Bad news, possible cracked head

Took my SW2 in to Sears Auto for an oil change. After doing the job they
told me to take the car into an engine shop ASAP, because when they
pulled the dipstick out a little smoke was coming out and "that usually
means a cracked head gasket". So all the money I spent at the Saturn
dealership trying to get them to tell me what was wrong seems to have
been a waste. They charged me alot of money but never were able to fix
the problem of my car getting very warm. AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!

Looks like my new tires will have to wait until I get this checked out.
I doubt the $350 or so I'm saving for tires will be enough to replace a
cracked head. This really bites....


Jeff

A little smoke constitutes a bad head? Come on... Every car gets
moisture in the crankcase at one time or another. I would assume you
mean steam rather than smoke. Either way, maybe they are blowing smoke


I wouldn't count on anything that an 'oil changer' at Sears has to tell
me, especially diagnosing major engine trouble. How did the oil look?
If you have coolant getting into the crankcase, the oil should have
been like chocolate milk.

James

J B wrote:
> Took my SW2 in to Sears Auto for an oil change. After doing the job they
> told me to take the car into an engine shop ASAP, because when they
> pulled the dipstick out a little smoke was coming out and "that usually
> means a cracked head gasket". So all the money I spent at the Saturn
> dealership trying to get them to tell me what was wrong seems to have
> been a waste. They charged me alot of money but never were able to fix
> the problem of my car getting very warm. AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!
>
> Looks like my new tires will have to wait until I get this checked out.
> I doubt the $350 or so I'm saving for tires will be enough to replace a
> cracked head. This really bites....
>
>
> Jeff

In article >,
says...
> Took my SW2 in to Sears Auto for an oil change. After doing the job they
> told me to take the car into an engine shop ASAP, because when they
> pulled the dipstick out a little smoke was coming out and "that usually
> means a cracked head gasket". So all the money I spent at the Saturn
> dealership trying to get them to tell me what was wrong seems to have
> been a waste. They charged me alot of money but never were able to fix
> the problem of my car getting very warm. AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!
>
> Looks like my new tires will have to wait until I get this checked out.
> I doubt the $350 or so I'm saving for tires will be enough to replace a
> cracked head. This really bites....
>
>
> Jeff
>
-- .. ... - . .-. ..-. .- -.-. - / .. ... / .- -. / .. -.. .. --- -

Your post title is troll fodder. A bad "head gasket" and "bad head" are
two differnt things. You have a SW2 which has a Twincam which does not
have head casting flaws which means you likely have a bad head gasket
not a bad head. Probably do to overheating if this is the case. Before
you jump to conclusions have YOU ever noticed a measurable loss of
engine coolant???
This could simply be "moisture" in your crank case. A cylinder leak
down & compression test as well as a pressure test of the cooling system
would be VERY WISE before going any further. If they say you need a new
head or head gasket they had better prove it. Some grease monkey at
sears is could be all gun ho over over nothing. (Maybe someone related
to misterfullofcrap.)

-- .. ... - . .-. ..-. .- -.-. - / .. ... / .- -. / .. -.. .. --- -

James - They did say 'smoke' but since I didn't see it for myself I
don't know if it was steam or smoke. It was a hot sunny day, no rain or
moisture to speak of, so would it have been possible to get enough
"moisture in the crankcase" to cause some steam like that? The oil was
very dirty and needed changing at least a month ago. I wouldn't say it
looked like chocolate milk, just real dirty oil. I've been real good
with oil changes on this car, except for this one time.

I am concerned because I've known for quite awhile something hasn't been
right under the hood. The engine gets hot but doesn't overheat, because
I make a point of not driving it far like I've wanted to do. I basically
go to work, the store and back home. Oh well, this mystery will be
solved someday when I save enough pesos.
Jeff

In article >,
says...
> James - They did say 'smoke' but since I didn't see it for myself I
> don't know if it was steam or smoke. It was a hot sunny day, no rain or
> moisture to speak of, so would it have been possible to get enough
> "moisture in the crankcase" to cause some steam like that? The oil was
> very dirty and needed changing at least a month ago. I wouldn't say it
> looked like chocolate milk, just real dirty oil. I've been real good
> with oil changes on this car, except for this one time.
>
> I am concerned because I've known for quite awhile something hasn't been
> right under the hood. The engine gets hot but doesn't overheat, because
> I make a point of not driving it far like I've wanted to do. I basically
> go to work, the store and back home. Oh well, this mystery will be
> solved someday when I save enough pesos.
> Jeff

So they were showing you dirty 3000 mile oil? And you dont go one long
trips now? Like no more than 15 min drives? From what I read this tells
me that there has been enough opportunities for moisture to build up in
your crank case. Moisture collects in your engine just like it collects
on grass early in the morning. Again I ask have "you" noticed a
measureable loss of engine coolant?

BlaBla wrote: "...have YOU ever noticed a measurable loss of engine
coolant?"

