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  #11  
Old April 7th 14, 02:18 PM posted to rec.autos.driving
Daniel W. Rouse Jr.
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Posts: 671
Default What's best?

"Arif Khokar" > wrote in message
...
> On 04/07/2014 12:24 AM, Daniel W. Rouse Jr. wrote:
>> "Arif Khokar" > wrote in message
>> news
>>> On 04/05/2014 11:27 AM, Harry K wrote:

>
>>>> ??? Traffic in my lane behind the lead for mile after mile at the
>>>> same speed? While not use the CC?

>
>>> Probably because traffic can change speed (since this isn't a limited
>>> access road AFAICT) and you won't react to those speed changes as
>>> readily if you're using cruise control.

>
>> Brake pedal = slow down/disengage cruise control--it's instant.

>
> It's not as fast as letting up on the accelerator and losing a few mph in
> speed even before you move your foot to the brake pedal.
>

Cruise control specifically modulates the accelerator. Brake immediately
disables cruise = acclerator pedal all the way up.

>> Traffic
>> increases speed again, use resume.

>
> Or just depress the accelerator again. Having to move your foot from
> where ever you keep it when using cruise control to press the brake to
> disengage it and then move your hand to find the button or move a slider
> to resume is more effort than letting up on the accelerator and then
> pressing it again to get back up to speed.
>

Okay, fine. Use the accelerator to get up to speed and then use set.

>> Obviously, with multiple traffic
>> changes it will be better not to use cruise, but if there aren't
>> multiple traffic changes, why not use cruise?

>
> IMO, you're better able to adjust to conditions by modulating the pressure
> you apply to the accelerator. For instance, if I see a bunch of brake
> lights of vehicles light up ahead, I instinctively let up on the
> accelerator to ascertain what's actually happening and lose some speed in
> the process. So, instead of going my former speed, I may be going 5 to 10
> mph slower before I actually have to apply the brakes.
>

That's when to brake and disable cruise.

>>> I'm able to maintain a relatively constant speed without the use of
>>> cruise control without any issues.
>>>

>> Yes, it's just as easily done but why not let cruise do the modulation
>> of the accelerator pedal, regardless of how small those modulations may
>> be?

>
> It's just a personal preference of mine. I may use cruise control once
> every several years, if that.
>

With every car--mostly rentals--that have it, I use it.

>>>>> * Ideally, instead of tailgating or falling back, it would be
>>>>> better to pass the slow lead car.

>
>>>> True that. But as long as lead is at no less than the posted it isn't
>>>> worth the frustration of trying to catch a passing opportunity that
>>>> only comes up every few miles and then can't be used due to on-coming
>>>> traffic. On a long trip I'll work at passing, anything an hour or
>>>> less doesn't save enough time to be worth the aggravation.

>
>> Supposedly, the side with the dashed line is also supposed to have a
>> greater viewable distance, but I would also probably not deal with
>> passing.

>
> Depending on the length of the passing zone, you may have to use the
> "slingshot maneuver" where you fall back, and then accelerate and time the
> approach such that your start your pass at the beginning of the up coming
> passing zone and hope that no oncoming traffic appears before you actually
> start your pass.


Not worth it, don't pass.

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  #12  
Old April 7th 14, 04:03 PM posted to rec.autos.driving
harry k
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Posts: 148
Default What's best?

On Monday, April 7, 2014 5:24:54 AM UTC-7, Arif Khokar wrote:
> On 04/07/2014 12:24 AM, Daniel W. Rouse Jr. wrote:
> > "Arif Khokar" > wrote in message
> > news
> >> On 04/05/2014 11:27 AM, Harry K wrote:


> >>> ??? Traffic in my lane behind the lead for mile after mile at the
> >>> same speed? While not use the CC?


> >> Probably because traffic can change speed (since this isn't a limited
> >> access road AFAICT) and you won't react to those speed changes as
> >> readily if you're using cruise control.


