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Consumer Reports: Saturn



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 27th 05, 11:29 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

None of the Saturn cars for the 2006 New Car Preview edition of Consumer
Reports have been recommended.

Saturn: A different kind of company.

--
______________
=====fish=====


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  #2  
Old November 27th 05, 05:54 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

fish wrote:
> None of the Saturn cars for the 2006 New Car Preview edition of Consumer
> Reports have been recommended.
>
> Saturn: A different kind of company.
>


How is that any different from past years?
  #3  
Old November 27th 05, 07:33 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

Ratbert sez...

>> None of the Saturn cars for the 2006 New Car
>> Preview edition of Consumer Reports have been
>> recommended.


>> Saturn: A different kind of company.


> How is that any different from past years?


It is sad because as a Saturn owner, having a reliable car for over 9 years
is nice, so when I am ready for my next car, Consumer Reports does not
recommend any Saturn vehicle.

I will not miss the silly, "No Haggle Price Policy" because paying top price
does not put a smile on my face.

--
______________
=====fish=====


  #4  
Old November 27th 05, 07:52 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

LOL, this comes up so frequently on every Saturn BB that it should be a
mandatory FAQ sticky, lol. Let me clarify what CR does and doesnt do and
what the majority of the public doesnt recognize.

I collect annual CR magazines and have noticed this long ago as well as
currently, and this is why I will never trust CR for anythign more than a TV
or toaster, which IMHO is all they are qualified to review.

1.) Since CR has begun reviewing Saturns they have not updated nor
thoroughly tested newer model years. They just simply and lazily continue to
post the same verbatim information from the original article over and over.
If you look, you will read what year they last reviewed each Saturn product
and you will see that they have NOT actually tested the latest model year.
If you can find an original '02 thru '-05 CR Saturn review you will laugh at
how they have been only repeating verbatim the same tired old article year
after year. They may add in that they noticed a new facia, ect, but case in
point, CR's '05 VUE review on the 4cyl automatic was still noting a CVT
transmission! The '05 review on the Relay was a joke and was evidently clear
that they really didnt drive the vehicle for any length of time. The '06 ION
review neglects to mention the many major changes.

2.) This is one and the same magazine that has recently been sued by
Consumer Agencies for putting the Ford Focus as a top rated "safe" and
reliable vehicle! Hmm, unbiased and unpaid? Says who? them?

I alway refer ppl to more reliable resources (and yes, even these sources
may not put Saturn on the top of thier lists, but they actually DO test
drive them and dont rehash old articles year after year) such as: Motor
Trend and Consumer Guide.

marx404


  #5  
Old November 27th 05, 08:03 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

They note the date of the issue with the last review. If you want to read
the actual review of the tested car, visit the library and read it. No date
then they are just summarizing it for buyers of used cars.


"marx404" > wrote in message
...
> LOL, this comes up so frequently on every Saturn BB that it should be a
> mandatory FAQ sticky, lol. Let me clarify what CR does and doesnt do and
> what the majority of the public doesnt recognize.
>
> I collect annual CR magazines and have noticed this long ago as well as
> currently, and this is why I will never trust CR for anythign more than a
> TV
> or toaster, which IMHO is all they are qualified to review.
>
> 1.) Since CR has begun reviewing Saturns they have not updated nor
> thoroughly tested newer model years. They just simply and lazily continue
> to
> post the same verbatim information from the original article over and
> over.
> If you look, you will read what year they last reviewed each Saturn
> product
> and you will see that they have NOT actually tested the latest model year.
> If you can find an original '02 thru '-05 CR Saturn review you will laugh
> at
> how they have been only repeating verbatim the same tired old article year
> after year. They may add in that they noticed a new facia, ect, but case
> in
> point, CR's '05 VUE review on the 4cyl automatic was still noting a CVT
> transmission! The '05 review on the Relay was a joke and was evidently
> clear
> that they really didnt drive the vehicle for any length of time. The '06
> ION
> review neglects to mention the many major changes.
>
> 2.) This is one and the same magazine that has recently been sued by
> Consumer Agencies for putting the Ford Focus as a top rated "safe" and
> reliable vehicle! Hmm, unbiased and unpaid? Says who? them?
>
> I alway refer ppl to more reliable resources (and yes, even these sources
> may not put Saturn on the top of thier lists, but they actually DO test
> drive them and dont rehash old articles year after year) such as: Motor
> Trend and Consumer Guide.
>
> marx404
>
>



