Tires that actually last

I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.

They have a 60K warranty.

But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.

Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?

Thanks,
Andy

On 18/12/20 11:44 am, AK wrote:
> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
>
> They have a 60K warranty.
>
> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
>
> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
>
> Thanks,
> Andy
>
I get 80K out of my OEM fitments as a rule. Maybe you should try doing
fewer burnouts?

--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

AK > wrote:
> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
>
> They have a 60K warranty.
>
> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
>
> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
>
> Thanks,
> Andy

Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
alignment might be the cause of tire wear.

On 18/12/20 2:03 pm, root wrote:
> AK > wrote:
>> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
>>
>> They have a 60K warranty.
>>
>> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
>>
>> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Andy
>
> Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
> alignment might be the cause of tire wear.
>
Most *decent tyre places* will do a wheel alignment check at the same
time new tyres are fitted, especially if the existing tyres show
evidence of alignment issues. Every time I've had new tyres fitted, a
wheel balance and alignment was a requirement for any warranty
expectation. Need to start the tyre life from a known point. FWIW, any
alignment should begin with a steering and suspension *condition check*.

--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On Thursday, December 17, 2020 at 9:57:10 PM UTC-6, Xeno wrote:
> On 18/12/20 2:03 pm, root wrote:
> > AK > wrote:
> >> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
> >>
> >> They have a 60K warranty.
> >>
> >> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
> >>
> >> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Andy
> >
> > Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
> > alignment might be the cause of tire wear.
> >
> Most *decent tyre places* will do a wheel alignment check at the same
> time new tyres are fitted, especially if the existing tyres show
> evidence of alignment issues. Every time I've had new tyres fitted, a
> wheel balance and alignment was a requirement for any warranty
> expectation. Need to start the tyre life from a known point. FWIW, any
> alignment should begin with a steering and suspension *condition check*.
> --
>
> Xeno
>
>
> Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
> (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
The tires are on the front and the back tires are also showing the treadwear indicator.

The tires have been routinely rotated and balanced.

No one has said that any brand has been good?

Does that mean all tire manufactures lie about mileage?

Andy

AK wrote:
> On Thursday, December 17, 2020 at 9:57:10 PM UTC-6, Xeno wrote:
>> On 18/12/20 2:03 pm, root wrote:
>>> AK > wrote:
>>>> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
>>>>
>>>> They have a 60K warranty.
>>>>
>>>> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
>>>>
>>>> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Andy
>>>
>>> Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
>>> alignment might be the cause of tire wear.
>>>
>> Most *decent tyre places* will do a wheel alignment check at the same
>> time new tyres are fitted, especially if the existing tyres show
>> evidence of alignment issues. Every time I've had new tyres fitted, a
>> wheel balance and alignment was a requirement for any warranty
>> expectation. Need to start the tyre life from a known point. FWIW, any
>> alignment should begin with a steering and suspension *condition check*.
>> --
>>
>> Xeno
>>
>>
>> Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
>> (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
> The tires are on the front and the back tires are also showing the treadwear indicator.
>
> The tires have been routinely rotated and balanced.
>
> No one has said that any brand has been good?
>
> Does that mean all tire manufactures lie about mileage?
>
> Andy

IMO, mileage estimates seem to be for straight line, 50 mph, constant
temp and load. I got Aspen Touring from NTB for my 06 Kia.
Aspen reviews are really bad. Nearly all say that 15k-30k miles on a
55k mile warranty tire is end of life for them.
However, mine have about 15k miles now and hardly any visible wear. A
little rounding on the fronts. 440 tread, A temp, A trac. I drive
Houston freeways from the west side to the east side and back, and 1
mile to Walmart, so my driving conditions are probably similar to yours.

