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93 zj nightmare



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 25th 05, 02:39 AM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default 93 zj nightmare

Pulled the distributor to replace bushings, lot of play in the shaft..... re
installed the distibutor then it would not crank, I have learned alot about
the indexing of a 4.0 distributor in the last few days. Now have it running
go around the block, I have no upshift? revved the hell out of it now i have
a nice deep knock in the engine, rod?
It shifted good before i removed the distributor. Came home cut it off....
it would not re crank??? checked the codes 12, 24, 54, 34, 51, 55. Tried to
clear the codes (removed battery cable for 2 hours) still same codes
Cam sensor wires do not look great in the dist, so i will be replacing this
first, but why no up shift???
I need to get it to shift so i can take it to the shop and do the bottom
end, oil pump, bearings etc......




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  #2  
Old January 25th 05, 03:13 AM
DougW
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

jbbiggs67 did pass the time by typing:
> Pulled the distributor to replace bushings, lot of play in the shaft..... re
> installed the distibutor then it would not crank, I have learned alot about
> the indexing of a 4.0 distributor in the last few days.


It would have been easier just to replace the distributor.
http://members.cox.net/wilsond/distributor/
Unless you actually turned the engine you shouldn't have had to re-index the
distributor.

> Now have it running
> go around the block, I have no upshift? revved the hell out of it now i have
> a nice deep knock in the engine, rod?


.... You know this now, but over-revving an engine that isn't working is the
absolute wrong thing to do...

The 4.0 is a zero interference design so you can't bend a valve or rod.

> It shifted good before i removed the distributor. Came home cut it off....
> it would not re crank??? checked the codes 12, 24, 54, 34, 51, 55.


12 (battery disco, check your battery cables)
24 Throttle position sensor input above or
below acceptable voltage. TPS signal does
not correlate to MAP sensor.
54 No camshaft signal detected during engine cranking
34 An open or shorted condition detected in the Speed
Control vacuum or vent solenoid circuits. Speed control
switch input below the minimum acceptable voltage
51 A lean air/fuel mixture has been indicated by an
abnormally rich correction factor. (O2 sensor)
55 (end of codes)

What that's telling me is to check your battery terminals and make sure
they are tight an corrosion free. Also double check the harness. All those
codes won't set normally unless the power has been interrupted.
Also check the Camshaft Position Sensor connector to your distributor and
the Crankshaft Position Sensor Connector down by the dipstick.
http://members.cox.net/wilsond/Fixes...tml#CPSdetails

> Tried to
> clear the codes (removed battery cable for 2 hours) still same codes
> Cam sensor wires do not look great in the dist, so i will be replacing this
> first, but why no up shift???


In the event of a serious engine fault the ECU (engine computer) will prevent
the TCU (transmission computer) from getting out of first. This is to help
prevent extensive damage.

> I need to get it to shift so i can take it to the shop and do the bottom
> end, oil pump, bearings etc......


Depending on what went wrong it may be as simple as a forgotten connection or
you may be looking at having to get the ZJ flatbedded into a shop.

--
-- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.cox.net/wilsond
HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!


  #3  
Old January 25th 05, 04:37 AM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thanks Doug
I was by myself and i installed the distributor and it would not fall into
the oil pump, so i bumped the engine without the hold down in place, the
distributor jumped up instead of falling in so thats where the fun began,
Has anyone pulled the oil pan on these with the engine still inframe?

Thanks
"DougW" > wrote in message
news:hXhJd.7554$8Q.6341@okepread06...
> jbbiggs67 did pass the time by typing:
> > Pulled the distributor to replace bushings, lot of play in the

shaft..... re
> > installed the distibutor then it would not crank, I have learned alot

about
> > the indexing of a 4.0 distributor in the last few days.

>
> It would have been easier just to replace the distributor.
> http://members.cox.net/wilsond/distributor/
> Unless you actually turned the engine you shouldn't have had to re-index

the
> distributor.
>
> > Now have it running
> > go around the block, I have no upshift? revved the hell out of it now i

have
> > a nice deep knock in the engine, rod?

>
> ... You know this now, but over-revving an engine that isn't working is

the
> absolute wrong thing to do...
>
> The 4.0 is a zero interference design so you can't bend a valve or rod.
>
> > It shifted good before i removed the distributor. Came home cut it

off....
> > it would not re crank??? checked the codes 12, 24, 54, 34, 51, 55.

