Gasoline "additives": kerosene in gasoline?

Awl --

I recently became aware that fuel injector cleaner is basically
kerosene..... !! It's also clear that alcohol is freely mixible in
gasoline.
In fact, http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monogr...5/mono45-8.pdf
indicates a wide variety of stuff in gasoline, including aromatics (like
benzene). The tables don't seem entirely consistent, but the point is, gas
is a bit of a heterogeneous mix.

So the Q is: what can one "dump" into one's gastank, and how much, without
gumming up the works? Including all these catalytic converters. Mebbe it's
better to dump stuff in, say, the lawnmower??

And what do I mean by "stuff"?
Unknown mixes of 2-stroke gas, kerosene, paint thinner, small amounts of old
oil, any combustible really.
You can put quite a bit of fuel injector cleaner (kerosene) in a gasoline
car, on the order of a pint to just a few gallons of gas, and the car runs
fine.
But I'm not talking about a deluge of stuff, just a cup here, a cup there in
a full-ish tank?
--
EA

Existential Angst > wrote:
>
>I recently became aware that fuel injector cleaner is basically
>kerosene..... !! It's also clear that alcohol is freely mixible in
>gasoline.

Depends on the cleaner. Some of them have other solvents like xylene,
and some of them have detergents. The Lucas stuff appears to be almost
entirely surfactants with some kerosene to keep them flowing, and it seems
to work well.

>In fact, http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monogr...5/mono45-8.pdf
>indicates a wide variety of stuff in gasoline, including aromatics (like
>benzene). The tables don't seem entirely consistent, but the point is, gas
>is a bit of a heterogeneous mix.

Precisely.

>So the Q is: what can one "dump" into one's gastank, and how much, without
>gumming up the works? Including all these catalytic converters. Mebbe it's
>better to dump stuff in, say, the lawnmower??

It depends how much stuff it is. If anything, one of the advantages of modern
cars over the lawnmower is that cars have feedback control of mixture today.
You won't burn your valves running too lean, the way you might with a small
engine with a carb.

>And what do I mean by "stuff"?
>Unknown mixes of 2-stroke gas, kerosene, paint thinner, small amounts of old
>oil, any combustible really.
>You can put quite a bit of fuel injector cleaner (kerosene) in a gasoline
>car, on the order of a pint to just a few gallons of gas, and the car runs
>fine.
>But I'm not talking about a deluge of stuff, just a cup here, a cup there in
>a full-ish tank?

In Mexico, I ran my BMW E28 on Pemex Verde when there wasn't anything else
available and it ran the thing as rich as it could and retarded the timing
like mad but it didn't seem to do any permanent damage.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 11/5/2012 1:52 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
> Awl --
....

> So the Q is: what can one "dump" into one's gastank, and how much, without
> gumming up the works? Including all these catalytic converters. Mebbe it's
> better to dump stuff in, say, the lawnmower??
>
> And what do I mean by "stuff"?
> Unknown mixes of 2-stroke gas, kerosene, paint thinner, small amounts of old
> oil, any combustible really.
....

Biggest problems w/ modern vehicles (injected w/ catalytic converters
and OBD computers, basically) that I can see otomh are

a) contaminated/used oil w/ particulates to plug inline filters and
perhaps injectors and

b) impurities that are harmful to the catalytic material (Pt) in the
converter. Pb is the probably the most but it's very unlikely to find
leaded gas any longer (but perhaps some of the non-fuel items or for old
2-cycle I don't know?). Other specific metals I know of that aren't
good include Zn, Mn, Ph which exist or existed in at least some engine
cleaners before. Of course, Si is another which is why it is bad
when/if lose a head gasket on converter as well as the other nasties
that does because it is common in antifreezes...

All in all, I'd tend to find something else to do with most of it,
myself even though in small enough amounts and infrequently enough it's
not likely to do serious damage I figure why take a chance on a sizable
investment for the cost of a little aggravation? (Of course, it's a lot
easier to get rid of stuff on 2000 A and large gravel driveways than on
a city lot w/ everything paved over or lawn... )

--

Existential Angst wrote:
> Awl --
>
> I recently became aware that fuel injector cleaner is basically
> kerosene..... !! It's also clear that alcohol is freely mixible in
> gasoline.
> In fact, http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monogr...5/mono45-8.pdf
> indicates a wide variety of stuff in gasoline, including aromatics
> (like benzene). The tables don't seem entirely consistent, but the
> point is, gas is a bit of a heterogeneous mix.
>
> So the Q is: what can one "dump" into one's gastank, and how much,
> without gumming up the works? Including all these catalytic
> converters. Mebbe it's better to dump stuff in, say, the lawnmower??
>
> And what do I mean by "stuff"?
> Unknown mixes of 2-stroke gas, kerosene, paint thinner, small amounts
> of old oil, any combustible really.
> You can put quite a bit of fuel injector cleaner (kerosene) in a
> gasoline car, on the order of a pint to just a few gallons of gas,
> and the car runs fine.
> But I'm not talking about a deluge of stuff, just a cup here, a cup
> there in a full-ish tank?