On 19/12/20 9:20 am, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
> AK wrote:
>> On Thursday, December 17, 2020 at 9:57:10 PM UTC-6, Xeno wrote:
>>> On 18/12/20 2:03 pm, root wrote:
>>>> AK > wrote:
>>>>> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
>>>>>
>>>>> They have a 60K warranty.
>>>>>
>>>>> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Andy
>>>>
>>>> Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
>>>> alignment might be the cause of tire wear.
>>>>
>>> Most *decent tyre places* will do a wheel alignment check at the same
>>> time new tyres are fitted, especially if the existing tyres show
>>> evidence of alignment issues. Every time I've had new tyres fitted, a
>>> wheel balance and alignment was a requirement for any warranty
>>> expectation. Need to start the tyre life from a known point. FWIW, any
>>> alignment should begin with a steering and suspension *condition check*.
>>> --
>>>
>>> Xeno
>>>
>>>
>>> Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
>>> (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
>> The tires are on the front and the back tires are also showing the
>> treadwear indicator.
>>
>> The tires have been routinely rotated and balanced.
>>
>> No one has said that any brand has been good?
>>
>> Does that mean all tire manufactures lie about mileage?
>>
>> Andy
>
> IMO, mileage estimates seem to be for straight line, 50 mph, constant
> temp and load.Â* I got Aspen Touring from NTB for my 06 Kia.
> Aspen reviews are really bad.Â* Nearly all say that 15k-30k miles on a
> 55k mile warranty tire is end of life for them.
> However, mine have about 15k miles now and hardly any visible wear.Â* A
> little rounding on the fronts.Â* 440 tread, A temp, A trac.Â* I drive
> Houston freeways from the west side to the east side and back, and 1
> mile to Walmart, so my driving conditions are probably similar to yours.

In the past, most of our driving was high density city but included
freeways. We now live in a rural city and we suffer more from camber
scrub as a direct consequence of the many tight intersections in this
place. Not much can be done about the camber scrub short of regular tyre
rotation.

I'm not easy on my tyres but I still get quite good mileage. How someone
could wear out a set of Yokohamas at 15K is beyond my comprehension
short of, as I've stated, deliberate abuse.

--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On Friday, December 18, 2020 at 4:21:01 PM UTC-6, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
> AK wrote:
> > On Thursday, December 17, 2020 at 9:57:10 PM UTC-6, Xeno wrote:
> >> On 18/12/20 2:03 pm, root wrote:
> >>> AK > wrote:
> >>>> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
> >>>>
> >>>> They have a 60K warranty.
> >>>>
> >>>> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
> >>>>
> >>>> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks,
> >>>> Andy
> >>>
> >>> Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
> >>> alignment might be the cause of tire wear.
> >>>
> >> Most *decent tyre places* will do a wheel alignment check at the same
> >> time new tyres are fitted, especially if the existing tyres show
> >> evidence of alignment issues. Every time I've had new tyres fitted, a
> >> wheel balance and alignment was a requirement for any warranty
> >> expectation. Need to start the tyre life from a known point. FWIW, any
> >> alignment should begin with a steering and suspension *condition check*.
> >> --
> >>
> >> Xeno
> >>
> >>
> >> Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
> >> (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
> > The tires are on the front and the back tires are also showing the treadwear indicator.
> >
> > The tires have been routinely rotated and balanced.
> >
> > No one has said that any brand has been good?
> >
> > Does that mean all tire manufactures lie about mileage?
> >
> > Andy
> IMO, mileage estimates seem to be for straight line, 50 mph, constant
> temp and load. I got Aspen Touring from NTB for my 06 Kia.
> Aspen reviews are really bad. Nearly all say that 15k-30k miles on a
> 55k mile warranty tire is end of life for them.
> However, mine have about 15k miles now and hardly any visible wear. A
> little rounding on the fronts. 440 tread, A temp, A trac. I drive
> Houston freeways from the west side to the east side and back, and 1
> mile to Walmart, so my driving conditions are probably similar to yours.
I just remembered something.

They are doing a 5 yr road work project and there are a lot of places where I slow down to go over raised parts of the road.

It's may be causing faster wear.

Andy

On Fri, 18 Dec 2020 16:20:42 -0600, Paul in Houston TX wrote:

> IMO, mileage estimates seem to be for straight line, 50 mph, constant
> temp and load.

While the manufacturer stamps the tires with the treadwear indicator, they
do so following an exacting driving procedure handed to them (AFAIK) by the
DOT and/or the NHTSA to be run always on a specific San Angelo TX test
course always with a specific driving pattern for all tires being tested.

