2004 accord 4-cyl: ATF filter?

On 9/10/08 7:13 AM, in article , "Pszemol"
> wrote:

> "E Meyer" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On 9/9/08 10:14 PM, in article , "Pszemol"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Interesting article about ATF replacement in your Honda Accord:
>>> http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=14714&page=2
>>>
>>> Anybody knows why Honda does not call for replacing the filter
>>> mentioned there in any of their maintenance schedules?
>>>
>>> Do you replace this filter in your Accord? How often?
>>
>> Honda automatics do not have a replaceable filter. They use a series of
>> inaccessible screens within the transmission.
>
> What about the filter mentioned in the linked discussion thread on
> driveaccord.net?
>

I'd never seen that before, but now that you point it out, I find there is
one on my '06 CR-V as well, mounted in the middle of one of the ATF cooler
lines at the bottom of the radiator. There is no mention of it that I can
find in the FSM, even the picture that shows it does not identify it.

I know there was/is no such filter on my '96 or '00. Must be a new thing.
At least you don't have to open up the transmission to get to it.

Oh, well... One more thing to change...

E Meyer > wrote in
:

> On 9/10/08 7:13 AM, in article , "Pszemol"
> > wrote:
>
>> "E Meyer" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On 9/9/08 10:14 PM, in article , "Pszemol"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> Interesting article about ATF replacement in your Honda Accord:
>>>> http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=14714&page=2
>>>>
>>>> Anybody knows why Honda does not call for replacing the filter
>>>> mentioned there in any of their maintenance schedules?
>>>>
>>>> Do you replace this filter in your Accord? How often?
>>>
>>> Honda automatics do not have a replaceable filter. They use a
>>> series of inaccessible screens within the transmission.
>>
>> What about the filter mentioned in the linked discussion thread on
>> driveaccord.net?
>>
>
> I'd never seen that before, but now that you point it out, I find
> there is one on my '06 CR-V as well, mounted in the middle of one of
> the ATF cooler lines at the bottom of the radiator. There is no
> mention of it that I can find in the FSM, even the picture that shows
> it does not identify it.
>
> I know there was/is no such filter on my '96 or '00. Must be a new
> thing. At least you don't have to open up the transmission to get to
> it.



They've been there on factory remans since at least the early '90s.

All 2001's came with them from new. I haven't determined yet exactly when
the factory began installing them, but there is no mention of one in the
'00 Civic manual, nor in any of the earlier manuals I have.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

"Tegger" > wrote in message
...
> Evidently Honda seems to think it will last long enough not to care about
> specifying a replacement interval.
>
> Apparently these filters are meant to catch any debris that may have ended
> up in the transmission during manufacture or remanufacture. It seems to be
> sort of like the dryer in an A/C system: used once, then not needed again.
>
> I found an old Honda Service News issue (Sept 1992) that mentions slow
> idling and stalling (especially when hot) as a symptom of a blocked ATF
> filter.

Considering the fact this filter is on the lines leading to the ATF cooler
it would imply that blocked ATF filter would cause fluid overheating...
For less than $20 I would say it will not hurt to replace it every 60k
miles!

> As of 2007, dealership techs are specifically instructed to return the
> filter along with the tranny when a unit is sent back under warranty.

Interesting... thanks for this info!

If you read the thread I linked from the driveaccord.net you will notice
some claims that replacing this filter with some other one improves
shifting - it is hard to believe... Sounds like an autosuggestion to me :-)
Unless the overheating fluid trully causes delayed shifting...

Tegger wrote:
> E Meyer > wrote in
> :
>
>> On 9/10/08 7:13 AM, in article , "Pszemol"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> "E Meyer" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> On 9/9/08 10:14 PM, in article , "Pszemol"
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Interesting article about ATF replacement in your Honda Accord:
>>>>> http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=14714&page=2
>>>>>
>>>>> Anybody knows why Honda does not call for replacing the filter
>>>>> mentioned there in any of their maintenance schedules?
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you replace this filter in your Accord? How often?
>>>> Honda automatics do not have a replaceable filter. They use a
>>>> series of inaccessible screens within the transmission.
>>> What about the filter mentioned in the linked discussion thread on
>>> driveaccord.net?
>>>
>> I'd never seen that before, but now that you point it out, I find
>> there is one on my '06 CR-V as well, mounted in the middle of one of
>> the ATF cooler lines at the bottom of the radiator. There is no
>> mention of it that I can find in the FSM, even the picture that shows
>> it does not identify it.
>>
>> I know there was/is no such filter on my '96 or '00. Must be a new
>> thing. At least you don't have to open up the transmission to get to
>> it.
>
>
>
> They've been there on factory remans since at least the early '90s.
>
> All 2001's came with them from new. I haven't determined yet exactly when
> the factory began installing them, but there is no mention of one in the
> '00 Civic manual, nor in any of the earlier manuals I have.
>
>

