A Cars forum. AutoBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AutoBanter forum » Auto makers » Saturn
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Punishing GM for killing electric car



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old July 18th 06, 09:48 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
Box134
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car

It sounds like you've been watching the PBS program Now. They had multiple
conspiracy theories, all based on junk science, or more like no science.
Right now it's technically infeasible to store enough energy in batteries to
make an electric car useful for the majority of people, so they won't buy
them. Maybe some day, but I doubt it. They've tried multiple chemistries for
batteries and there are only so many possibilities. Nothing beats liquid
fuels for energy density.

I'd love an electric car, but I want transportation, not a hobby.

"Bret Ludwig" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Wouldn't be that hard.
>
> The State of California could concoct some law whose real effect would
> be to punish GM for its perceived perfidy. When the Governator goes, it
> will become politically feasible.
>



Ads
  #22  
Old July 22nd 06, 11:15 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
Gary[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car

Really when you think about it, if GM abandoned the car, who would service
it? How many techs do they train, and where do they station them? How many
parts do they stock for repairs? Even if GM sold them at the end of the
trial, the buyers would be left with an electric Yugo.

"Bret Ludwig" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> Steve B. wrote:
>> On 16 Jul 2006 15:14:32 -0700, "Bret Ludwig" >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Electric cars do not have to be truly cost-effective for a modest but
>> >definite market to exist. Is a Ferrari cost-effective? My guess is
>> >there is a market for a $100,000 electric car in Hollywood and the
>> >Hamptons. Especially if there were a hybrid gen set module that could
>> >be swapped out for some battery storage.
>> >
>> > GM was being jerky and they should fear the legislature.

>>
>>
>> Big difference. A 100lk Ferrari doesn't cost the manufacturer
>> anywhere near 100k to produce and their whole company premise is to
>> sell very few and very expensive cars. The electrics cost GM 100k to
>> produce so they had no profit and GM is set up to sell a bunch of
>> moderately priced cars. If you think this market exist why aren't you
>> out raising capital and building it yourself?

>
> You are very very very naive. Each car cost much less than 100k to
> produce. The total R&D amortized out per vehicle may have been that,
> but since over 1000 vehicles were produced, that would put the program
> cost at $100,000,000. I seriously doubt GM spent that much.
>
> The fact is that GM was offered a huge sum for all of the
> already-produced cars at the end and showed their ass to this offer.
>
> Ferrari is owned by Fiat and in fact is subsidized as far as their car
> production goes. Where Ferrari makes a profit is their extremely high
> tech light nonferrous foundry program, but the cars lose money. My
> guess is Corvette is a net-net loser too. But they make it up on the
> logo program.
>



  #23  
Old July 23rd 06, 02:12 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
Bret Ludwig
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 140
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car


Gary wrote:
> Really when you think about it, if GM abandoned the car, who would service
> it? How many techs do they train, and where do they station them? How many
> parts do they stock for repairs? Even if GM sold them at the end of the
> trial, the buyers would be left with an electric Yugo.



The same people who service the converted electric cars and DIY
conversions available now. The buyers know these are a esoteric thing.
They wanted them anyway.

Quit sticking up for GM. They are a bully needing an asskicking.

  #24  
Old July 23rd 06, 05:06 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
Orval Fairbairn
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 70
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car

In article .com>,
"Bret Ludwig" > wrote:

> Gary wrote:
> > Really when you think about it, if GM abandoned the car, who would service
> > it? How many techs do they train, and where do they station them? How many
> > parts do they stock for repairs? Even if GM sold them at the end of the
> > trial, the buyers would be left with an electric Yugo.

>
>
> The same people who service the converted electric cars and DIY
> conversions available now. The buyers know these are a esoteric thing.
> They wanted them anyway.
>
> Quit sticking up for GM. They are a bully needing an asskicking.


And ... the eco-Nazis are even bigger bullies, who have cost the
American public untold billions of $$ with their incessant wild goose
chases and unwarranted requirements, such as:

oxygenates in the fuel
electric cars
mass transit
destruction of the American nuclear power industry
super-restrictive smog inspections, even on cars that were manufactured
pre-emission control
blocking of freeway improvements
  #25  
Old July 23rd 06, 02:56 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
SnoMan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 878
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car

On 18 Jul 2006 06:22:32 -0700, "Bret Ludwig" >
wrote:

> $1500 a car for health insurance? I would like to see them prove that.
>I think it's hooey.



