Coolant Voltage Potential

I just changed my heater core on my 87 chev caprice. not too hard.

but what i saw i a paper with the new core surprised me. it said
that if there was more than .3 volt dc between the coolant
and the negative, my aluminum heater core or rad would
get "eaten" up in no time. they mention "days"!!!

so i checked and i had .2 before the change. i didn't
check after, but i will.

my question: is this true? and is .3 the dividing point
between "heater core will die" and "it will last forever"?
or is lower better and i should work on the ground?
thanks...thehick

frank-in-toronto wrote:
>
> I just changed my heater core on my 87 chev caprice. not too hard.
>
> but what i saw i a paper with the new core surprised me. it said
> that if there was more than .3 volt dc between the coolant
> and the negative, my aluminum heater core or rad would
> get "eaten" up in no time. they mention "days"!!!
>
> so i checked and i had .2 before the change. i didn't
> check after, but i will.
>
> my question: is this true? and is .3 the dividing point
> between "heater core will die" and "it will last forever"?
> or is lower better and i should work on the ground?
> thanks...thehick

There is no dividing point.
Zero would be ideal, however that is impossible (for normal humans).
IMO, you should _always_ replace an aluminum core with a copper core.
A copper core will not corrode. If you check an electromotive series
metals chart you will see why.
Adding lots of corrosion inhibitors will help.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 02:48:27 GMT, "« Paul »" <"
> wrote:

>frank-in-toronto wrote:
>>
>> I just changed my heater core on my 87 chev caprice. not too hard.
>>
>> but what i saw i a paper with the new core surprised me. it said
>> that if there was more than .3 volt dc between the coolant
>> and the negative, my aluminum heater core or rad would
>> get "eaten" up in no time. they mention "days"!!!
>>
>> so i checked and i had .2 before the change. i didn't
>> check after, but i will.
>>
>> my question: is this true? and is .3 the dividing point
>> between "heater core will die" and "it will last forever"?
>> or is lower better and i should work on the ground?
>> thanks...thehick
>
>There is no dividing point.
>Zero would be ideal, however that is impossible (for normal humans).
>IMO, you should _always_ replace an aluminum core with a copper core.
>A copper core will not corrode. If you check an electromotive series
>metals chart you will see why.
>Adding lots of corrosion inhibitors will help.
i'm not really sure it's aluminum and since it's inside now,
i'm not gonna check. but one suggestion i read was to drop some
old copper pennys in the rad. what about just some
good quality copper wire instead? or would this not
be the point? i could try adding a wire also to
improve the grounding of the core. as is clear, i really
don't understand what's happening.
thanks for any further help...thehick

frank-in-toronto wrote:
> =

> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 02:48:27 GMT, "=AB Paul =BB" <"
> > wrote:
> =

> >frank-in-toronto wrote:
> >>
> >> I just changed my heater core on my 87 chev caprice. not too hard.
> >>
> >> but what i saw i a paper with the new core surprised me. it said
> >> that if there was more than .3 volt dc between the coolant
> >> and the negative, my aluminum heater core or rad would
> >> get "eaten" up in no time. they mention "days"!!!
> >>
> >> so i checked and i had .2 before the change. i didn't
> >> check after, but i will.
> >>
> >> my question: is this true? and is .3 the dividing point
> >> between "heater core will die" and "it will last forever"?
> >> or is lower better and i should work on the ground?
> >> thanks...thehick
> >
> >There is no dividing point.
> >Zero would be ideal, however that is impossible (for normal humans).
> >IMO, you should _always_ replace an aluminum core with a copper core.
> >A copper core will not corrode. If you check an electromotive series
> >metals chart you will see why.
> >Adding lots of corrosion inhibitors will help.

> i'm not really sure it's aluminum and since it's inside now,
> i'm not gonna check. but one suggestion i read was to drop some
> old copper pennys in the rad. what about just some
> good quality copper wire instead? or would this not
> be the point? i could try adding a wire also to
> improve the grounding of the core. as is clear, i really
> don't understand what's happening.
> thanks for any further help...thehick

Aluminum is silvery in color and copper is reddish. If your heater
core was silvery, then it was aluminum.
Adding copper to the system will not help. The parts themselves
must be made of copper. Adding a lot of pure Mg _might_ help if you =

can do it so that the Mg does not ever touch the Al directly.
On the other hand, the system will end up with a bunch of MgO sludge.
Adding a grounding wire to the aluminum part should accelerate
the dissolution of the aluminum part and save the iron parts.

The higher minus voltage metals protect the less minus voltage
metals by giving them an electron and then combining with =

negative valence oxygen. You can see why gold does not corrode.

Magnesium -2.34 volts
Aluminum -1.67
Zinc -0.76
Iron -0.44
Lead -0.13
Copper +0.34
Silver +0.80
Gold +1.42

« Paul » wrote:
> IMO, you should _always_ replace an aluminum core with a copper core.

