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Electronic Throttle



 
 
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  #1  
Old March 31st 10, 06:52 PM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.gm,alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
OldHarleyRider
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default Electronic Throttle

It is amazing how many people have posted in response to the Electronic
Throttle (drive by wire)problem, or sudden acceleration, or unintended
acceleration. I noticed that all the posters mention either their
educational background or the amount of research they have done. I am
surprised that Albert Einstein hasn't come out of his grave to respond.

I have not read one post that mentioned a personal experience with the
problem.

I have had a personal experience with unintended acceleration. My wife
and I purchased a 2006 Mustang GT coupe in October of 2006. Two months
later the Mustang went full throttle all by itself.

We visited a friend the Saturday before Christmas to see his light
display. I pulled into his driveway and parked there for about 20
minutes (with the engine running) to look at all the lights. He did
have hoops stretched across the driveway with all kinds of flashing
lights. Upon leaving, put the car into reverse and backed out, then into
drive to go forward. When I put it into drive the throttle went wide
open all by itself (and yes my foot was on the brake, not thee
accelerator). He lives on a corner, so I had to make a left 100' from
his driveway, and a right turn at a corner 300' away. I was too busy
trying to stop the car, and steer the car to make any other moves. It
was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process put my
other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was $20,000.00
across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage 6
inches off its foundation).

I don't know why these malfunctions (crashes) of the drive by wire
system are a surprise. The engine controls are computer controlled, I
repeat, computer controlled. How many times in the past has your
computer crashed, or locked up, or malfunctioned.

We did get rid of the Mustang, and I will not buy another vehicle
without checking under the hood. If the vehicle does not have a cable or
linkage controlling the throttle body I won't buy it....



Ads
  #2  
Old April 1st 10, 01:26 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.gm,alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
Bill Putney
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,410
Default Electronic Throttle

Rodan wrote:
>...When I read your story and the story of the guy whose runaway
> car went 45 minutes without stopping, I think that carmakers
> should add a new safety device; some kind of a switch or a key
> easily within the driver's reach where he could stop the car quickly
> before causing damage or injury by turning off the ignition.


Umm - they already have those miracle devices. They're called "gear
shift levers with neutral positions". Why would you add another
confusion factor and more clutter into the mix?

--
Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')
  #3  
Old April 1st 10, 01:31 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.gm,alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
Bill Putney
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,410
Default Electronic Throttle

OldHarleyRider wrote:

> ...It
> was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process put my
> other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was $20,000.00
> across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage 6
> inches off its foundation).


> ...We did get rid of the Mustang,...


Let me see if I understand what you just said: Your Mustang hit a
Cadillac and then hit a garage so hard that it knocked it 6 inches off
its foundation. Then you had the choice of keeping and driving that
same Mustang that had done that or get rid of it? Please forgive me if
I think you are FOS to try to have us believe that the car that hit one
car and then knocked a garage off its foundation was not totaled in the
process. Your story lacks credibility.

--
Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')
  #4  
Old April 1st 10, 01:51 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.gm,alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 931
Default Electronic Throttle

On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:52:32 -0400, OldHarleyRider
> wrote:

>It is amazing how many people have posted in response to the Electronic
>Throttle (drive by wire)problem, or sudden acceleration, or unintended
>acceleration. I noticed that all the posters mention either their
>educational background or the amount of research they have done. I am
>surprised that Albert Einstein hasn't come out of his grave to respond.
>
>I have not read one post that mentioned a personal experience with the
>problem.
>
>I have had a personal experience with unintended acceleration. My wife
>and I purchased a 2006 Mustang GT coupe in October of 2006. Two months
>later the Mustang went full throttle all by itself.
>
>We visited a friend the Saturday before Christmas to see his light
>display. I pulled into his driveway and parked there for about 20
>minutes (with the engine running) to look at all the lights. He did
>have hoops stretched across the driveway with all kinds of flashing
>lights. Upon leaving, put the car into reverse and backed out, then into
>drive to go forward. When I put it into drive the throttle went wide
>open all by itself (and yes my foot was on the brake, not thee
>accelerator). He lives on a corner, so I had to make a left 100' from
>his driveway, and a right turn at a corner 300' away. I was too busy
>trying to stop the car, and steer the car to make any other moves. It
>was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process put my
>other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was $20,000.00
>across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage 6
>inches off its foundation).
>
>I don't know why these malfunctions (crashes) of the drive by wire
>system are a surprise. The engine controls are computer controlled, I
>repeat, computer controlled. How many times in the past has your
>computer crashed, or locked up, or malfunctioned.
>
>We did get rid of the Mustang, and I will not buy another vehicle
>without checking under the hood. If the vehicle does not have a cable or
>linkage controlling the throttle body I won't buy it....
>
>

Be prepared to buy older used cars in the near future - DBW is going
to be almost universal within a couple of years. You can bet on it.