If the slight difference (none in my case) in response time is so critical you are following way too close. My CC in both the car and truck is on the steering wheel and I make the needed adjustments using the +/- buttons. And, no, I don't need to look to hit them. Sudden slowdowns of more than a mile or two I come off CC of course.


> > Brake pedal = slow down/disengage cruise control--it's instant.


And if you ony need a mile or two change it is uneccesary, just use the CC buttons

> It's not as fast as letting up on the accelerator and losing a few mph
> in speed even before you move your foot to the brake pedal.


My thumb is faster than moving my foot.

> > Traffic
> > increases speed again, use resume.



> Or just depress the accelerator again. Having to move your foot from
> where ever you keep it when using cruise control to press the brake to
> disengage it and then move your hand to find the button or move a slider
> to resume is more effort than letting up on the accelerator and then
> pressing it again to get back up to speed.


> > Obviously, with multiple traffic
> > changes it will be better not to use cruise, but if there aren't
> > multiple traffic changes, why not use cruise?


> IMO, you're better able to adjust to conditions by modulating the
> pressure you apply to the accelerator. For instance, if I see a bunch
> of brake lights of vehicles light up ahead, I instinctively let up on
> the accelerator to ascertain what's actually happening and lose some
> speed in the process. So, instead of going my former speed, I may be
> going 5 to 10 mph slower before I actually have to apply the brakes.


By the time I have to use the brake my thumb has been on the - button already

> >> I'm able to maintain a relatively constant speed without the use of
> >> cruise control without any issues.


See my post about the annoyance of follwoign someone who doesn't maintain a CONSTANT speed, not a 'relatively constant' speed. I, too, can maintain my set speed withing about 2mph variance but I won't annoy other drivers by doing it.

> > Yes, it's just as easily done but why not let cruise do the modulation
> > of the accelerator pedal, regardless of how small those modulations may be?


> It's just a personal preference of mine. I may use cruise control once
> every several years, if that.


That explains a lot.

> >>>> * Ideally, instead of tailgating or falling back, it would be
> >>>> better to pass the slow lead car.


> >>> True that. But as long as lead is at no less than the posted it isn't
> >>> worth the frustration of trying to catch a passing opportunity that
> >>> only comes up every few miles and then can't be used due to on-coming
> >>> traffic. On a long trip I'll work at passing, anything an hour or
> >>> less doesn't save enough time to be worth the aggravation.


> > Supposedly, the side with the dashed line is also supposed to have a
> > greater viewable distance, but I would also probably not deal with passing.


They do but oncoming traffic cancels that out.

> Depending on the length of the passing zone, you may have to use the
> "slingshot maneuver" where you fall back, and then accelerate and time
> the approach such that your start your pass at the beginning of the up
> coming passing zone and hope that no oncoming traffic appears before you
> actually start your pass.


I do that when I finally get annoyed enough but never where I have to hope no on-coming traffic will appear to interfere. Usually in a case where I see an opportunity to pass but the gap requires a fast, e.g., 20 mph differenced.


Harry K
  #13  
Old April 8th 14, 02:39 AM posted to rec.autos.driving
Ashton Crusher[_2_]
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Posts: 2,874
Default What's best?

On Fri, 4 Apr 2014 11:43:22 -0700 (PDT), Harry K >
wrote:

>Situation - 2lane (1 each direction) heavily traveled highway with passing opportunities sparse due to curves and hills. Posted 60 'flow' about 65.
>
>I set cruise 64/65 and rarely get passed or pass someone. I don't even try to pass unless they are less than the posted. Say I catch up to someone doing about 61 (happened again today) so I slow to that pace. Okay, you are behind me, which do you prefer?
>
>1. that I close up to a 2second distance behind the lead to allow you to, opportunity allowing, pass both of us at once?
>
>2. Drop back far enough that you can pass me and then the lead in separate passes?
>
>Yes, I will pull over if traffic backs up but there is really no point in doing so as they will just stack up behind that lead vehicle.
>
>Harry K



My answer might be different if I knew more about how long each
passing opportunity was but based on what you said and assuming the
passing zones are not real short I'd rather you close ranks with the
first guy so I can pass both of you at once and be done with it IF I
have a car with some passing power. With such a car it's very little
extra time and distance to pass both cars instead of one. If I had a
really underpowered car it might be better if you dropped back so I
can slowly edge around you and get back in.
  #14  
Old April 8th 14, 04:57 AM posted to rec.autos.driving
Arif Khokar
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Posts: 1,804
Default What's best?