Gotta be careful with that. I called on my '89 Grand Marquis and Ford
makes both an Al and a Cu core... but they're different physical fit
and one can't replace the other.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:25:06 -0400, The Rat > wrote:


>The aluminum and other non-aluminum metals (dissimilar metals) in the
>engine together with the coolant (electrolyte) make a battery. That is
>where the voltage comes from. That is why you want to change the coolant
>at regular, recommended intervals - to keep the corrosion inhibitors up to
>snuff. Minerals in the coolant also add to the problem, another reason to
>avoid typical tap water in the coolant.

and << paul >> wrote:
> Adding a grounding wire to the aluminum part should
>accelerate the dissolution of the aluminum part and
> save the iron parts.

OK. this is very interesting to me. brand new also. i have just
a little bit more questions. if adding a ground wire to the
core will wreck it sooner, why does it use a ground clamp
at the bottom and a screw on ground clamp with
grounding wire at the top?

or am i building this up a little too much? if the antifreeze
is good and i used distilled water (which i didn't), i'd expect
nothing bad to happen any time soon. after all, you don't
hear about everybody's heater core leaking. unless the
car is more than 10 years old.
....thehick

frank-in-toronto wrote:
>
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:25:06 -0400, The Rat > wrote:
>
> >The aluminum and other non-aluminum metals (dissimilar metals) in the
> >engine together with the coolant (electrolyte) make a battery. That is
> >where the voltage comes from. That is why you want to change the coolant
> >at regular, recommended intervals - to keep the corrosion inhibitors up to
> >snuff. Minerals in the coolant also add to the problem, another reason to
> >avoid typical tap water in the coolant.
>
> and << paul >> wrote:
> > Adding a grounding wire to the aluminum part should
> >accelerate the dissolution of the aluminum part and
> > save the iron parts.
>
> OK. this is very interesting to me. brand new also. i have just
> a little bit more questions. if adding a ground wire to the
> core will wreck it sooner, why does it use a ground clamp
> at the bottom and a screw on ground clamp with
> grounding wire at the top?
>
> or am i building this up a little too much? if the antifreeze
> is good and i used distilled water (which i didn't), i'd expect
> nothing bad to happen any time soon. after all, you don't
> hear about everybody's heater core leaking. unless the
> car is more than 10 years old.
> ...thehick

The ground is for elimination of RFI. If you keep the corrosion
inhibitors and antifreeze in good shape it should not matter.
It should last for several years.
Use ONLY genuine distilled water.

lugnut wrote:
>
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:25:06 -0400, The Rat
> > wrote:
>
> >On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:04:17 -0500, frank-in-toronto wrote:
> >
> >>>Adding lots of corrosion inhibitors will help.
> >>
> >> i'm not really sure it's aluminum and since it's inside now, i'm not
> >> gonna check. but one suggestion i read was to drop some old copper
> >> pennys in the rad. what about just some good quality copper wire
> >> instead? or would this not be the point? i could try adding a wire also
> >> to improve the grounding of the core. as is clear, i really don't
> >> understand what's happening.
> >> thanks for any further help...thehick
> >
> >The aluminum and other non-aluminum metals (dissimilar metals) in the
> >engine together with the coolant (electrolyte) make a battery. That is
> >where the voltage comes from. That is why you want to change the coolant
> >at regular, recommended intervals - to keep the corrosion inhibitors up to
> >snuff. Minerals in the coolant also add to the problem, another reason to
> >avoid typical tap water in the coolant.
> >
>
> So that's why I see these huge tanks of distilled water at
> all these repair shops!!!!??? If the grounds are as they
> should be and, you properly maintain tha additives in your
> cooling system, there should be minimal problems. Why the
> hell sould your radiator get better water than what you
> drink?? If a system is a problem even with proper
> treatment, a sacrificial metal can be introduced into the
> coolant to provide a "target". I have seen Diesel systems
> with a piece of magnesium suspended into the expansion tank
> with a piece of mechanics wire. I have seen these systems
> with plates boted to the interior of the heat exchangers.
> There are pipe plugs with the sacrificial material fastened
> to them to facilitate maintenance and replacement. None of
> this should be required in a gasoline automotive system that
> is mainatained in accordance with the manufcaturers
> recommendations. Diesels are a bit more demanding in this
> area.

Yes. If you could somehow suspend enough Mg in the coolant
system and ground it outside of the system to the frame, etc.,
it should work as a sacrificial anode. Sticking a piece of Mg
right on the other metal would only protect the area that is
touching. Mg is THE metal to use for Aluminum but it only lasts
a few years at most. It will turn to MgO and clog the system,
as will passive chemical inhibitors such as X-chromate.
Flush the system periodically!