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#1
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too late for synthetic?
My 2001 Civic LX manual transmission has almost 60k miles. I think the
original engine oil was special because the dealership refused to change it until I had about 7500 miles. Then I changed the oil every 5000-6000 miles, I figured my driving is between normal (10k) and severe (5k). Anyway, I read here about synthetic, and while I am going to search and find more information about synthetic oil (benefits, cost, oil change frequency, drawbacks), I though to ask you guys if it is too late for this engine to switch to synthetic. if synthetic was all that great, why does not Honda use synthetic right from the beginning? just curious. thanks |
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#2
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chibitul wrote:
> My 2001 Civic LX manual transmission has almost 60k miles. I think the > original engine oil was special because the dealership refused to > change it until I had about 7500 miles. Then I changed the oil every > 5000-6000 miles, I figured my driving is between normal (10k) and > severe (5k). > > Anyway, I read here about synthetic, and while I am going to search and > find more information about synthetic oil (benefits, cost, oil change > frequency, drawbacks), I though to ask you guys if it is too late for > this engine to switch to synthetic. > > if synthetic was all that great, why does not Honda use synthetic right > from the beginning? just curious. > > thanks > because it's really not necessary! go to a junk yard and look at all the hondas with 300k or more on the clock. those motors are usually not in bad shape, and they've been running ordinary cheapo oil. [genuine] synthetics /can/ be superior, but if the oil's base stock is of sufficient quality and the additive package is as good or even better than a synthetic, why do it? marketing can be a good thing because no one would ever use a new product if they didn't hear about it, but a successful marketing machine does not necessarily mean superior product. the word "microsoft" springs to mind. i've just looked at tegger's post with the "no sludge" article. i've seen motors like that without using synthetics. quality definitely matters, and all oils are not created equal, but anti-sludge is a function of additives, not base. |
#3
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"jim beam" > wrote
> [genuine] synthetics /can/ be superior, but if the oil's base stock is > of sufficient quality and the additive package is as good or even better > than a synthetic, why do it? Because of the convenience of having to do fewer (synthetic) oil changes. To the original poster: New car oil is IIRC break-in oil, so it's not the same as what you or the dealer would put in (be it synthetic or not) subsequently anyway. From my recollection of reading here and elsewhere, it's not at all too late to switch to synthetic for your 2001 Civic, 60k miles. Keep checking back. |
#4
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chibitul wrote:
> My 2001 Civic LX manual transmission has almost 60k miles. I think the > original engine oil was special because the dealership refused to > change it until I had about 7500 miles. Then I changed the oil every > 5000-6000 miles, I figured my driving is between normal (10k) and > severe (5k). > > Anyway, I read here about synthetic, and while I am going to search and > find more information about synthetic oil (benefits, cost, oil change > frequency, drawbacks), I though to ask you guys if it is too late for > this engine to switch to synthetic. > > if synthetic was all that great, why does not Honda use synthetic right > from the beginning? just curious. > > thanks > ------------------- At least one of your questions is answered here . . http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm I'm not sure if I agree with everything said, but it's starting to make sense to me. . . 'Curly' |
#5
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motsco_ _ wrote:
> chibitul wrote: > >> My 2001 Civic LX manual transmission has almost 60k miles. I think the >> original engine oil was special because the dealership refused to >> change it until I had about 7500 miles. Then I changed the oil every >> 5000-6000 miles, I figured my driving is between normal (10k) and >> severe (5k). >> >> Anyway, I read here about synthetic, and while I am going to search and >> find more information about synthetic oil (benefits, cost, oil change >> frequency, drawbacks), I though to ask you guys if it is too late for >> this engine to switch to synthetic. >> >> if synthetic was all that great, why does not Honda use synthetic right >> from the beginning? just curious. >> >> thanks >> > ------------------- > > At least one of your questions is answered here . . > > http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm > > I'm not sure if I agree with everything said, but it's starting to make > sense to me. . . > > 'Curly' > that article is amazing. i've seen engines