Trail(er) trash

Tis why they made rocksalt & shotguns?

Troy

The Nazi's were the "National Socialist German Workers Party", which is
hardly far right!

Jeff DeWitt

R. Lander wrote:
> I replied to your Limbaugh-script comments using my original subject
> header, not your altered one.
>
> You forget that the Nazis were far-right punks with no respect for
> "lower life forms." They shared traits with modern right-wingers who
> think nature should yield at will beneath their Jeep tires. Don't
> pretend you're operating on some higher moral plain with all your lies
> about endless frontiers.
>
> R. Lander
>
> Corey Shuman wrote:
>
>>Nice agenda, but complete bull****. Sorry, but Id like to see any proof
>>of this other than just your unsubstantiated ramblings.
>>Maybe you should define what you think an enviromentalist is, because
>>if you are talking about your average hippie hiker, out on his bike or
>>walking through the trails they leave more impact than the average 4wd
>>trail rider. Powerbar wrappers, feces and "biodegradable" toilet paper
>>to name a few, oh and the ability to turn an area upside down to
>>accomodate their extended camping stays.
>>
>>But since you are on a roll, lets explore your extremely flawed logic.
>>The "Conquer Nature" mentality is the reason you even have these spots
>>to enjoy. Mining companys, prospectors and railroad companys were out
>>here not to conquer nature but to make a living from it and make it a
>>livable space at the same time. This land is our land, not yours not
>>ours, but OUR land collectively, that means that what may be fun to
>>some is not fun to other but you tolerate or are at least respectful to
>>each other.
>>
>>Since you have so much to say about this, I assume that you have
>>positioned yourself to do something about it though, right. You are out
>>every weekend cleaning up the trails and organizing groups to monitor
>>the land, right? Id be willing to be not. You know the history and
>>geography of the lands you visit and leave them in a better state than
>>when you arrived. Right?
>>
>>Sorry, but you just really have no clue as to what you are talking
>>about here. There is plenty of wild frontier, unexplored canyons,
>>mountains and valleys. But you have to be motivated to get out there
>>and usually it is the offroader who has that drive and sense of
>>adventure. The average enviromentalist waits for an area to be opened
>>up, then wanders in and says it should be closed to the very same
>>people who found it. Great logic, if it wasnt for the explorers you
>>guys wouldnt have any areas to whine about.
>>
>>So keep this kind of unsubstatiated BS on the SUWA and other
>>short-sighted groups sites, cause it holds no water here.
>>
>>Sincerely,
>>
>>Corey T. Shuman

>>www.goldrushexpeditions.com
>>
>>R. Lander wrote:
>>
>>>The "respect" for nature shown by offroad enthusiasts is documented by
>>>all the cans, bottles and wrappers they toss on scenic trails. The
>>>Rubicon near Lake Tahoe shows how these anthropocentric mouth-breathers
>>>view the land. They can't be bothered carrying a trash bag and packing
>>>it out. No room in the Jeep or some other excuse.
>>>
>>>People with a conquer-nature mentality have little respect for its
>>>sanctity. The show stealer is their fancy machinery, not the land.
>>>Nature is just another place to make noise and whoop it up. It's hard
>>>to prove, but the number of offroad litterers is probably at least 25%.
>>>It goes beyond a few rotten apples making the rest look bad.
>>>
>>>It's very simple: people who bash environmentalism don't respect the
>>>environment that much. They talk of "extremism" but effective
>>>protection will always seem extreme to those who want land UNprotected.
>>>Environmental problems are people problems and more people create more
>>>impact. Population can't continue without stealing more land. That's
>>>the crux of all these conflicts. It's not about shadowy entities trying
>>>to block your rights, it's more people fighting over less acreage.
>>>
>>>In the lower 48 states, there's no real frontier left. We don't need
>>>more machines, noise and trail(er) trash invading the last wild, quiet
>>>places. Be happy with all the trails you've got. If you find those
>>>trails overcrowded, blame human overbreeding, not environmentalism.
>>>
>>>R. Lander
>
>

"R. Lander" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> The "respect" for nature shown by offroad enthusiasts is documented by
> all the cans, bottles and wrappers they toss on scenic trails. The
> Rubicon near Lake Tahoe shows how these anthropocentric mouth-breathers
> view the land. They can't be bothered carrying a trash bag and packing
> it out. No room in the Jeep or some other excuse.
>
> People with a conquer-nature mentality have little respect for its
> sanctity. The show stealer is their fancy machinery, not the land.
> Nature is just another place to make noise and whoop it up. It's hard
> to prove, but the number of offroad litterers is probably at least 25%.
> It goes beyond a few rotten apples making the rest look bad.
>
> It's very simple: people who bash environmentalism don't respect the
> environment that much. They talk of "extremism" but effective
> protection will always seem extreme to those who want land UNprotected.
> Environmental problems are people problems and more people create more
> impact. Population can't continue without stealing more land. That's
> the crux of all these conflicts. It's not about shadowy entities trying
> to block your rights, it's more people fighting over less acreage.
>
> In the lower 48 states, there's no real frontier left. We don't need
> more machines, noise and trail(er) trash invading the last wild, quiet
> places. Be happy with all the trails you've got. If you find those
> trails overcrowded, blame human overbreeding, not environmentalism.
>
> R. Lander

