couldn't snip it. This **** makes me sick, yet I feel even worse
> > > after listening to the rabid far left defend SH as if he should have
> > > been crowned or something.
> >
> > That's why the rabid far left is so out of touch with reality.
> >
> > Yet these "caring liberuls" think Saddam should have been left alone. I
> > wonder what these hypocrites would think if they were residents of Iraq
> > under his rule?
> >
> > Perhaps that's why they are trying to ram their agenda down our
> > throats?
>
> Before you congratulate yourselves to much about the needless death of
> amybe up to 100,000 Iraqi civilians since the US invaded be aware that the
> situation is now no better than it was under Saddam.
>
> " LONDON - Human rights abuses in Iraq are as bad now as they were
> under Saddam Hussein and could become even worse, the country's former
> interim prime minister said in an interview published Sunday...... "
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051127/...u/britain_iraq
>
> Graham

Worse off now than with Saddam? Any Iraqi I've talked to has had
exactly the opposite to say. Why take the opinion of a British news
reporter over a Baghdad citizen, and where do you get the 100,000 Iraqi
civilian figure?

> wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Pooh Bear wrote:
> > Aunt Judy likes it in the rear wrote:
> >
> > > DTJ wrote:
> > > > On 5 Dec 2005 15:52:38 -0800,
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Apologies to everyone for the top post, but this post was so
powerful
> > > > I couldn't snip it. This **** makes me sick, yet I feel even worse
> > > > after listening to the rabid far left defend SH as if he should have
> > > > been crowned or something.
> > >
> > > That's why the rabid far left is so out of touch with reality.
> > >
> > > Yet these "caring liberuls" think Saddam should have been left alone.
I
> > > wonder what these hypocrites would think if they were residents of
Iraq
> > > under his rule?
> > >
> > > Perhaps that's why they are trying to ram their agenda down our
> > > throats?
> >
> > Before you congratulate yourselves to much about the needless death of
> > amybe up to 100,000 Iraqi civilians since the US invaded be aware that
the
> > situation is now no better than it was under Saddam.
> >
> > " LONDON - Human rights abuses in Iraq are as bad now as they were
> > under Saddam Hussein and could become even worse, the country's
former
> > interim prime minister said in an interview published Sunday...... "
> >
> > http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051127/...u/britain_iraq
> >
> > Graham
>
> Worse off now than with Saddam? Any Iraqi I've talked to has had
> exactly the opposite to say. Why take the opinion of a British news
> reporter over a Baghdad citizen, and where do you get the 100,000 Iraqi
> civilian figure?
>

Correction: Why take the word of former interim prime minister Allawi, whom
the U.S. picked to run the first post-Saddam Iraqi government, over Todd
Wasson at Performance Simulations. Well, gee, I can't imagine why we
wouldn't go with your claims Todd. Please, tell us the names of some of
these Baghdad citizens you've talked to.