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A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car alittle sick?



 
 
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  #11  
Old December 29th 07, 09:43 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
XS11E[_3_]
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Posts: 793
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

Bruno > wrote:

> XS11E wrote:
>>
>> I don't know if it's important. I was thinking if it started
>> right up after running awhile but took a long time after sitting
>> overnight a leaky valve in the fuel pump might be allowing fuel
>> to drain back into the tank so there wouldn't be enough pressure
>> in the fuel rail for an instant start but that seems unlikely if
>> it's not a big difference.
>>

> Hmm, it sounds like a possible theory. If one imagines there is
> only so far the fuel can drain back it could very well be that
> certain level of delay is reached after like a day or so and that
> the level won't change much more regardless of time. This is total
> speculation on my part as I really know to little about these
> things.


The pressure in the fuel rail is around 35 - 40psi for most cars, if
the pressure drops too far the car can't start until the pressure comes
back up which is why I was asking about the time involved. *IF* one of
the check valves in the pump isn't seating properly the bleedback could
be very slow...

>> Looking at real obvious stuff.... how old are the spark plugs and
>> plug wires?
>>

>
> Plugs was changed at the big service this summer but that did not
> change anything. The plug wires could be the original 1999 ones or
> they could be little more than a year old - I must admit to buying
> a car without a service history so many things are pure guess
> work.


Stick on new wires, you MAY see an inprovement if they're old or at the
very least you'll have a starting date for future changes.

You can test the wiring if you can find a very dark night or very dark
place to park, just start the car, raise the hood and watch around the
plug wires for pretty blue sparkles, if you see any the wires are bad.


--
XS11E, Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project:
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  #12  
Old January 1st 08, 07:59 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chuck
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Posts: 249
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

It may help to turn the key to on for a few moments before you turn it to
the start position. Turning to the start position without pressing on the
clutch (assuming the clutch start lockout switch is still functional) may
also make a difference.

"Chris D'Agnolo" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mal Osborne" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> Probably not a bad thing. Gives the oil pump time to prime before any
>> significant load is placed on bearing surfaces.
>>
>>
>> "Chuck" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On my 99 which does the same thing, I believe that it's related to the
>>> cam
>>> and or crankshaft sensors.
>>> It seems to take a bit for the ECU to sort out the sensor signals.
>>>

> These may both be correct but as Bruno mentioned; it's a bit worrisome
> when the thing sounds like it might not start occasionally. Sometimes I
> end up letting off the key and giving it a second go. It's never failed on
> the second try to fire right up but I still get that sinking feeling that
> this might be the first time.
>
> Chris
> 99BBB
>


  #13  
Old January 1st 08, 02:13 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Bruno
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Posts: 75
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my cara little sick?

Chuck wrote:
> It may help to turn the key to on for a few moments before you turn it to
> the start position. Turning to the start position without pressing on the
> clutch (assuming the clutch start lockout switch is still functional) may
> also make a difference.
>

Worth trying for sure. I shall report back if it makes a difference.

Kind regards
Bruno
  #14  
Old January 3rd 08, 07:46 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chuck
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 249
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

Some of the 99's had a problem with the pressure relief valve/regulator in
the tank leaking down. Unfortunately, the factory leakdown test only
detected gross leak down problems, not ones that might occur over more than
24hours. In any event, a revised replacement valve was made, and should be
what you will get if you order a new one. I still think the no return line
system used on the 99 and later NB's is a mistake.
Replacing the valve requires normal hand tools, an open well vented area
away from any source of ignition, and reasonably high humidity.
The top must be up, and the rear deck rug and access plate removed. The
whole fuel pump/tank sensor/regulator assembly comes out from the top of the
tank as a unit. Some of the roll bars may be in the way.

The easiest way to measure fuel pressure on a 99 is to order the short hose
assembly with quick release fittings that is used on the passenger side of
the engine down by the frame. You cut the hose and insert a tee and a FP
gauge. Since some of the hoses were plastic, you may need to substitute
rubber hose and clamps if you are using the hose that came on the car. You
are really buying the hose assembly to get the quick disconnect fittings.
The fittings by themselves may be available now-- they were not when I last
got into this area in about 2002.

"Bruno" > wrote in message
k...
> XS11E wrote:
> >
> > I don't know if it's important. I was thinking if it started right up
> > after running awhile but took a long time after sitting overnight a
> > leaky valve in the fuel pump might be allowing fuel to drain back into
> > the tank so there wouldn't be enough pressure in the fuel rail for an
> > instant start but that seems unlikely if it's not a big difference.
> >

> Hmm, it sounds like a possible theory. If one imagines there is only so
> far the fuel can drain back it could very well be that certain level of
> delay is reached after like a day or so and that the level won't change
> much more regardless of time. This is total speculation on my part as I
> really know to little about these things.
>
>
> > Looking at real obvious stuff.... how old are the spark plugs and plug
> > wires?
> >

>
> Plugs was changed at the big service this summer but that did not change
> anything. The plug wires could be the original 1999 ones or they could
> be little more than a year old - I must admit to buying a car without a
> service history so many things are pure guess work.
>
> Kind regards
> Bruno



  #15  
Old January 3rd 08, 11:21 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Bruno
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 75
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my cara little sick?