  #6  
Old November 27th 05, 09:06 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Posts: n/a
Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 16:54:34 GMT, Ratbert
> wrote:

>fish wrote:
>> None of the Saturn cars for the 2006 New Car Preview edition of Consumer
>> Reports have been recommended.
>>
>> Saturn: A different kind of company.
>>

>
>How is that any different from past years?



They used to recommend the SCs. As recently as 2003 they recommended
the Vue, but it no longer meets their requirement of at least average
reliability. They still recommend SCs and SLs as used cars in certain
price ranges.

  #7  
Old November 27th 05, 11:12 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Posts: n/a
Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 13:52:55 -0500, "marx404" > wrote:

>LOL, this comes up so frequently on every Saturn BB that it should be a
>mandatory FAQ sticky, lol. Let me clarify what CR does and doesnt do and
>what the majority of the public doesnt recognize.
>
>I collect annual CR magazines and have noticed this long ago as well as
>currently, and this is why I will never trust CR for anythign more than a TV
>or toaster, which IMHO is all they are qualified to review.
>
>1.) Since CR has begun reviewing Saturns they have not updated nor
>thoroughly tested newer model years. They just simply and lazily continue to
>post the same verbatim information from the original article over and over.
>If you look, you will read what year they last reviewed each Saturn product
>and you will see that they have NOT actually tested the latest model year.
>If you can find an original '02 thru '-05 CR Saturn review you will laugh at
>how they have been only repeating verbatim the same tired old article year
>after year. They may add in that they noticed a new facia, ect, but case in
>point, CR's '05 VUE review on the 4cyl automatic was still noting a CVT
>transmission! The '05 review on the Relay was a joke and was evidently clear
>that they really didnt drive the vehicle for any length of time. The '06 ION
>review neglects to mention the many major changes.


I think a lot of what you are saying is deceptive if not outright
wrong.

There has been no review of the '06 Ion, merely a ~40 word summary of
past testing - the same treatment all '06 models received in the 2006
Buying Guide.

The original test of the Ion was in March '03 This was obviously a
new review since the car had only been out a few months. The latest
review was in the May 2005 issue. This was a completely new test
including new performance statistics. While there are some items
common to both reports - not surprising since they cover the same car
two model years apart - most of the copy is completely different with
comparisons made to the new competition and some comments that
indicate previous complaints have been rectified.

Similarly, the Vue was last reported in the Oct. 04 issue. Again , it
is a full retest of the vehicle with different performance stats and
different copy form the original May '02 report. There was no report
on the 2005 model that I can find, but it is possible that the 2005
Buying Guide (mailed Oct. '04) lists a CVT as an option. This book
would have been already at the printer when GM announced
discontinuance of the CVT in September of that year.

>
>2.) This is one and the same magazine that has recently been sued by
>Consumer Agencies for putting the Ford Focus as a top rated "safe" and
>reliable vehicle! Hmm, unbiased and unpaid? Says who? them?


Citation? I have never heard of any consumer agency ever suing CR for
any reason. Nor am I aware of any safety issues regarding the Focus.

>I alway refer ppl to more reliable resources (and yes, even these sources
>may not put Saturn on the top of thier lists, but they actually DO test
>drive them and dont rehash old articles year after year) such as: Motor
>Trend and Consumer Guide.