run hard from new, and they can turn to crap in a few thousand miles, blue smoke, no compression... i just love it when some kid comes up with a "solution" to a problem that's occupied the best & brightest for over a hundred years, and had millions of dollars dumped into research. just amazing. there was a great one in the news recently about some kid that had a "solution" for creating hydrogen for the upcoming "hydrogen economy" - he was out there touting for funding, you know the routine. his "solution"? sodium! water is the most abundant source of hydrogen, so if you can liberate hydrogen from water, you have a plentiful supply of hydrogen, right? now, as any junior chemist knows, sodium liberates hydrogen when reacted with water, so, that was the premise of this kid's "solution". trouble is, obtaining the sodium is way more energy intensive than something like direct electroytic reduction of water, so apart from the fact that you have, er, an "environmental situation" with all the sodium hydroxide you've created, you're wasting energy on an entirely superfluous fabrication route. it's just hilarious that people come up with this stuff without the slightest shame. but hey, the beauty of the internet is no barriers to entry. and the beastliness of the internet is, you guessed it, no barriers to entry. |
#6
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Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> In article >, > "motsco_ _" <"motsco_ > wrote: > > >>At least one of your questions is answered here . . >> >>http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm >> >>I'm not sure if I agree with everything said, but it's starting to make >>sense to me. . . > > > I like the guy's short answer: "The Short Answer: Run it Hard !" > > According to the Corvette engineers, he's 100% correct. > maybe that's why g.m. are in such trouble? the break-in achieves two things: 1. the cylinder walls have to glaze. 2. the journal bearings have to seat properly. running hard from new prevents both. if no glaze forms, oil consumption remains high as sealing is less complete and the wear rate remains high because the glaze is harder than the metal substrate [irrelevant for racing engines, but not for consumer road vehicles]. if journal bearings are run hard before they've seated themselves, you can have patches where there is little or no hydrodynamic film and metal on metal. as the journals are such soft metal, they can quickly get ripped and suddenly, you have a rebuild & regrind on your hands. there /is/ validity in not running /too/ slow as that can create excessive carbon buildup, and the journals seat fairly quickly with the high-precison build we generaly have today, but confusing the potential for a quicker break-in with the ability to run hard from new is somewhat misplaced. |
#7
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chibitul wrote:
> if synthetic was all that great, why does not Honda use synthetic right > from the beginning? just curious. cost. and its not necessary. i use it myself, but only because i dont drive a lot and like to do the 7500mile interval... which ends up being every 2 years. |
#8
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In article >,
SoCalMike > wrote: > > if synthetic was all that great, why does not Honda use synthetic right > > from the beginning? just curious. > > cost. and its not necessary. i use it myself, but only because i dont > drive a lot and like to do the 7500mile interval... which ends up being > every 2 years. In the meantime, your synthetic oil is full of water due to short trips and never getting up to temperature for any time--which means you should have shorter change intervals. |
#9
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>
> At least one of your questions is answered here . . > > http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm > > I'm not sure if I agree with everything said, but it's starting to make > sense to me. . . > Perhaps it might work for a sport bike, but I wouldn't try the same break-in technique on my brand new car. I've broken in 5 new engines and put over 100,000km on each of them (or more) and in every case, the engines were the best part of the cars, when it was time to retire them. So, i'm keeping with the same technique which has worked for me. Under 1000km or so. 1. Avoid long drives, short city trips is preferable with frequent cool downs. 2. Keep the accelerator and RPM under 70% and try to babe the engine. After 1000km. 1. Time to investigate the higher rpms... in increments... 2. Don't hesitate to redline the car (especially if it's a high revving engine) but try to avoid full throttle redline and don't let it linger there. After 2000km or so 1. Anything goes. 2. Try to get about 10 minutes or regular driving before going hard on the engine 3. If your driving habit is very aggressive (like mine) and getting the maximum of performance out of the engine is a priority (assuming you plan on having the engine for more then 5 years), then use the good oil. Pars |
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