Absolutely none in fact. I guess it was last winter that Sears changed
the antifreeze to the orange colored coolant that's made for cars with
some wear on the engine. I didn't know they were going to change it and
they didn't charge me, but it was something that needed done. Never
ever, before or since have I had to add coolant. However, during this
long hot summer I did have to add a quart of oil two different times
because the engine did burn some of that up. I'm assuming that's not a
huge deal considering the heat we've had ths year. And one of the times
I added a quart was after the one long drive I took this year.

Just so you guys know how this all started: It was actually over 2 years
ago that a truck tire tread flew off a truck that was 2 spots in front
of me on the highway. The tread hit the car in front of me, went under
his car, his back wheels popped the tread back into the air, then hit
and broke the shield under my bumper before going underneath me car. The
Saturn dealership here in Omaha 'eventually' told me a piece of the
shield lodged up against the "intake gasket" which they replaced. I
swear though that before they changed that gasket, that I heard a small
piece of the shield get sucked up into the engine. Maybe that's not even
possible but it sure did seem like it. Anyways, immediately after the
truck tire tread caused the damage my car has ALWAYS been running warm
but has never overheated. And after changing a thermostat, a water pump,
and an intake gasket, I still can't take the car on long trips. It
wouldn't be so bad if I had money to continually throw at the problem
but I'm just an average working stiff trying to pay the rent every
month.
That's the breaks I guess.

Oil changers at Sears! and parts changers at Saturn dealer! Did the oil
changer take a sample of the oil so you could have it analyzed by an oil
lab? Did they save the filter so it could be cut apart and inspected? Did
they have the equipment to test the coolant for combustion products?

If the coolant is leaking into the oil then this would only cause
overheating if the coolant level got very low and this would result in more
than just a little coolant in the oil, this is often visible on the dipstick
(and often referred to as 'making oil' due to the rising level) and it would
be readily visible in the drained oil, .however I suspect that the oil
flunky just drained the oil into a big sump where it was not possible to let
it settle out to check for coolant. This is just another good reason to
change your own oil and to drain it into a CLEAN pan so it can be checked
after settling..

When a blown head gasket causes overheating it is more common for the
combustion products to blow INTO the coolant and this can cause overheating
but will usually also show as foamy or oily and dark contaminated coolant.
In this case the coolant will only leak into the cylinder after shutdown
(due to the cooling system pressure) and usually only in small quantities
that will normally get blown out the tailpipe on the next startup.

AFAIK the twin cam head does not suffer the casting problem that the 96-97
single cam heads did. IMHO a gasket problem is more likely, but suspect
that any overheating is more likely cased by some other problem. I suggest
you find a real mechanic and rule out the more common problems first. They
are lack of coolant circulation due to plugged or corroded radiator or
thermostat that is not opening fully. Any obstruction of the airflow or a
dirty rad or ac rad or missing lower air dam or faulty fan can cause
overheating as can faulty ignition timing. The most obvious thing to check
is the gauge which may be reading high.

As in all mechanics eliminate the most common and easy to fix problems
before jumping to expensive conclusions.

Good luck, YMMV


"James1549" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>A little smoke constitutes a bad head? Come on... Every car gets
> moisture in the crankcase at one time or another. I would assume you
> mean steam rather than smoke. Either way, maybe they are blowing smoke
>
>
> I wouldn't count on anything that an 'oil changer' at Sears has to tell
> me, especially diagnosing major engine trouble. How did the oil look?
> If you have coolant getting into the crankcase, the oil should have
> been like chocolate milk.
>
> James
>
> J B wrote:
>> Took my SW2 in to Sears Auto for an oil change. After doing the job they
>> told me to take the car into an engine shop ASAP, because when they
>> pulled the dipstick out a little smoke was coming out and "that usually
>> means a cracked head gasket". So all the money I spent at the Saturn
>> dealership trying to get them to tell me what was wrong seems to have
>> been a waste. They charged me alot of money but never were able to fix
>> the problem of my car getting very warm. AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!
>>
>> Looks like my new tires will have to wait until I get this checked out.
>> I doubt the $350 or so I'm saving for tires will be enough to replace a
>> cracked head. This really bites....
>>
>>
>> Jeff
>

Posted my reply before finishing it. Just wanted to add that Saturn did
check the cooling system on two different occasions. According to them
it was working properly. I will write down what you suggested I do to it
next. Thanks for the advice, Jeff

I'm learning alot here guys. Appreciate the info. I'll write some of
this stuff down tomorrow after work.

Thanks, Jeff

SW2Driver, my SL1 was getting warmer than usual and then it started leaving
oil in the garage. Yup it was at least a head gasket, and could be more if
they find a crack in the head or it needs to me machined. The cost that
Saturn quoted just for the head gasket change (apparently the intake and
exhaust manifold gaskets must be changed as well) was $943. Since the car
was old I just sold it to a local machanic, didn't want to deal with that
kind of expense on an old car.