Motor Trend and Consumer Guide take advertising and test vehicles from
manufacturers. In the case of Motor Trend and other car buff
magazines this is par for the course. In the case of an alleged
consumer advocate like Consumer Guide, it is a pathetic joke. Not
only do they take advertising, their reviews are available for
manufacturers to (selectively) quote.

Consumer Reports uses anonymous shoppers to buy the cars it tests. It
refuses all advertising and does not allow any commercial use of its
product test reports. Testing is very thorough and takes at least a
couple months including a 2000 mile break-in period. Another feature
you won't find anywhere else, each car gets a multi-point 5 mph bumper
bashing.

If you are interested in knowing which magazines are most committed to
thorough automotive testing, you might want to consider among Road &
Track, Car and Driver, Motor Trend, Consumer Reports and Consumer
Guide, which is the only one that owns its own fully equipped Test
Track? The track in question is located on 327 acres and includes a
3100 foot straightaway, off-road and on-road courses, a 120 foot long
rock hill, a complete garage and tire shop, snowmaking and grooming
equipment and a hydroplane test area.

http://tinyurl.com/au39h



  #8  
Old November 28th 05, 12:36 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Posts: n/a
Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

marx404 wrote:

> 1.) Since CR has begun reviewing Saturns they have not updated nor
> thoroughly tested newer model years.


This is untrue.

CR does test new models, when the model really changes. The problem with
Saturn and CR is that CR puts very high priority on reliability and
safety, two area where Saturn has done very poorly in most years.

I.e. look at the Ion rating:

"http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=526"

versus the Corolla rating:

"http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=305"

versus the Civic rating:

http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=300

And of course in long term dependability, Saturn has always been ranked
far below Toyota and Honda by J.D. Power.

So don't attack CR for not recommending Saturn, blame the safety issues
and the reliability issues.
  #9  
Old November 28th 05, 01:41 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

SMS sez...

> look at the Ion rating:
>
> "http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=526"
>
> versus the Corolla rating:
>
> "http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=305"
>
> versus the Civic rating:
>
> http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=300


Wow, what a difference!

I bought a Saturn 9 years ago for one thing, dependability.

Yes, it is dependable, but I want something new next year. It will be 10
years and I don't want to have to worry about any major repairs because I
kept it too long.

--
______________
=====fish=====


  #10  
Old November 28th 05, 01:10 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.saturn
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Default Consumer Reports: Saturn

wow, Im not trolling here guys, but fish, ya make me laugh, think about it.
You have had your trusty Saturn 9 yrs and you question its reliability?

What Im saying here guys, is not deceptive. CR is biased and thier articles
are based on testing older models than what is currently availiable, if not
based upon outdated information. Thier reccomendation of the Focus IMHO was
reprehensible and biased, the '05 reviews on Saturns were based on outdated
info. 6 months after the VUE had been redesigned, CR was still publishing
that it failed the rollover testing which was incorrect as that issue was
already fixed. I could go on but I'll spare you.

Just so you know, we always keep a number of current mags at our desk
including CR so ppl can actually read the articles. When they get to CR, we
always have alternate (and more updated) info onhand to correct thier faux
pas.

Now IMHO, the ecotec engine is far better than the old shaky 1.9. Yes, the
ION is not a cute as the old S series and everyone says so in every mag. I
cant wait for the '08 makeover myself. As far as reliability, recent year
IONs have had a few more issues (especially electric and battery related)
but none critical enough to deserve the awful rap that CR gives it.

As far as safety, I will stand by the personal stories my customers have
told me throughout the years how even in a bad accident, they have walked
out of an ION virtually unscathed. No magazine portrays that as well as
physically speaking to a Saturn owner who has gone thru that and returns for
another ION.

Im not saying that the ION is the nicest looking, it isnt, nor am I saying
it is the most trouble free, it isnt, but my proof has always been talking
to actual owners which I do every day.

marx404


 




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