On 04/07/2014 09:18 AM, Daniel W. Rouse Jr. wrote:
> "Arif Khokar" > wrote in message
> ...


>>>> Probably because traffic can change speed (since this isn't a limited
>>>> access road AFAICT) and you won't react to those speed changes as
>>>> readily if you're using cruise control.

>>
>>> Brake pedal = slow down/disengage cruise control--it's instant.

>>
>> It's not as fast as letting up on the accelerator and losing a few mph
>> in speed even before you move your foot to the brake pedal.
>>

> Cruise control specifically modulates the accelerator. Brake immediately
> disables cruise = acclerator pedal all the way up.


That doesn't address the fact that your foot, unless it's constantly
hovering over the brake pedal, will touch the brake pedal and disengage
cruise control leading to the same state that I'm in after releasing the
accelerator pedal faster than I can simply just slightly raise my foot.

Think of it as the difference between using a keyboard shortcut to
accomplish some task like copy and paste versus using the mouse to get
to the edit menu and accomplishing the same task. Using the mouse is
giong to be slower since you have to move your hand off the keyboard to
get to the mouse in the first place.

> Okay, fine. Use the accelerator to get up to speed and then use set.


I think you're missing the point of the discussion.

>> IMO, you're better able to adjust to conditions by modulating the
>> pressure you apply to the accelerator. For instance, if I see a bunch
>> of brake lights of vehicles light up ahead, I instinctively let up on
>> the accelerator to ascertain what's actually happening and lose some
>> speed in the process. So, instead of going my former speed, I may be
>> going 5 to 10 mph slower before I actually have to apply the brakes.
>>

> That's when to brake and disable cruise.


And where is your foot that you use to press the brake before you decide
you need to press it?

>> Depending on the length of the passing zone, you may have to use the
>> "slingshot maneuver" where you fall back, and then accelerate and time
>> the approach such that your start your pass at the beginning of the up
>> coming passing zone and hope that no oncoming traffic appears before
>> you actually start your pass.

>
> Not worth it, don't pass.


With a high performance vehicle, it's not that difficult to do.
  #15  
Old April 8th 14, 05:05 AM posted to rec.autos.driving
Arif Khokar
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Posts: 1,804
Default What's best?

On 04/07/2014 11:03 AM, Harry K wrote:
> On Monday, April 7, 2014 5:24:54 AM UTC-7, Arif Khokar wrote:


> If the slight difference (none in my case) in response time is so
> critical you are following way too close.


I'm not entirely sure of how far traffic is ahead of you in your case,
but I certainly wouldn't use it unless there was at least a 30 second
gap ahead of me.

> And if you ony need a mile or two change it is uneccesary, just use
> the CC buttons


Or you could just let up on the accelerator slightly.

>> It's not as fast as letting up on the accelerator and losing a few
>> mph in speed even before you move your foot to the brake pedal.

>
> My thumb is faster than moving my foot.


Is your thumb constantly hovering over the coast button (or whatever
it's called these days)? My foot is constantly on the accelerator pedal
unless I'm using the brakes to slow down.

>> IMO, you're better able to adjust to conditions by modulating the
>> pressure you apply to the accelerator. For instance, if I see a
>> bunch of brake lights of vehicles light up ahead, I instinctively
>> let up on the accelerator to ascertain what's actually happening
>> and lose some speed in the process. So, instead of going my former
>> speed, I may be going 5 to 10 mph slower before I actually have to
>> apply the brakes.

>
> By the time I have to use the brake my thumb has been on the - button
> already


And my foot has been off the accelerator for at least the amount of time
it took me to move my foot from one pedal to the other.

