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Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- The Story....



 
 
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  #11  
Old March 7th 08, 11:20 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.honda
hobbes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11
Default Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- TheStory ....

On Feb 25, 8:08*am, hobbes > wrote:
> On Jan 16, 2:43*pm, hobbes > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jan 15, 8:46*pm, hobbes > wrote:

>
> > > Hi Jeffery,

>
> > > I was reading some of your posts about your overheating engine, sorry
> > > to learn you are having some much trouble. I am afraid I am not an
> > > expert in cars and am sort of learning as I go along .....

>
> > > Oxygen Sensors are more to do with emissions than overheating engines.
> > > If a sensor fails it usually fails safe. Say you cut all the wires to
> > > the sensor, the engine will still run because the ECM car computer
> > > uses a default value and keeps your car running. Your catalytic
> > > converter may suffer a bit as will your miles per gallon petrol usage,
> > > but it is usually O.K. to drive around for a few days until you can
> > > bring the car to a repair place.

>
> > > The fact that your battery light came on and the oil presure light I
> > > think means your engine stopped running. This means the servo
> > > assistance on the brakes also is not there. Your foot brakes will
> > > work, but they are much harder to push because there is no engine to
> > > help apply preasure. Likewise you may have found the steering also
> > > harder to turn the wheel. Again the power assistance to the steering
> > > may also have been lost.

>
> > > I think your temperature gauge is not lying and there is also a high
> > > temp warning light and I did not see you mentioning that coming on. So
> > > I think your engine did not overheat in this instance.

>
> > > Hope you can get your puppy fixed up OK.

>
> > > Warmest regards, Mike.

>
> > > On Jan 15, 6:45*pm, "Jeffrey D." > wrote:

>
> > > > hobbes, just a clarification.

>
> > > > When the check engine light turned on or flashed on, did you have
> > > > trouble working on the brakes? I mean were the breaks and accelerator
> > > > was really hard to push making you to stop???

>
> > > > I had the same problem - the oil pressure and battery lights flashed
> > > > on while i was driving and it was too difficult to push for the brakes
> > > > to the floor and I used the handbreak instead to stop the
> > > > car...somebody told me it was due to overheating that's why the lights
> > > > flashed. But i did not see the temp gauge moving up to the maximum....

>
> > > > So this is also an O2 sensor failure???

>
> > > > thanks!!!

>
> > > > JD- Hide quoted text -

>
> > > - Show quoted text -

>
> > Hi,

>
> > I just filled up with Petrol and over 197.3 miles I used 6.135 Gallons
> > of petrol. So I have about 32 MPG. This I think is what I was getting
> > before on my average weekly usage. I had two days worth running with
> > the Check Engine Light on, and about five days with the new Oxygen
> > Sensor installed. I suspect that the old O2 sensor was still working,
> > just that the heater bit was broken. Hence I was only getting bad fuel
> > consumption when the car is cold which is not for very long.

>
> > So far the car runs like it was before. I cannot tell the difference.
> > So I gues so far the Oxygen Sensor is working O.K.

>
> > Finger crossed ..... Mike.- Hide quoted text -

>
> > - Show quoted text -

>
> It has been a month now .... still OK .... touch wood....
>
> Best, Mike.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -


At at about the two month point since I put in that Bosch Oxygen
Sensor. Running good. The MPG is really no change and I average about
31 MPG which is what I used to get. So that is about 800 miles on the
car.

Best, Mike.
Ads
  #12  
Old March 9th 08, 05:43 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.honda
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 301
Default Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- TheStory ....

I too have had excellent luck with Bosch sensors, particularly their
new "planar" type. Don't care for the old thimbles.

Stay away from the Denso junk.