>
> 12 (battery disco, check your battery cables)
> 24 Throttle position sensor input above or
> below acceptable voltage. TPS signal does
> not correlate to MAP sensor.
> 54 No camshaft signal detected during engine cranking
> 34 An open or shorted condition detected in the Speed
> Control vacuum or vent solenoid circuits. Speed control
> switch input below the minimum acceptable voltage
> 51 A lean air/fuel mixture has been indicated by an
> abnormally rich correction factor. (O2 sensor)
> 55 (end of codes)
>
> What that's telling me is to check your battery terminals and make sure
> they are tight an corrosion free. Also double check the harness. All

those
> codes won't set normally unless the power has been interrupted.
> Also check the Camshaft Position Sensor connector to your distributor and
> the Crankshaft Position Sensor Connector down by the dipstick.
> http://members.cox.net/wilsond/Fixes...tml#CPSdetails
>
> > Tried to
> > clear the codes (removed battery cable for 2 hours) still same codes
> > Cam sensor wires do not look great in the dist, so i will be replacing

this
> > first, but why no up shift???

>
> In the event of a serious engine fault the ECU (engine computer) will

prevent
> the TCU (transmission computer) from getting out of first. This is to

help
> prevent extensive damage.
>
> > I need to get it to shift so i can take it to the shop and do the bottom
> > end, oil pump, bearings etc......

>
> Depending on what went wrong it may be as simple as a forgotten connection

or
> you may be looking at having to get the ZJ flatbedded into a shop.
>
> --
> -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.cox.net/wilsond
> HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
> Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
> Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
>
>



  #4  
Old January 25th 05, 02:50 PM
Mike Romain
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I have seen a 4.2 engine run when it was clocked 180 out. It sure
didn't have enough power to get out of 1st and it made 'bad' noises for
a new bottom end, but it ran.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

wrote:
>
> Thanks Doug
> I was by myself and i installed the distributor and it would not fall into
> the oil pump, so i bumped the engine without the hold down in place, the
> distributor jumped up instead of falling in so thats where the fun began,
> Has anyone pulled the oil pan on these with the engine still inframe?
>
> Thanks
> "DougW" > wrote in message
> news:hXhJd.7554$8Q.6341@okepread06...
> > jbbiggs67 did pass the time by typing:
> > > Pulled the distributor to replace bushings, lot of play in the

> shaft..... re
> > > installed the distibutor then it would not crank, I have learned alot

> about
> > > the indexing of a 4.0 distributor in the last few days.

> >
> > It would have been easier just to replace the distributor.
> >
http://members.cox.net/wilsond/distributor/
> > Unless you actually turned the engine you shouldn't have had to re-index

> the
> > distributor.
> >
> > > Now have it running
> > > go around the block, I have no upshift? revved the hell out of it now i

> have
> > > a nice deep knock in the engine, rod?

> >
> > ... You know this now, but over-revving an engine that isn't working is

> the
> > absolute wrong thing to do...
> >
> > The 4.0 is a zero interference design so you can't bend a valve or rod.
> >
> > > It shifted good before i removed the distributor. Came home cut it

> off....
> > > it would not re crank??? checked the codes 12, 24, 54, 34, 51, 55.

> >
> > 12 (battery disco, check your battery cables)
> > 24 Throttle position sensor input above or
> > below acceptable voltage. TPS signal does
> > not correlate to MAP sensor.
> > 54 No camshaft signal detected during engine cranking
> > 34 An open or shorted condition detected in the Speed
> > Control vacuum or vent solenoid circuits. Speed control
> > switch input below the minimum acceptable voltage
> > 51 A lean air/fuel mixture has been indicated by an
> > abnormally rich correction factor. (O2 sensor)
> > 55 (end of codes)
> >
> > What that's telling me is to check your battery terminals and make sure
> > they are tight an corrosion free. Also double check the harness. All

> those
> > codes won't set normally unless the power has been interrupted.
> > Also check the Camshaft Position Sensor connector to your distributor and
> > the Crankshaft Position Sensor Connector down by the dipstick.
> > http://members.cox.net/wilsond/Fixes...tml#CPSdetails
> >
> > > Tried to
> > > clear the codes (removed battery cable for 2 hours) still same codes
> > > Cam sensor wires do not look great in the dist, so i will be replacing

> this
> > > first, but why no up shift???

> >
> > In the event of a serious engine fault the ECU (engine computer) will

> prevent
> > the TCU (transmission computer) from getting out of first. This is to

> help
> > prevent extensive damage.
> >
> > > I need to get it to shift so i can take it to the shop and do the bottom
> > > end, oil pump, bearings etc......

> >
> > Depending on what went wrong it may be as simple as a forgotten connection

> or
> > you may be looking at having to get the ZJ flatbedded into a shop.
> >
> > --
> > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.cox.net/wilsond
> > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
> > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
> > Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
> >
> >

  #5  
Old January 25th 05, 11:52 PM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ok replaced the cam sensor and it fired right up. (took pictures this time
before i removed the distributor) codes went away except for the 24, I
looked at the connector for the TPS and it was wet, I am letting it dry out
for awhile and will try it again. If OBD checks out I will replace the
bearings this weekend and the oil pump.