timing coincides with the other honda transmission problems. that
indicates to me some kind of q.c. policy change.

Pszemol wrote:
> "jim beam" > wrote in message
> t...
>> Pszemol wrote:
>>> "jim beam" > wrote in message
>>> t...
>>>> Pszemol wrote:
>>>>> Interesting article about ATF replacement in your Honda Accord:
>>>>> http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=14714&page=2
>>>>>
>>>>> Anybody knows why Honda does not call for replacing the filter
>>>>> mentioned there in any of their maintenance schedules?
>>>>> Do you replace this filter in your Accord? How often?
>>>>
>>>> if someone told you the filter has sufficient capacity to last the
>>>> lifetime of the transmission without being changed, would you
>>>> believe them? would that knowledge make you feel more comfortable
>>>> about not driving a p.o.s from detroit that won't last, regardless
>>>> of filter changes?
>>>
>>> Not sure why a simple looking paper filter could last so much longer
>>> than the similarly looking engine oil filter...
>>
>> 1. it's not being exposed to the temperatures or chemicals or
>> combustion product load of what's going on inside the engine.
>
> Is the temperature of the engine oil flowing through the oil filter
> greater than the temperature of the ATF in a working transmission?
> Any data to support this claim?
>
>> 2. they bothered to test.
>
> You guess or you know it? If you know, based on what data?
>
>> 3. a "paper" filter is not newsprint. it's a highly sophisticated and
>> extensively researched piece of equipment.
>
> The same thing you can read about FRAM paper filters for $2 :-)
>
>>> Do you really know what is the purpose of this filter or you are just
>>> speculating based on no data?
>>
>> er, no, i have no idea what the filter does or how it works -
>> i'm just pulling this out of thin air.
>
> I am curious, could you please explain why this filter is there at all
> and why is it located in this particular place... I would appreciate this.


dude, why do you bother? look this stuff up. if you can't find it on
the web, go to your local library and look in the automotive tech
section. better yet, go to school and sign up for some of the
automotive engineering classes. just because /you/ don't know something
doesn't mean /i/ don't.

Pszemol wrote:
> "Tegger" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Evidently Honda seems to think it will last long enough not to care about
>> specifying a replacement interval.
>>
>> Apparently these filters are meant to catch any debris that may have
>> ended
>> up in the transmission during manufacture or remanufacture. It seems
>> to be
>> sort of like the dryer in an A/C system: used once, then not needed
>> again.
>>
>> I found an old Honda Service News issue (Sept 1992) that mentions slow
>> idling and stalling (especially when hot) as a symptom of a blocked ATF
>> filter.
>
> Considering the fact this filter is on the lines leading to the ATF cooler
> it would imply that blocked ATF filter would cause fluid overheating...
> For less than $20 I would say it will not hurt to replace it every 60k
> miles!

where did you get this number from? was it:

a. a wildly uneducated guess
b. meticulous lab research
c. some secret internal source at honda
d. er, give up.



>
>> As of 2007, dealership techs are specifically instructed to return the
>> filter along with the tranny when a unit is sent back under warranty.
>
> Interesting... thanks for this info!
>
> If you read the thread I linked from the driveaccord.net you will notice
> some claims that replacing this filter with some other one improves
> shifting - it is hard to believe... Sounds like an autosuggestion to me :-)
> Unless the overheating fluid trully causes delayed shifting...

jim beam > wrote in
t:

> Tegger wrote:

>>
>> They've been there on factory remans since at least the early '90s.
>>
>> All 2001's came with them from new. I haven't determined yet exactly
>> when the factory began installing them, but there is no mention of
>> one in the '00 Civic manual, nor in any of the earlier manuals I
>> have.
>>
>>
>
> timing coincides with the other honda transmission problems. that
> indicates to me some kind of q.c. policy change.
>


That's what I was wondering...