What utter bull**** !!! What makes you think any one group is any more
responsible for leaving trash on the trails ? Where I hike I see the same
trash on the trails and these are hiking trails only. It's not unusual to
hike in 6-8 miles and find beer bottles and cans, candy wrappers, plastic
bottles, empty propane cylinders and anything else you can imagine. I just
can't figure out how someone can manage to hike in with a case of beer but
can't carry the empties out. Some people are just slobs, the method of
transportation does not matter. It is a few bad apples that ruin things for
everyone else.

>

> Not a bad troll....
>

Not a good one, too many stereotypes, too long, and no "citations of
evidence".
I give it a 3.
--
Stupendous Man,
Defender of Freedom, Advocate of Liberty

You know, I used to think I knew a lot about people who enjoy motorized
outdoor activities...just like you know a lot about 'em. Then I actually
met a few...

Jerry Bransford > wrote in news:%mHfg.1322$sP1.50
@fed1read07:

[snip]
> And Rick, I can't believe you'd call a farmer a "pussy" because he got
> ****ed over offroaders who screwed up his cultivated fields.

He didn't call him a pussy because he got ****ed off. He called him a
pussy because getting ****ed off (and posting to Usenet, I guess) was all
that he apparently did. If such a thing happened to my neighbor's fields,
he'd call the cops, and they'd damn well solve the problem. Like others, I
can't conceive of a rural community where this problem would not be
adequately dealt with if brought to the attention of law enforcement.
Perhaps OP is an absentee gentleman hobby-farmer?

"billy ray" > wrote in
:

> You may have something there.
>
> If the liberals and Demoncrats could keep their pants zipped the
> population would drop severely and decent people might again populate
> the earth.

Yeah! *belch* now get back in the kitchen and GET ME SOME PIE, BITCH!

Jeff DeWitt > wrote in news:0kKfg.11712$Qg.4920
@tornado.southeast.rr.com:

> The Nazi's were the "National Socialist German Workers Party", which is
> hardly far right!

Right is as right does, Jeff; learn your history. The Nazis were not in
the least socialist, no matter what their name says; in fact, socialists
and other leftists were very much a persecuted group under the Nazi regime.

Oh boy are we getting way off topic however...

I don't claim to be an expert on the Nazis, but among other unsavory
things they were they WERE socialists.

A few points, Nazi's promoted the limiting of profits, abolishment of
rent and increasing social benefits, all socialist ideas.

There is an excellent essay from Nobel Prize winner Friedrich A. Hayek
titled "The Socialist Roots of Nazism"

http://lamar.colostate.edu/~grjan/hayeknaziism.html

I suspect that the reason that it's commonly accepted that Nazism isn't
really socialism is because the Socialists are (correctly) terrified to
be connected with Nazism in any way and react very strongly to any
suggestion that Nazism was socialist.

In other words it's not politically correct to link the two... but then
I'm not politically correct!

Jeff DeWitt

Mary Malmros wrote:
> Jeff DeWitt > wrote in news:0kKfg.11712$Qg.4920
> @tornado.southeast.rr.com:
>
>
>>The Nazi's were the "National Socialist German Workers Party", which is
>>hardly far right!
>
>
> Right is as right does, Jeff; learn your history. The Nazis were not in
> the least socialist, no matter what their name says; in fact, socialists
> and other leftists were very much a persecuted group under the Nazi regime.

Everybody now knows how evil Nazi eugenics we How all sorts of people
were exterminated not because of anything they had done but simply because
of the way they had been born. And we have all heard how disastrous were the
Nazi efforts to build up the "master race" through selective breeding of SS
men with the best of German women -- the "Lebensborn" project. Good leftists
today recoil in horror from all that of course and use their "Hitler was a
conservative" mantra to load those evils onto conservatives. But Hitler was
a socialist. As he himself said:

"We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic system
for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries,
with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and
property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all
determined to destroy this system under all conditions." (Speech of May 1,
1927. Quoted by Toland, 1976, p. 306)



"Mary Malmros" > wrote in message
...
> Jeff DeWitt > wrote in news:0kKfg.11712$Qg.4920
> @tornado.southeast.rr.com:
>
>> The Nazi's were the "National Socialist German Workers Party", which is
>> hardly far right!
>
> Right is as right does, Jeff; learn your history. The Nazis were not in
> the least socialist, no matter what their name says; in fact, socialists
> and other leftists were very much a persecuted group under the Nazi
> regime.