On Jan 12, 9:55 am, hobbes > wrote:
> Keywords: Honda Civic LX 1999 D16Y7 Oxygen Sensor P0135 ODBII
>
> Holly smokes! Panic! The Check Engine light is on. First time that
> happened, pulled into a petrol station and put in more oil. That did
> not solve the problem and made no difference. That was about a year
> ago. Since then I have learned to control my panic and be more cool ...
> "the name's Bond, James Bond."
>
> First time round, took the car to Honda. After $US 105 light was out
> no clue what was wrong. One month later, light on again. Bought an
> Actron CP9175 analyzer and have never looked back. The fault turned
> out to be a wiring rubbing against a belt. Re-clipped the wire and the
> light went out. Two years later when that Check Engine Light came on,
> I was neither shaken nor stirred.
>
> Driving home from work and that dam idiot light come .... Arrgghhh Check
> Engine Light. Ok. Cool. Think James Bond. Get home and connect up the
> analyzer. The scan tool diagnostic connector is just above your left
> leg shin when you are sitting in the driver's seat, it is on the wall
> up against the steering wheel overhang. The code that comes up is
> P0135 (with a zero not a "O"). This means "Primary heated Oxygen
> Sensor heater circuit fault". In the car this is the Oxygen Sensor
> uppermost before the catalytic converter. When you open the bonnet (or
> hood), it is the sensor uppermost before the catalytic converter.
>
> The Oxygen Sensor is connected to the ECM / PCM with a connector that
> sits on top of the engine. To disconnect this connector you need to
> pop the plastic clip on top. Then ease out gently the ECM / PCM
> connector side out. I found using a screw driver helped to ease it
> off. The other side of the connector is connected to the oxygen sensor
> and is attached to the engine block via a clip underneath. To detach
> this you need to reach under the clip near the front and lift up the
> release catch. Then ease this off.
>
> Looking at the connector to the oxygen sensor, with the Attach to
> Engine clip on the bottom, check the resistance between the bottom two
> pins with an electrical multimeter. It should be between 10 to 40
> ohms. In my case I had an open circuit. You also need to check for a
> short between either of these pins and the body of the oxygen sensor
> i.e. ground / battery negative terminal. If you have a short, then you
> need a new oxygen sensor.
>
> OK so it looks like I need a new oxygen sensor. Recliped the connector
> and set things back. Note you can drive the car even with the Primary
> oxygen sensor disconnected. In this case the PGM / ECM computer will
> use a default internal value. Your fuel consumption will be slightly
> worse. In my case I actually could not tell the difference.
>
> The oxygen sensor I got hold of was a Bosch BS13007 which I bought
> from AutoZone for $US 90. You can get these cheaper on the net at
> about $US 75 but I wanted the assurance that if it was not the right
> one, I could return it without too much hassle. The OEM one in the
> Honda is in fact a Denso Oxygen sensor. I went with Bosch mainly
> because it was the one in stock at the AutoZone shop. It comes with a
> 1-year guarantee. The guy at AutoZone was actually pretty good. Check
> to make sure I had the right oxygen sensor and also recommended the
> right Oxygen Sensor ratchet tool.
>
> Tools you need are an Oxygen Sensor socket; this is a socket with a
> slit in it for the Oxygen Sensor wire. The one you need is the one
> with the 1/2 inch drive ratchet hole offset on the side. The ones with
> the 1/2 drive ratchet whole on top were too long to maneuver onto the
> Oxygen sensor due to the proximity of the radiator hoses. The other
> thing I bought was some PB Blaster oil penetrate to help loosen up
> bolts and a tube of high-temperature anti seize compound
>
> Back at home time to change the oxygen sensor while the engine was
> still warm-ish. There are lots of theories as to if a hot, warm or
> cold engine makes this easier. My take on it is you want the engine
> warmish, to hot and you fry yourself. And cold makes getting the
> sensor out of the exhaust manifold a bitch.
>
> I first disconnected the battery to make sure I did not short out any
> electronics and to make sure the car would not start on me. I then I
> disconnected the Oxygen sensor wire socked. Now take off the two bolts
> on the exhaust heat shield and remove that. You may need gloves to do
> this because it is sort of hot. Leather garden gloves work well. My
> bolts were sort of rusty. And the 12mm wrench socket stuck to the
> bolts a bit. A small drop of WD-40 or PB Blaster made this problem go
> away. Take off the heat shield and carefully maneuver it past the
> Oxygen sensor and the radiator hoses. It is tight but it will come
> out. Thread the Oxygen sensor wire past through the heat shield and
> place the heat shield to one side. You can now see the Oxygen Sensor.
>
> Spray some PB Blaster onto the sensor and exhaust manifold join. I
> think the PB helps loosen things up a bit, BUT also if you spray
> slighty more on the sensor, it cools the sensor more than the
> surrounding exhaust manifold and makes it contract faster and hence
> easier to get out. Place the socket wrench on the Oxygen sensor first.
> Then connect up the ratchet. The socket does not stick to the ratchet
> as with other sockets, and you will lose the socket in the depths of
> the engine .... like me the first time around if you try and balance it
> on the socket wrench. Then tug and try and loosen the sensor. Mine
> luckly came out easily. Other people I have read needed breaker bars
> and a lot more force.
>
> I then put extra anti seize onto the new sensor, taking care to keep
> it on the threads only and away from the business end of the sensor.
> The sensor did come with some anti-seize, but I added more and
> smoothed it over to ensure a nice even coating. Put the sensor in,
> making sure the tip does not touch anything oily. Re-assembly is the
> reverse of everything up to now.
>
> The bosch sensor wire did not come with the rubber grommet that helps
> secure the wire to engine clip and is longer in length. I clipped back
> the wire connector clip, and used a few cable ties to secure the wire
> away from the exhaust heat shield and radiator fan.
>
> Hooked up the battery ..... Hmmm moment of truth ..... Ignition stage II.
> Clear the codes with the Actron. Then hit the starter. Engine fires
> and the Check Engine Light remains off. Mission accomplished James.
>
> Hope this is helpful to some one ....
>
> Good luck. Best, Mike.