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

"jim beam" > wrote in message
...
> Pszemol wrote:
>> "jim beam" > wrote in message
>> t...
>>> Pszemol wrote:
>>>> "jim beam" > wrote in message
>>>> t...
>>>>> Pszemol wrote:
>>>>>> Interesting article about ATF replacement in your Honda Accord:
>>>>>> http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=14714&page=2
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anybody knows why Honda does not call for replacing the filter
>>>>>> mentioned there in any of their maintenance schedules?
>>>>>> Do you replace this filter in your Accord? How often?
>>>>>
>>>>> if someone told you the filter has sufficient capacity to last the
>>>>> lifetime of the transmission without being changed, would you believe
>>>>> them? would that knowledge make you feel more comfortable about not
>>>>> driving a p.o.s from detroit that won't last, regardless of filter
>>>>> changes?
>>>>
>>>> Not sure why a simple looking paper filter could last so much longer
>>>> than the similarly looking engine oil filter...
>>>
>>> 1. it's not being exposed to the temperatures or chemicals or combustion
>>> product load of what's going on inside the engine.
>>
>> Is the temperature of the engine oil flowing through the oil filter
>> greater than the temperature of the ATF in a working transmission?
>> Any data to support this claim?
>>
>>> 2. they bothered to test.
>>
>> You guess or you know it? If you know, based on what data?
>>
>>> 3. a "paper" filter is not newsprint. it's a highly sophisticated and
>>> extensively researched piece of equipment.
>>
>> The same thing you can read about FRAM paper filters for $2 :-)
>>
>>>> Do you really know what is the purpose of this filter or you are just
>>>> speculating based on no data?
>>>
>>> er, no, i have no idea what the filter does or how it works -
>>> i'm just pulling this out of thin air.
>>
>> I am curious, could you please explain why this filter is there at all
>> and why is it located in this particular place... I would appreciate
>> this.
>
>
> dude, why do you bother? look this stuff up. if you can't find it on the
> web, go to your local library and look in the automotive tech section.
> better yet, go to school and sign up for some of the automotive
> engineering classes. just because /you/ don't know
> something doesn't mean /i/ don't.

I just asked you couple of questions and seems you do not have the answer.

"jim beam" > wrote in message
t...
> Pszemol wrote:
>> "Tegger" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Evidently Honda seems to think it will last long enough not to care
>>> about
>>> specifying a replacement interval.
>>>
>>> Apparently these filters are meant to catch any debris that may have
>>> ended
>>> up in the transmission during manufacture or remanufacture. It seems to
>>> be
>>> sort of like the dryer in an A/C system: used once, then not needed
>>> again.
>>>
>>> I found an old Honda Service News issue (Sept 1992) that mentions slow
>>> idling and stalling (especially when hot) as a symptom of a blocked ATF
>>> filter.
>>
>> Considering the fact this filter is on the lines leading to the ATF
>> cooler
>> it would imply that blocked ATF filter would cause fluid overheating...
>> For less than $20 I would say it will not hurt to replace it every 60k
>> miles!
>
> where did you get this number from? was it:
>
> a. a wildly uneducated guess
> b. meticulous lab research
> c. some secret internal source at honda
> d. er, give up.

I took it from the same place you took the info it will last the "lifetime".

Well, Honda's transmission problems were at least partially due to
debris clogging the strainer in the tranny. At least in 98-99
differential bearing failures.

http://www.magnefine.com/

This type of inline filters have come with rebuilt transmissions to
catch leftover debris. Magnefine recommends 12-month intervals.
Strainer based filtration is just OK, bare minimum. But that' why
there a

http://perma-cool.com/Catalog/Cat_page25.html





On Sep 10, 10:36*am, E Meyer > wrote:
> I'd never seen that before, but now that you point it out, I find there is
> one on my '06 CR-V as well, mounted in the middle of one of the ATF cooler
> lines at the bottom of the radiator. *There is no mention of it that I can
> find in the FSM, even the picture that shows it does not identify it.
>
> I know there was/is no such filter on my '96 or '00. *Must be a new thing.
> At least you don't have to open up the transmission to get to it.
>
> Oh, well... One more thing to change...