Why would you want to do so?

To dispose of left-over petroleum products, you could just dump 'em down the
storm sewer. They will lubricate the walls and help prevent flooding.

On 11/5/2012 5:26 PM, HeyBub wrote:
....

> To dispose of left-over petroleum products, you could just dump 'em down the
> storm sewer. They will lubricate the walls and help prevent flooding.

That's about as bad as dumping them down the sanitary sewer (and the two
join in some locations)...

Better than that would be to simply dump in a corner of the yard
somewhere than putting them directly into the water system, small
amounts though they be...

--

HeyBub wrote:

>To dispose of left-over petroleum products, you could just dump 'em down the
>storm sewer. They will lubricate the walls and help prevent flooding.

I just dump gas on the driveway and let it evaporate.

"dpb" > wrote in message ...
> On 11/5/2012 5:26 PM, HeyBub wrote:
> ...
>
>> To dispose of left-over petroleum products, you could just dump 'em down
>> the
>> storm sewer. They will lubricate the walls and help prevent flooding.
>
> That's about as bad as dumping them down the sanitary sewer (and the two
> join in some locations)...
>
> Better than that would be to simply dump in a corner of the yard somewhere
> than putting them directly into the water system, small amounts though
> they be...

Larger towns have hazardous waste disposal sites. Not sure what is, is not
covered, but things like acids, herbicides/insecticides are def'ly covered.
And of course most garages take used oil, at least around here.

And old diesel chariot would proly be the best, uh, vehicle for disposal. I
was more thinking along the lines of recovering the *energy value* of this
stuff..... every mickle makes a muckle.... every fickle....
--
EA


>
> --
>

"Existential Angst" > wrote:
> Awl --
>
> I recently became aware that fuel injector cleaner is basically
> kerosene..... !! It's also clear that alcohol is freely mixible in
> gasoline.
> In fact, http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monogr...5/mono45-8.pdf
> indicates a wide variety of stuff in gasoline, including aromatics (like
> benzene). The tables don't seem entirely consistent, but the point is, gas
> is a bit of a heterogeneous mix.
>
> So the Q is: what can one "dump" into one's gastank, and how much, without
> gumming up the works? Including all these catalytic converters. Mebbe it's
> better to dump stuff in, say, the lawnmower??
>
> And what do I mean by "stuff"?
> Unknown mixes of 2-stroke gas, kerosene, paint thinner, small amounts of old
> oil, any combustible really.
> You can put quite a bit of fuel injector cleaner (kerosene) in a gasoline
> car, on the order of a pint to just a few gallons of gas, and the car runs
> fine.
> But I'm not talking about a deluge of stuff, just a cup here, a cup there in
> a full-ish tank?

Fuel cleaner is not what it used to be. I would like trying cleaning a
removed injector. A junk one.

Some say this and that. I used to put lacquer in to clean things. You could
also use toluene. I never really had fuel problems so I don't know if I
needed it. I know lacquer thinner is much more likely to clean an injector.
The stuff you spray into the carburetor, carb cleaner, is not kerosene.

How about WD-40. ? Marvell mystery oil, seafoam ?

Some say use high test Shell, or other high octane mixes.

Greg

Gunner wrote:
>
> Used motor oil can be used to heat ones shop nicely


So can old candles or bulk wax. We used to make stoves out of large
coffee cans, rolled up cardboard & wax. Punch holes arounf d the side,
about two inches above the cardboard & wax, and more right near the
top. Then light it & cook in cast iron on the top.

small quanties of waste oil dumped in the ground are digested by
natural occuring bacteria......

perfectly safe done perodically in gallon quanties and under. I
excavated my dump area after years of using the place for oil change
dumping....

Not a trace of oil remained...

This is a realtive of the bacteria that digeste rubber tire wear along
roads