Let me dig that test track information up...
o <https://one.nhtsa.gov/DOT/NHTSA/Vehicle%20Safety/Test%20Procedures/Associated%20Files/TP-UTQG-W-01.pdf>

That document is labeled "TP-UTQG-W-01" US DOT NHTSA
o "Procedures for tire treadwear testing"

Skimming that document there is a Test Program Overview at section 1-12.
"The tires will then be labeled, inspected, mounted onto rims,
balanced and then placed onto the test vehicle. The test vehicle will be
ballasted to achieve the required loading of the tires. The vehicles
will be driven over the established 400 mile course utilizing the
prescribed driving technique for a total of 7,200 miles. After each 800
miles, the tire pressure and tire depth will be measured, the tire
position will be rotated, and the vehicle's front end alignment will be
adjusted when required. At the completion of the test the wear rates of
each tire will be calculated."

And here is a course overview at section 5-12:
"The course consists of 3 loops as follows:
1. Southern Loop
2. Eastern Loop
3. Northwestern Loop

I had originally thought it was a test 'track' but skimming the document
shows it's actually real roads and intersections such as STOP at FM388 for
the Calibrated Mile and U-Turn at the Camp Hudson Historical Marker, and
then drive on US277 for 88 miles, then drive on Sonora Road for 214 miles,
and stop at FM388 & FM2334, etc.

There's a map of the three loops which looks like a bow tie around a
Christmas present, where the southern end is just a bendy ribbon while the
two northern ends are both clearly large loops.

Anyway, my quick summary from a quick skim is that it's on "regular" roads
in Texas, where it's regular driving (they even tell the driver what the
braking & yield procedures are in the document).

When they check treadwear, they check it at 6 marked locations, starting at
the DOT number avoiding treadwear indicator bars.

It's not all straight but it's not all curves either.
o It sure does seem like it's seven thousand miles of "normal driving",
albeit I live on a mountain so none of that is covered in this test.

See also:
o Does the macadem road surface have a great effect on tire wear?
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/ZwIeZHNCzpI>
o Questions about mounting & balancing new LT tires on new steel rims at home (match mounting marks, red dots, yellow dots, & spacers)
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/gjsqxRxTacw>
o Clare, Xeno.... did you ever have a batch of tires that just wouldn't seal after the final bead?
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/ST-xNgC5pnU>
o Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - saving over $400
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/zfyOpil5bck>
o Can you return a tire you don't like for full refund?
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/5htRVubIoW8>
o What metric do you use to estimate remaining brake pad life on a typical economy sedan?
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.home.repair/c/C2VH6EvL2As>
--
Posted, as always, out of the goodness of my heart, in order to help.

On 19/12/20 3:27 am, AK wrote:
> On Thursday, December 17, 2020 at 9:57:10 PM UTC-6, Xeno wrote:
>> On 18/12/20 2:03 pm, root wrote:
>>> AK > wrote:
>>>> I bought some Yokohama tires at Discount *ires.
>>>>
>>>> They have a 60K warranty.
>>>>
>>>> But after 15K miles, the tire tread indicator is already showing.
>>>>
>>>> Are there tires that actually last to their rated warranties?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Andy
>>>
>>> Are the worn tires on the front? If so, your toe-in or
>>> alignment might be the cause of tire wear.
>>>
>> Most *decent tyre places* will do a wheel alignment check at the same
>> time new tyres are fitted, especially if the existing tyres show
>> evidence of alignment issues. Every time I've had new tyres fitted, a
>> wheel balance and alignment was a requirement for any warranty
>> expectation. Need to start the tyre life from a known point. FWIW, any
>> alignment should begin with a steering and suspension *condition check*.
>> --
>>
>> Xeno
>>
>>
>> Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
>> (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)
> The tires are on the front and the back tires are also showing the treadwear indicator.
>
> The tires have been routinely rotated and balanced.

What? At 15K miles? One rotate at most at that mileage, if that.
>
> No one has said that any brand has been good?

Yokohama are reasonable. I use OEM, I avoid cheapies, ie. Chinese
rubbish. A lot of the cheapies actually last *longer* but that's because
the rubber isn't as flexible and the grip, as a direct consequence, is
terrible.
>
> Does that mean all tire manufactures lie about mileage?

Exaggerate, maybe, lie, not usually. As noted elsewhere, those mileage
tests aren't done under average highway conditions.
>
> Andy
>
As I stated previously, ease up on the burnouts.

--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)