  #13  
Old March 9th 08, 05:47 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.honda
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 301
Default Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- TheStory ....

Excellent, the planars reach light off temperature much faster, uses
less heater energy, and are more resistant to contamination because of
the planar design:

http://www.boschautoparts.com/Produc...s/PlanarO2.htm

I don't see any advantage in Denso. I'd stay away from them.




On Jan 15, 7:54 am, hobbes > wrote:
> Thanks for the tip. I have been driving around for a while now with
> the Bosch one. It seems O.K. ... then again I am not that much of a
> car expert. I think my one is the Planar Oxygen sensor type.
>
> Just as a matter of interest, what are the main advantages of the
> Denso o2 sensors when compared with Bosch? Are there big differences.
> Maybe when the Bosch breaks I will get a Denso next time around. Is
> the Denso also a Planar type?
>
> Best, Mike.


  #14  
Old March 9th 08, 06:00 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.honda
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 301
Default Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- TheStory ....

There really isn't a "universal" oxygen sensor that fits all cars.
Oxygen sensors have different response profiles, even among the
popular heated narrow band type.

However, since groups of sensors (eg. heated narrow band) may have the
same response profile, it's possible to splice on the old connector to
a new "universal" one of the *same response profile*. That's where
Bosch's "universal" line comes in. They're actually like 12 different
types. I've used them with good results.

Bosch universal heated sensors:
http://www.boschautoparts.com/Produc...tedSensors.htm

So pick sensors only based on manufacturer's application catalog, not
by "cross referencing".

IMO NTK sensors and NGK spark plugs (actually NTK/NGK are the same
company) are superior to Denso. However, for sensors I'd go for Bosch
planar.




On Jan 15, 1:31 pm, hobbes > wrote:
> So in a nutshell it is important to get the right Sensor for your car.
> I think it is better to stay away from "Universal" sensors, and get
> one which is within the OEM specs, be it a Bosch, Denso etc. That will
> have the right number of holes / slits and Spinell layer coating for
> (a) big enough voltage output to the ECM and (b) effective use
> longevity. I.E. You need to look very carefully at all the Oxygen
> Sensors and pick one which is OEM replacement type for your car.

  #15  
Old March 9th 08, 06:45 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.honda
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 301
Default Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- TheStory ....

I too have had excellent luck with Bosch sensors, particularly their
new "planar" type. Don't care for the old thimbles.

Stay away from the Denso junk.


On Mar 7, 2:20 pm, hobbes > wrote:
>
> At at about the two month point since I put in that Bosch Oxygen
> Sensor. Running good. The MPG is really no change and I average about
> 31 MPG which is what I used to get. So that is about 800 miles on the
> car.
>
> Best, Mike.


  #16  
Old November 5th 16, 02:14 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.honda
hobbes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Honda Civic 1999, P0135, Oxygen Sensor Change, D16Y7 --- TheStory ....

