Downshifting

On 2006-11-08, tooloud > wrote:

> No, RAMMM isn't anything close to a "general-purpose Mazda"
> newsgroup; that's what rec.autos.makers.mazda is for.

Except there is no such group.

> Read up on the differences between the rec.* and alt.*
> hierarchies and that might all make a little more sense.


--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! I know how to get the
at hostesses released! Give
visi.com them their own television
series!

In article >,
XS11E > wrote:

> Don Bruder > wrote in
> :
>
> > Tell ya what - Show me a server on the planet that carries any
> > such group as "rec.autos.makers.mazda" as anything but a name on
> > the path into RAMMM, and I'll cheerfully use that group instead of
> > this one.
>
> My server carries it.
>
> It's not as active as this group but it's certainly more than just a
> name.

Not intending to be argumentative, but it IS just a name. the reason
it's "not as active" is beacuse it's not possible to post, or even
subscribe, to it except on a handful of servers that are either broken,
or carrying *EVERYTHING* so they can boast a high newsgroup count.
(Those in the second category are the only place one can still find the
mass of (dead) groups which, when assembled in the proper order, make a
banner that reads "jerry garcia" in the grouplist window)

The "technically correct" (in terms of the mechanics of usenet) name for
RAMMM is actually "rec.autos.makers.mazda-miata" - note the dash, rather
than period. But due to a well-intended but poorly implemented idea that
got put into action a few years back, a large number of "subgroups
without a heirarchy" got created. RAMM (no third M) is one of them.
RAMMM got a period instead of a dash, and RAMM ended up being an
"orphan" group that's nothing more than a placeholder.

> So, enjoy rec.autos.makers.mazda, maybe you can perk up the
> group a bit?

Assuming it was a functional group, I would. Since it's not, this is the
closest there is.

--
Don Bruder - - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd> for more info

In article >,
pws > wrote:

> Don Bruder wrote:
>
> >> Hey, I'm just here to point out some of us are enjoying the Miata's,
> >> er...MX-5's progression into the future. I *love* the power hardtop option
> >> and I'm glad to see that the Miata is getting some options that I've
> >> enjoyed
> >> on other cars for years now. I guess I sometimes think that people are
> >> complaining about the direction the car is going and I'm here to stick in
> >> my
> >> 2?.
> >>
> >> That said, I'm a little dismayed (annoyed?) to find that I have to point
> >> things like that out to my man Bruder, a pizza delivery guy that pilots a
> >> beater car that's not even a Miata, simply because he's not here for the
> >> same reasons as most of the rest of us.
> >
> > Tell ya what - Show me a server on the planet that carries any such
> > group as "rec.autos.makers.mazda" as anything but a name on the path
> > into RAMMM, and I'll cheerfully use that group instead of this one.
> > Until then, I'm here as the closest available alternative. I've gotten
> > good information here that applies to my 626 just as well as it would to
> > a Miata, and when I know that my 626 information applies to the Miata I
> > gladly pass it along.
> >
> > Here's my attempt to bury the hatchet: You wanna be an ass 'cause your
> > car says Miata and mine says 626, that's your choice. But I'd much
> > rather we try to remember that they're all Mazdas, they share a
> > surprising amount of details between them, and be civil to each other.
> > Keep up the obvious attempts to pick a fight with me, and I simply flush
> > you down the killfile drain like the rest of the usenet clowns that
> > can't behave like reasonably decent human beings.
> >
> > Your option. It's no hair off my ass either way.
>
>
> Ah crap. I don't know either one of you personally, but I like both of you.
> This feels sort of like high school when two of your friends start
> fighting....I am bowing out.
>
> Pat

No fight Pat - It takes two for that. If he wants to continue, he can -
more power to him. But rest assured that his next "badmouth Don/Don's
car/Don's choice of newsgroups etc" post will land him in my killfile,
and that will be the end of the "war". If he wants to talk Mazdas,
whether Miatas/MX-5s, 626s, or even the rather spiffy-looking new CR-7,
great - I'm all for it. But I'm not going to put up with him trying to
turn things into "Don doesn't drive a Miata so he doesn't belong here".
That ain't what I'm here for. I'm here for the "zoom zoom", regardless
of whether it comes in the form of a 626, an RX-7, or a Miata.