> See my post about the annoyance of follwoign someone who doesn't
> maintain a CONSTANT speed, not a 'relatively constant' speed. I,
> too, can maintain my set speed withing about 2mph variance but I
> won't annoy other drivers by doing it.


My speed doesn't vary that much either when I'm paying attention. If my
attention wanders, then my speed may increase or decrease by some
amount, and then I realize that I need to pay more attention to my speed
and I adjust as necessary. I don't have people following me at a close
distance, so I don't have a problem with slowing others down.

> I do that when I finally get annoyed enough but never where I have to
> hope no on-coming traffic will appear to interfere. Usually in a
> case where I see an opportunity to pass but the gap requires a fast,
> e.g., 20 mph differenced.


Sometimes, that's required. I wouldn't spend any more time than
necessary in the passing lane.
  #16  
Old April 8th 14, 04:39 PM posted to rec.autos.driving
harry k
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Posts: 148
Default What's best?

On Monday, April 7, 2014 9:05:11 PM UTC-7, Arif Khokar wrote:
> On 04/07/2014 11:03 AM, Harry K wrote:
> > On Monday, April 7, 2014 5:24:54 AM UTC-7, Arif Khokar wrote:
> > If the slight difference (none in my case) in response time is so
> > critical you are following way too close.


> I'm not entirely sure of how far traffic is ahead of you in your case,
> but I certainly wouldn't use it unless there was at least a 30 second
> gap ahead of me.


Usually around 10 secs or a bit more.

> > And if you ony need a mile or two change it is uneccesary, just use
> > the CC buttons


> Or you could just let up on the accelerator slightly.


And then press down again to take a guess at the proper following speed. Using CC you adjust up/down at 1 mph increments. Much simpler and faster.

> >> It's not as fast as letting up on the accelerator and losing a few
> >> mph in speed even before you move your foot to the brake pedal.


If all you need is a mile or two change (which is what normally happens), yhou don't need a "fast" change unless you are following too close.

> > My thumb is faster than moving my foot.


> Is your thumb constantly hovering over the coast button (or whatever
> it's called these days)? My foot is constantly on the accelerator pedal
> unless I'm using the brakes to slow down.


The buttons on every car I have driving in a long long time are right there where my hand is on the wheel. It is not "constantly there" but is much faster moving there than my foot is to lift off and then press down hoping to get the speed right.

> >> IMO, you're better able to adjust to conditions by modulating the
> >> pressure you apply to the accelerator. For instance, if I see a
> >> bunch of brake lights of vehicles light up ahead, I instinctively
> >> let up on the accelerator to ascertain what's actually happening
> >> and lose some speed in the process. So, instead of going my former
> >> speed, I may be going 5 to 10 mph slower before I actually have to
> >> apply the brakes.


> > By the time I have to use the brake my thumb has been on the - button
> > already


> And my foot has been off the accelerator for at least the amount of time
> it took me to move my foot from one pedal to the other.


I guess I should have added that my thumb has been HOLDING DOWN THE BUTTON. Thus slowing down just as you do with your foot but I have stated it faster than you did.

> > See my post about the annoyance of follwoign someone who doesn't
> > maintain a CONSTANT speed, not a 'relatively constant' speed. I,
> > too, can maintain my set speed withing about 2mph variance but I
> > won't annoy other drivers by doing it.


> My speed doesn't vary that much either when I'm paying attention. If my
> attention wanders, then my speed may increase or decrease by some
> amount, and then I realize that I need to pay more attention to my speed
> and I adjust as necessary. I don't have people following me at a close
> distance, so I don't have a problem with slowing others down.


Nice to be able to drive always without anyone following you very close. I have never had that pleasure.

Bottom lien appears to be that you have never had the fun of boring thorugh mile after endless miles modulating speed on 2 lant highways. Had you, you would have been praying for technology to maintain a set speed. Were you to get used to using CC as an aid to driving, you would always use when possible.

Even an hour's drive with foot constantly on the accelerator is a PIA.

Bottom line seems to be you just don't want to learn how to use it efficiently.

Harry K

Harry K
 




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