On Saturday, January 12, 2008 at 12:55:08 PM UTC-5, hobbes wrote:
> Keywords: Honda Civic LX 1999 D16Y7 Oxygen Sensor P0135 ODBII
>
> Holly smokes! Panic! The Check Engine light is on. First time that
> happened, pulled into a petrol station and put in more oil. That did
> not solve the problem and made no difference. That was about a year
> ago. Since then I have learned to control my panic and be more cool ...
> "the name's Bond, James Bond."
>
> First time round, took the car to Honda. After $US 105 light was out
> no clue what was wrong. One month later, light on again. Bought an
> Actron CP9175 analyzer and have never looked back. The fault turned
> out to be a wiring rubbing against a belt. Re-clipped the wire and the
> light went out. Two years later when that Check Engine Light came on,
> I was neither shaken nor stirred.
>
> Driving home from work and that dam idiot light come .... Arrgghhh Check
> Engine Light. Ok. Cool. Think James Bond. Get home and connect up the
> analyzer. The scan tool diagnostic connector is just above your left
> leg shin when you are sitting in the driver's seat, it is on the wall
> up against the steering wheel overhang. The code that comes up is
> P0135 (with a zero not a "O"). This means "Primary heated Oxygen
> Sensor heater circuit fault". In the car this is the Oxygen Sensor
> uppermost before the catalytic converter. When you open the bonnet (or
> hood), it is the sensor uppermost before the catalytic converter.
>
> The Oxygen Sensor is connected to the ECM / PCM with a connector that
> sits on top of the engine. To disconnect this connector you need to
> pop the plastic clip on top. Then ease out gently the ECM / PCM
> connector side out. I found using a screw driver helped to ease it
> off. The other side of the connector is connected to the oxygen sensor
> and is attached to the engine block via a clip underneath. To detach
> this you need to reach under the clip near the front and lift up the
> release catch. Then ease this off.
>
> Looking at the connector to the oxygen sensor, with the Attach to
> Engine clip on the bottom, check the resistance between the bottom two
> pins with an electrical multimeter. It should be between 10 to 40
> ohms. In my case I had an open circuit. You also need to check for a
> short between either of these pins and the body of the oxygen sensor
> i.e. ground / battery negative terminal. If you have a short, then you
> need a new oxygen sensor.
>
> OK so it looks like I need a new oxygen sensor. Recliped the connector
> and set things back. Note you can drive the car even with the Primary
> oxygen sensor disconnected. In this case the PGM / ECM computer will
> use a default internal value. Your fuel consumption will be slightly
> worse. In my case I actually could not tell the difference.
>
> The oxygen sensor I got hold of was a Bosch BS13007 which I bought
> from AutoZone for $US 90. You can get these cheaper on the net at
> about $US 75 but I wanted the assurance that if it was not the right
> one, I could return it without too much hassle. The OEM one in the
> Honda is in fact a Denso Oxygen sensor. I went with Bosch mainly
> because it was the one in stock at the AutoZone shop. It comes with a
> 1-year guarantee. The guy at AutoZone was actually pretty good. Check
> to make sure I had the right oxygen sensor and also recommended the
> right Oxygen Sensor ratchet tool.
>
> Tools you need are an Oxygen Sensor socket; this is a socket with a
> slit in it for the Oxygen Sensor wire. The one you need is the one
> with the 1/2 inch drive ratchet hole offset on the side. The ones with
> the 1/2 drive ratchet whole on top were too long to maneuver onto the
> Oxygen sensor due to the proximity of the radiator hoses. The other
> thing I bought was some PB Blaster oil penetrate to help loosen up
> bolts and a tube of high-temperature anti seize compound
>
> Back at home time to change the oxygen sensor while the engine was
> still warm-ish. There are lots of theories as to if a hot, warm or
> cold engine makes this easier. My take on it is you want the engine
> warmish, to hot and you fry yourself. And cold makes getting the
> sensor out of the exhaust manifold a bitch.
>
> I first disconnected the battery to make sure I did not short out any
> electronics and to make sure the car would not start on me. I then I
> disconnected the Oxygen sensor wire socked. Now take off the two bolts
> on the exhaust heat shield and remove that. You may need gloves to do
> this because it is sort of hot. Leather garden gloves work well. My
> bolts were sort of rusty. And the 12mm wrench socket stuck to the
> bolts a bit. A small drop of WD-40 or PB Blaster made this problem go
> away. Take off the heat shield and carefully maneuver it past the
> Oxygen sensor and the radiator hoses. It is tight but it will come
> out. Thread the Oxygen sensor wire past through the heat shield and
> place the heat shield to one side. You can now see the Oxygen Sensor.
>
> Spray some PB Blaster onto the sensor and exhaust manifold join. I
> think the PB helps loosen things up a bit, BUT also if you spray
> slighty more on the sensor, it cools the sensor more than the
> surrounding exhaust manifold and makes it contract faster and hence
> easier to get out. Place the socket wrench on the Oxygen sensor first.
> Then connect up the ratchet. The socket does not stick to the ratchet
> as with other sockets, and you will lose the socket in the depths of
> the engine .... like me the first time around if you try and balance it
> on the socket wrench. Then tug and try and loosen the sensor. Mine
> luckly came out easily. Other people I have read needed breaker bars
> and a lot more force.
>
> I then put extra anti seize onto the new sensor, taking care to keep
> it on the threads only and away from the business end of the sensor.
> The sensor did come with some anti-seize, but I added more and
> smoothed it over to ensure a nice even coating. Put the sensor in,
> making sure the tip does not touch anything oily. Re-assembly is the
> reverse of everything up to now.
>
> The bosch sensor wire did not come with the rubber grommet that helps
> secure the wire to engine clip and is longer in length. I clipped back
> the wire connector clip, and used a few cable ties to secure the wire
> away from the exhaust heat shield and radiator fan.
>
> Hooked up the battery ..... Hmmm moment of truth ..... Ignition stage II.
> Clear the codes with the Actron. Then hit the starter. Engine fires
> and the Check Engine Light remains off. Mission accomplished James.
>
> Hope this is helpful to some one ....
>
> Good luck. Best, Mike.


Well it has been 8 years and I can report that the Bosch Oxygen sensor is still working. So I guess that is what we can call a long term test. Milage is now 149,000 miles.
 




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