And that closes the subject, as far as I'm concerned.

--
Don Bruder - - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd> for more info

Don Bruder wrote:

> No fight Pat - It takes two for that. If he wants to continue, he can -
> more power to him. But rest assured that his next "badmouth Don/Don's
> car/Don's choice of newsgroups etc" post will land him in my killfile,
> and that will be the end of the "war". If he wants to talk Mazdas,
> whether Miatas/MX-5s, 626s, or even the rather spiffy-looking new CR-7,
> great - I'm all for it. But I'm not going to put up with him trying to
> turn things into "Don doesn't drive a Miata so he doesn't belong here".
> That ain't what I'm here for. I'm here for the "zoom zoom", regardless
> of whether it comes in the form of a 626, an RX-7, or a Miata.
>
> And that closes the subject, as far as I'm concerned.


I think that we are still on the same page. The post did sound a bit
elitist to me. I can see where it would not sit well. You are certainly
welcome here no matter what car you drive. Owning a miata is not a
requirement for posting on this group.

"A pizza delivery guy", "piloting a beater car that is not even a miata"
did not come across well, that is for certain.

What is sad is that we are judged so much on what we do for a living and
what it pays, what kind of car we drive and what clothes are wearing.

There are far more important things like who you really are and how you
treat other people, especially in real life interactions and not from
behind a keyboard and monitor.

When I spoke of hypocrisy, I was talking about myself. It is one of the
most important things to me that I try to resist it, so I try to point
out that I am not calling the pot black anytime I complain about
something if I do it as well.
If I want to complain about drunk drivers, I am on very solid ground. If
I wanted to complain about people who argued and used personal attacks,
I would be a hypocrite, because I have done that myself recently.

Pat

Don Bruder > wrote in
:

> In article >,
> XS11E > wrote:
>
>> Don Bruder > wrote in
>> :
>>
>> > Tell ya what - Show me a server on the planet that carries any
>> > such group as "rec.autos.makers.mazda" as anything but a name
>> > on the path into RAMMM, and I'll cheerfully use that group
>> > instead of this one.
>>
>> My server carries it.
>>
>> It's not as active as this group but it's certainly more than
>> just a name.
>
> Not intending to be argumentative, but it IS just a name. the
> reason it's "not as active" is beacuse it's not possible to post,
> or even subscribe, to it except on a handful of servers that are
> either broken, or carrying *EVERYTHING* so they can boast a high
> newsgroup count.

Hogwash. I can read it and post to it, I did yesterday.

>> So, enjoy rec.autos.makers.mazda, maybe you can perk up the
>> group a bit?
>
> Assuming it was a functional group, I would. Since it's not, this
> is the closest there is.

Again, it IS a functional group, I've no idea why you can't see it?

pws wrote:
> Don Bruder wrote:
>
>> No fight Pat - It takes two for that. If he wants to continue, he
>> can - more power to him. But rest assured that his next "badmouth
>> Don/Don's car/Don's choice of newsgroups etc" post will land him in
>> my killfile, and that will be the end of the "war". If he wants to
>> talk Mazdas, whether Miatas/MX-5s, 626s, or even the rather
>> spiffy-looking new CR-7, great - I'm all for it. But I'm not going
>> to put up with him trying to turn things into "Don doesn't drive a
>> Miata so he doesn't belong here". That ain't what I'm here for. I'm
>> here for the "zoom zoom", regardless of whether it comes in the form
>> of a 626, an RX-7, or a Miata. And that closes the subject, as far as I'm
>> concerned.
>
>
> I think that we are still on the same page. The post did sound a bit
> elitist to me. I can see where it would not sit well. You are
> certainly welcome here no matter what car you drive. Owning a miata
> is not a requirement for posting on this group.

No, but a desire to discuss Miata-specific things is a requirement. Imagine
the signal-to-noise ratio if everyone decided that RAMMM was just another
Mazda forum.

> "A pizza delivery guy", "piloting a beater car that is not even a
> miata" did not come across well, that is for certain.

Eh, I don't usually mince words, but do have to admit that I struggle to see
what part I was wrong about.