  #5  
Old April 1st 10, 02:48 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
OldHarleyRider
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default Electronic Throttle



Bill Putney wrote:
> OldHarleyRider wrote:
>
>> ...It was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process
>> put my other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was
>> $20,000.00
>> across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage
>> 6 inches off its foundation).

>
>> ...We did get rid of the Mustang,...

>
> Let me see if I understand what you just said: Your Mustang hit a
> Cadillac and then hit a garage so hard that it knocked it 6 inches off
> its foundation. Then you had the choice of keeping and driving that
> same Mustang that had done that or get rid of it? Please forgive me if
> I think you are FOS to try to have us believe that the car that hit one
> car and then knocked a garage off its foundation was not totaled in the
> process. Your story lacks credibility.
>

Well, Mr. Putney.

It happened just that way. Give me a good e-mail address and I'll send
the photos of everything that happened. Then you can shut your FOS mouth....
  #6  
Old April 1st 10, 02:54 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
OldHarleyRider
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default Electronic Throttle



wrote:
> On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:52:32 -0400, OldHarleyRider
> > wrote:
>
>> It is amazing how many people have posted in response to the Electronic
>> Throttle (drive by wire)problem, or sudden acceleration, or unintended
>> acceleration. I noticed that all the posters mention either their
>> educational background or the amount of research they have done. I am
>> surprised that Albert Einstein hasn't come out of his grave to respond.
>>
>> I have not read one post that mentioned a personal experience with the
>> problem.
>>
>> I have had a personal experience with unintended acceleration. My wife
>> and I purchased a 2006 Mustang GT coupe in October of 2006. Two months
>> later the Mustang went full throttle all by itself.
>>
>> We visited a friend the Saturday before Christmas to see his light
>> display. I pulled into his driveway and parked there for about 20
>> minutes (with the engine running) to look at all the lights. He did
>> have hoops stretched across the driveway with all kinds of flashing
>> lights. Upon leaving, put the car into reverse and backed out, then into
>> drive to go forward. When I put it into drive the throttle went wide
>> open all by itself (and yes my foot was on the brake, not thee
>> accelerator). He lives on a corner, so I had to make a left 100' from
>> his driveway, and a right turn at a corner 300' away. I was too busy
>> trying to stop the car, and steer the car to make any other moves. It
>> was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process put my
>> other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was $20,000.00
>> across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage 6
>> inches off its foundation).
>>
>> I don't know why these malfunctions (crashes) of the drive by wire
>> system are a surprise. The engine controls are computer controlled, I
>> repeat, computer controlled. How many times in the past has your
>> computer crashed, or locked up, or malfunctioned.
>>
>> We did get rid of the Mustang, and I will not buy another vehicle
>> without checking under the hood. If the vehicle does not have a cable or
>> linkage controlling the throttle body I won't buy it....
>>
>>

> Be prepared to buy older used cars in the near future - DBW is going
> to be almost universal within a couple of years. You can bet on it.
>

I can believe it. The manufacturers don't learn from their mistakes.
Can you imagine Mercedes had a brake by wire system... It didn't last
long....
  #7  
Old April 1st 10, 03:00 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 931
Default Electronic Throttle

On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:54:43 -0400, OldHarleyRider
> wrote:

>
>
wrote:
>> On Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:52:32 -0400, OldHarleyRider
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> It is amazing how many people have posted in response to the Electronic
>>> Throttle (drive by wire)problem, or sudden acceleration, or unintended
>>> acceleration. I noticed that all the posters mention either their
>>> educational background or the amount of research they have done. I am
>>> surprised that Albert Einstein hasn't come out of his grave to respond.
>>>
>>> I have not read one post that mentioned a personal experience with the
>>> problem.
>>>
>>> I have had a personal experience with unintended acceleration. My wife
>>> and I purchased a 2006 Mustang GT coupe in October of 2006. Two months
>>> later the Mustang went full throttle all by itself.
>>>
>>> We visited a friend the Saturday before Christmas to see his light
>>> display. I pulled into his driveway and parked there for about 20
>>> minutes (with the engine running) to look at all the lights. He did
>>> have hoops stretched across the driveway with all kinds of flashing
>>> lights. Upon leaving, put the car into reverse and backed out, then into
>>> drive to go forward. When I put it into drive the throttle went wide
>>> open all by itself (and yes my foot was on the brake, not thee
>>> accelerator). He lives on a corner, so I had to make a left 100' from
>>> his driveway, and a right turn at a corner 300' away. I was too busy
>>> trying to stop the car, and steer the car to make any other moves. It
>>> was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process put my
>>> other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was $20,000.00
>>> across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage 6
>>> inches off its foundation).
>>>
>>> I don't know why these malfunctions (crashes) of the drive by wire
>>> system are a surprise. The engine controls are computer controlled, I
>>> repeat, computer controlled. How many times in the past has your
>>> computer crashed, or locked up, or malfunctioned.
>>>
>>> We did get rid of the Mustang, and I will not buy another vehicle
>>> without checking under the hood. If the vehicle does not have a cable or
>>> linkage controlling the throttle body I won't buy it....
>>>
>>>

>> Be prepared to buy older used cars in the near future - DBW is going
>> to be almost universal within a couple of years. You can bet on it.
>>

>I can believe it. The manufacturers don't learn from their mistakes.
>Can you imagine Mercedes had a brake by wire system... It didn't last
>long....