"Mike Romain" > wrote in message
...
> I have seen a 4.2 engine run when it was clocked 180 out. It sure
> didn't have enough power to get out of 1st and it made 'bad' noises for
> a new bottom end, but it ran.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> wrote:
> >
> > Thanks Doug
> > I was by myself and i installed the distributor and it would not fall

into
> > the oil pump, so i bumped the engine without the hold down in place, the
> > distributor jumped up instead of falling in so thats where the fun

began,
> > Has anyone pulled the oil pan on these with the engine still inframe?
> >
> > Thanks
> > "DougW" > wrote in message
> > news:hXhJd.7554$8Q.6341@okepread06...
> > > jbbiggs67 did pass the time by typing:
> > > > Pulled the distributor to replace bushings, lot of play in the

> > shaft..... re
> > > > installed the distibutor then it would not crank, I have learned

alot
> > about
> > > > the indexing of a 4.0 distributor in the last few days.
> > >
> > > It would have been easier just to replace the distributor.
> > >
http://members.cox.net/wilsond/distributor/
> > > Unless you actually turned the engine you shouldn't have had to

re-index
> > the
> > > distributor.
> > >
> > > > Now have it running
> > > > go around the block, I have no upshift? revved the hell out of it

now i
> > have
> > > > a nice deep knock in the engine, rod?
> > >
> > > ... You know this now, but over-revving an engine that isn't working

is
> > the
> > > absolute wrong thing to do...
> > >
> > > The 4.0 is a zero interference design so you can't bend a valve or

rod.
> > >
> > > > It shifted good before i removed the distributor. Came home cut it

> > off....
> > > > it would not re crank??? checked the codes 12, 24, 54, 34, 51, 55.
> > >
> > > 12 (battery disco, check your battery cables)
> > > 24 Throttle position sensor input above or
> > > below acceptable voltage. TPS signal does
> > > not correlate to MAP sensor.
> > > 54 No camshaft signal detected during engine cranking
> > > 34 An open or shorted condition detected in the Speed
> > > Control vacuum or vent solenoid circuits. Speed control
> > > switch input below the minimum acceptable voltage
> > > 51 A lean air/fuel mixture has been indicated by an
> > > abnormally rich correction factor. (O2 sensor)
> > > 55 (end of codes)
> > >
> > > What that's telling me is to check your battery terminals and make

sure
> > > they are tight an corrosion free. Also double check the harness. All

> > those
> > > codes won't set normally unless the power has been interrupted.
> > > Also check the Camshaft Position Sensor connector to your distributor

and
> > > the Crankshaft Position Sensor Connector down by the dipstick.
> > > http://members.cox.net/wilsond/Fixes...tml#CPSdetails
> > >
> > > > Tried to
> > > > clear the codes (removed battery cable for 2 hours) still same codes
> > > > Cam sensor wires do not look great in the dist, so i will be

replacing
> > this
> > > > first, but why no up shift???
> > >
> > > In the event of a serious engine fault the ECU (engine computer) will

> > prevent
> > > the TCU (transmission computer) from getting out of first. This is to

> > help
> > > prevent extensive damage.
> > >
> > > > I need to get it to shift so i can take it to the shop and do the

bottom
> > > > end, oil pump, bearings etc......
> > >
> > > Depending on what went wrong it may be as simple as a forgotten

connection
> > or
> > > you may be looking at having to get the ZJ flatbedded into a shop.
> > >
> > > --
> > > -- DougW -- 93 ZJ 4.0 http://members.cox.net/wilsond
> > > HESCO Supercharger - 300W IASCA Stereo - Edelbrock IAS Shocks
> > > Gibson Exhaust - rear DCpower - custom gauge install - Stillen Rotors
> > > Banks Header - and BEER, in the fridge!
> > >
> > >



  #6  
Old January 26th 05, 12:14 AM
DougW
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

jbbiggs67 did pass the time by typing:
> Ok replaced the cam sensor and it fired right up. (took pictures this time
> before i removed the distributor) codes went away except for the 24, I
> looked at the connector for the TPS and it was wet, I am letting it dry out
> for awhile and will try it again. If OBD checks out I will replace the
> bearings this weekend and the oil pump.



Checking the TPS sensor is fairly easy if you have a volt meter.

with the key on, engine not running, backprobe the outer two pins
and you should see 5V, keep the neg side connected and backprobe
the center pin. Now slowly open and close the throttle plate.

The resistance should move smoothly with no jumps or drops and range
about 1 to 4 volts, mine measures .748 to 3.8.

If you get some drops, take a few seconds to quickly open and close the butterfly
then try again. Sometimes a crudspot develops and can be wiped off by exercising
the throttle plate.

--
DougW


 




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