That was well know and that was for 2005, I am not making this up. GM
has very liberale insurance benifits at basically no cost to employees
and it is starting to bleed them a lot. Below is a old link that took
10 seconds to find with a search engine (there are a a lot more) that
state GM's insurance costs in 2005. It will be higher in 2006. You
should read more before making some claims.


http://www.tcf.org/list.asp?type=NC&pubid=1113
-----------------
The SnoMan
www.thesnoman.com
  #26  
Old July 23rd 06, 03:38 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
mmo
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car

SnoMan wrote:
> On 18 Jul 2006 06:22:32 -0700, "Bret Ludwig" >
> wrote:
>
>> $1500 a car for health insurance? I would like to see them prove that.
>> I think it's hooey.

>
>
> That was well know and that was for 2005, I am not making this up. GM
> has very liberale insurance benifits at basically no cost to employees
> and it is starting to bleed them a lot. Below is a old link that took
> 10 seconds to find with a search engine (there are a a lot more) that
> state GM's insurance costs in 2005. It will be higher in 2006. You
> should read more before making some claims.
>
>
> http://www.tcf.org/list.asp?type=NC&pubid=1113
> -----------------
> The SnoMan
> www.thesnoman.com

Well if all you People that there company's don't pay there health
insurance would pay there own insurance in stead of going to the
hospital and getting there health care for free. Then the hospitals
wouldn't have to charge inflated rates to the people that have company
sponsored insurance to cover you slackers.
Hay I'm a UAW member and I do have to pay into my health insurance plan!!
Maybe the mass out there might want to start organizing and take back
some of the company's profits and CEO wages. No that not right I really
want to pay for my own insurance and while were at it just take me out
of the middle class and beat me with a stick..
  #27  
Old July 25th 06, 02:23 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
Bret Ludwig
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 140
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car


mmo wrote:
<<snip>>

> Well if all you People that there company's don't pay there health
> insurance would pay there own insurance in stead of going to the
> hospital and getting there health care for free. Then the hospitals
> wouldn't have to charge inflated rates to the people that have company
> sponsored insurance to cover you slackers.
> Hay I'm a UAW member and I do have to pay into my health insurance plan!!
> Maybe the mass out there might want to start organizing and take back
> some of the company's profits and CEO wages. No that not right I really
> want to pay for my own insurance and while were at it just take me out
> of the middle class and beat me with a stick..


Middle class people pay an insurance deductible and a copay and a big
deduction out of their check. UAW health benefits and those of
executives both need cutting back.

  #28  
Old July 25th 06, 08:33 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
SnoMan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 878
Default Punishing GM for killing electric car

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 15:48:56 -0500, "Box134" >
wrote:

>It sounds like you've been watching the PBS program Now. They had multiple
>conspiracy theories, all based on junk science, or more like no science.
>Right now it's technically infeasible to store enough energy in batteries to
>make an electric car useful for the majority of people, so they won't buy
>them. Maybe some day, but I doubt it. They've tried multiple chemistries for
>batteries and there are only so many possibilities. Nothing beats liquid
>fuels for energy density.
>
>I'd love an electric car, but I want transportation, not a hobby.
>
>"Bret Ludwig" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>> Wouldn't be that hard.
>>
>> The State of California could concoct some law whose real effect would
>> be to punish GM for its perceived perfidy. When the Governator goes, it
>> will become politically feasible.
>>

>



Check out the link below

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/07/25/pau...ary/index.html
-----------------
The SnoMan
www.thesnoman.com
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
GM crushed all of its electric cars ~ Pulling the plug on a dream [email protected] Driving 0 July 2nd 06 12:51 AM
AWA [OFFER] electric air pump for air bed/mat,inflatables [email protected] General 0 February 14th 06 12:52 PM
Electric problem ? Oppie Saturn 0 November 15th 05 07:54 PM
Electric motor assisted super- or turbocharger? Max Kallio Technology 13 May 9th 05 09:09 PM
Hybrid car cost of ownership Tom Del Rosso Technology 47 March 10th 05 01:32 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 AutoBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.