They couldn't sell it in North America or half the rest of the world
where- up 'till now, an "physical connection" needs to be between the
driver and both brakes and steering. - I guess the cable operated
parking brake makes the grade for the connection for brakes. (I guess
hydraulic is still 'physical too) - but for steering it still requires
a mechanical connection - hydraulic remote steering doesn't make the
grade for on-road vehicles - although my brother says the "rubber
railroad" articulated trucks - cement mixers etc - are fully hydraulic
steering - - - -.
  #8  
Old April 1st 10, 11:12 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.gm,alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
David Skelton[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18
Default Electronic Throttle


> When I read your story and the story of the guy whose runaway
> car went 45 minutes without stopping, I think that carmakers
> should add a new safety device; some kind of a switch or a key
> easily within the driver's reach where he could stop the car quickly
> before causing damage or injury by turning off the ignition.
>
> Rodan.
>
>


I do that to our cars, a switch in series to the fuel pump (hidden).

It makes for an unusual immobiliser, and enables the engine to be cranked
after an oil change until the oil pressure light goes out without starting,
as long as the engine was stopped by lack of fuel supply.

Best regards

David

BTW, I did describe the occurrences of unintended acceleration in three
vehicles in this thread.



--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---
  #9  
Old April 1st 10, 03:04 PM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
Scott Dorsey
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,914
Default Electronic Throttle

In article m>,
OldHarleyRider > wrote:
>
>
>Bill Putney wrote:
>> OldHarleyRider wrote:
>>
>>> ...It was the wildest 6-8 second ride in my life. I did in the process
>>> put my other foot on the brake also, to no avail. Total damage was
>>> $20,000.00
>>> across 2 lawns, hit a Cadillac and ran into a garage (moved the garage
>>> 6 inches off its foundation).

>>
>>> ...We did get rid of the Mustang,...

>>
>> Let me see if I understand what you just said: Your Mustang hit a
>> Cadillac and then hit a garage so hard that it knocked it 6 inches off
>> its foundation. Then you had the choice of keeping and driving that
>> same Mustang that had done that or get rid of it? Please forgive me if
>> I think you are FOS to try to have us believe that the car that hit one
>> car and then knocked a garage off its foundation was not totaled in the
>> process. Your story lacks credibility.
>>

>Well, Mr. Putney.
>
>It happened just that way. Give me a good e-mail address and I'll send
>the photos of everything that happened. Then you can shut your FOS mouth....


It sounds pretty silly to me. I used to have an MGB with a throttle
that would stick all the time... I'd have to shut off the ignition, put out
the clutch and coast to the side and free the damn thing up. Eventually
after a few times of this happening on the highway I just got a new throttle
cable.

Stuff sticks. Stuff goes wrong. Life's just like that. That's why cars
have operators who can deal with it when things happen. That's not an excuse
to allow your car to get out of control. You've got a clutch and a key.

Now, folks in a car where there is no clutch and no key and only a button
have sort of a different problem, mostly because they don't have the reflexes
to shut them off after many years of driving cars with a more conventional
interface. That's partly the fault of the manufacturer for changing an
interface that has been around for a a long time and partly the fault of
the operator for not learning the new interface.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  #10  
Old April 2nd 10, 02:10 AM posted to alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.gm,alt.autos.ford,alt.autos.bmw
Bill Putney
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,410
Default Electronic Throttle

PeterD wrote:

> One thing is that with some cars, the key is durned hard to reach
> however... Certainly not a quick access device. I'm beginning to think
> that cars need a "Big Red Kill Switch" on the dash, that kills the
> engine completely if pressed. It should be stout enough to not allow
> accidential pushes, but big enough and easy enough to be seen and used
> in an emergency. It would take a few years for drivers to get 'used'
> to the fact it is there, but evetually drivers would realize it as a
> safety feature.


It would create problems due to the steering being very hard to turn
with the engine off (and some loss of braking capability). If that were
the only option, then - yeah - that might be the preferred method. But,
again, there is a better way:

Best to simply throw the shifter in neutral. It's *already* there (no
need to add more clutter, complecity, and expense), the engine is rev.
limited in neutral so it won't self destruct. Then get the car safely
stopped, *then* shut the engine off.

The public could be educated to automatically think about it for when
the unthinkable happens, and/or educational decals could be mandated for
every car for benefit of the unteachable and to satisfy the lawyers and
the nanny state. We don't need more switches and wires.

--
Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')
 




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