> What is sad is that we are judged so much on what we do for a living
> and what it pays, what kind of car we drive and what clothes are
> wearing.

The only thing he's being judged on his is choice of newsgroups; if Don
drove a Ferrari Enzo and argued with me in a Miata forum, I'd feel the same
way as I do now. The rec.* and alt.* hierarchies were established in a
specific manner to avoid things like this, and many newsgroups are moderated
for the same reasons. The short explanation is that rec.* groups are much
more difficult to start than the alt.* groups in an effort to keep the
"noise" in the proper place, and as such, the rec.* groups tend to be much
more useful. I'm just trying to keep it that way.

--
tooloud
Remove nothing to reply

Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2006-11-08, tooloud > wrote:
>
>> No, RAMMM isn't anything close to a "general-purpose Mazda"
>> newsgroup; that's what rec.autos.makers.mazda is for.
>
> Except there is no such group.

Maybe not on *your* server, but it's clearly on mine, and Google finds it
pretty easily, too.

<snip>

--
tooloud
Remove nothing to reply

On 2006-11-09, tooloud > wrote:
> Grant Edwards wrote:
>> On 2006-11-08, tooloud > wrote:
>>
>>> No, RAMMM isn't anything close to a "general-purpose Mazda"
>>> newsgroup; that's what rec.autos.makers.mazda is for.
>>
>> Except there is no such group.
>
> Maybe not on *your* server,

Not on any properly configured server.

> but it's clearly on mine, and Google finds it pretty easily,
> too.

There's nothing in that group at Google except spam. That's
because it's a bogus group and if you _do_ manage to find a
broken server that shows it as a group, posts won't propogate
to Usenet in general. So, the only way postings show up in
that group on Google is when they're posted _on_Google_ --
usually by spam-bots.

--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! I'm thinking about
at DIGITAL READ-OUT systems
visi.com and computer-generated
IMAGE FORMATIONS...

Grant Edwards > wrote in
:

> On 2006-11-09, tooloud > wrote:
>> Grant Edwards wrote:
>>> On 2006-11-08, tooloud > wrote:
>>>
>>>> No, RAMMM isn't anything close to a "general-purpose Mazda"
>>>> newsgroup; that's what rec.autos.makers.mazda is for.
>>>
>>> Except there is no such group.
>>
>> Maybe not on *your* server,
>
> Not on any properly configured server.
>
>> but it's clearly on mine, and Google finds it pretty easily, too.
>
> There's nothing in that group at Google except spam. That's
> because it's a bogus group and if you _do_ manage to find a
> broken server that shows it as a group, posts won't propogate
> to Usenet in general. So, the only way postings show up in
> that group on Google is when they're posted _on_Google_ --
> usually by spam-bots.

It's not a bogus group. It shows on my server, there is no spam in it
and my post of a couple of days ago shows up.

It apparently is not currently archived on Google, Google shows very
old posts and none of the newer posts.

On 2006-11-09, XS11E > wrote:

>>>>> No, RAMMM isn't anything close to a "general-purpose Mazda"
>>>>> newsgroup; that's what rec.autos.makers.mazda is for.
>>>>
>>>> Except there is no such group.
>>>
>>> Maybe not on *your* server,
>>
>> Not on any properly configured server.
>>
>>> but it's clearly on mine, and Google finds it pretty easily, too.
>>
>> There's nothing in that group at Google except spam. That's
>> because it's a bogus group and if you _do_ manage to find a
>> broken server that shows it as a group, posts won't propogate
>> to Usenet in general. So, the only way postings show up in
>> that group on Google is when they're posted _on_Google_ --
>> usually by spam-bots.
>
> It's not a bogus group. It shows on my server, there is no
> spam in it and my post of a couple of days ago shows up.

Just because your sever is mis-configured, that doesn't make it
a valid group. I could set up a news server that has any group
I want. That doesn't mean it's going to be carried or
propogated by any other server.

> It apparently is not currently archived on Google,

Gee, I wonder why?

Oh yea, I already explained why.

> Google shows very old posts and none of the newer posts.

Because it's not a valid group.

--
Grant Edwards grante Yow! Now I'm concentrating
at on a specific tank battle
visi.com toward the end of World
War II!