Chuck wrote:
> Some of the 99's had a problem with the pressure relief valve/regulator in
> the tank leaking down. Unfortunately, the factory leakdown test only
> detected gross leak down problems, not ones that might occur over more than
> 24hours. In any event, a revised replacement valve was made, and should be
> what you will get if you order a new one. I still think the no return line
> system used on the 99 and later NB's is a mistake.
> Replacing the valve requires normal hand tools, an open well vented area
> away from any source of ignition, and reasonably high humidity.
> The top must be up, and the rear deck rug and access plate removed. The
> whole fuel pump/tank sensor/regulator assembly comes out from the top of the
> tank as a unit. Some of the roll bars may be in the way.
>
> The easiest way to measure fuel pressure on a 99 is to order the short hose
> assembly with quick release fittings that is used on the passenger side of
> the engine down by the frame. You cut the hose and insert a tee and a FP
> gauge. Since some of the hoses were plastic, you may need to substitute
> rubber hose and clamps if you are using the hose that came on the car. You
> are really buying the hose assembly to get the quick disconnect fittings.
> The fittings by themselves may be available now-- they were not when I last
> got into this area in about 2002.
>

Great info + thank you for the effort.

Seems like something I might give a go once we get more humane
tempratures (like above freezing).

Kind regards
Bruno
  #16  
Old January 3rd 08, 11:22 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Bruno
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 75
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my cara little sick?

Bruno wrote:
>>

> Worth trying for sure. I shall report back if it makes a difference.
>

No difference I can notice. To bad.

Kind regards
Bruno
  #17  
Old January 5th 08, 05:52 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Joaquín Topiso
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Posts: 11
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

Bruno wrote:
> I find that when starting my 1999 NB 1.8 it takes about a second
> before the engine fires up. Or to put in different words it takes
> just slightly long enough for me to notice and think "Huh!".
>
> This seems to be regardless of ambient temperatures and only if the
> car has been out running within the hour or so it fires up straight
> away.
>
> Any thoughts?
>


Have a read to this:
http://www.miata.net/garage/tsb/sb003_99.html



  #18  
Old January 8th 08, 02:28 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chris D'Agnolo
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Posts: 733
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

Joaquin, Thanks for the info. I hadn't seen that. What do you think Bruno?
Do you have the ability to check this yourself or are you willing to pay
somebody to check it out?

Keep us posted,
Chris
99BBB

"Joaquín Topiso" > wrote in message
reenews.net...
> Bruno wrote:
>> I find that when starting my 1999 NB 1.8 it takes about a second
>> before the engine fires up. Or to put in different words it takes
>> just slightly long enough for me to notice and think "Huh!".
>>
>> This seems to be regardless of ambient temperatures and only if the
>> car has been out running within the hour or so it fires up straight
>> away.
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>>

>
> Have a read to this:
> http://www.miata.net/garage/tsb/sb003_99.html
>
>
>



  #19  
Old January 9th 08, 05:33 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Bruno
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 75
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my cara little sick?

Chris D'Agnolo wrote:
> Joaquin, Thanks for the info. I hadn't seen that. What do you think Bruno?


My VIN is higher than the number list or to be more precise some letters
are later in the alphabet while the digits are below, so I assume my
number is higher.


> Do you have the ability to check this yourself or are you willing to pay
> somebody to check it out?
>


I think it's manageable to do the work but it might just be easier to
replace the pressure regulator than doing the whole procedure. Depends
on what the parts cost of course :-)

Anyway it will not be until at least spring before I'll do any work on
the car that requires getting near fuel lines as I'd much prefer to do
it outside.

Alternatively it may be something I speak with our MX-5 specialist
about. There is this one garage located at a farm half a country away
(which is not to bad - this is a small country when not counting
Greenland) where I had my big service done and they know their stuff.

Kind regards
Bruno
  #20  
Old January 10th 08, 12:12 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Chuck
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 249
Default A little long before firing up - family trademark or is my car a little sick?

Out of just plain curiosity, have you ever replaced the fuel filter? They
seem to accumulate a very large amount of crud in a short period of time.
Enough crud may slow down the pressure buildup, and make the starting time
just a bit longer.

"Bruno" > wrote in message
k...
> Chris D'Agnolo wrote:
> > Joaquin, Thanks for the info. I hadn't seen that. What do you think

Bruno?
>
> My VIN is higher than the number list or to be more precise some letters
> are later in the alphabet while the digits are below, so I assume my
> number is higher.
>
>
> > Do you have the ability to check this yourself or are you willing to pay
> > somebody to check it out?
> >

>
> I think it's manageable to do the work but it might just be easier to
> replace the pressure regulator than doing the whole procedure. Depends
> on what the parts cost of course :-)
>
> Anyway it will not be until at least spring before I'll do any work on
> the car that requires getting near fuel lines as I'd much prefer to do
> it outside.
>
> Alternatively it may be something I speak with our MX-5 specialist
> about. There is this one garage located at a farm half a country away
> (which is not to bad - this is a small country when not counting
> Greenland) where I had my big service done and they know their stuff.
>
> Kind regards
> Bruno



 




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