2005 Honda Civic LX gas mileage

"Graham W" > wrote
> Elle wrote:
> > "Graham W" > wrote
> >> Elle wrote:
> >>>> I did say "virtually constant" and you missed a significant factor
> >>>> (for in-tank pumps in the Honda/Rover cars) which is that the fuel
> >>>> is sucked into the pump without being replaced by air from the
> >>>> outside thus reducing the absolute air pressure in the tank. You
> >>>> can verify this by listening for the 'whoosh' of air into the tank
> >>>> when you undo the tank's filler cap.
> >>>
> >>> One should note here that, as long as the tank is not vented to
> >>> atmosphere, then the pressure due to the air above the fuel level in
> >>> fact will be reducing (contrary to the implication above)
> >>
> >> It isn't contrary - that is exactly what I said - "reducing the
> >> absolute pressure in the tank"!
> >
> > You seemed to be implying this reduced the pump work.
>
> But I didn't say that.
>
> > On the
> > contrary, lower pressure on the fuel in the tank increases the pump
> > work necessary to move it to the injectors, etc.
>
> Agreed.
>
> > That junk you posted did nothing more than bolster my original point,
> > but in a manner that muddies the issue.
> >
> >>> as long as
> >>> the fuel level goes down. Thus the pressure at the pump inlet will
> >>> be even lower than if the tank were vented to atmosphere.
> >>
> >> Agreed.
> >>
> >>> With no venting, even more pump work is necessary than with venting.
> >>
> >> Agreed again.
> >>
> >>> It's mere theory, and in this application out in left field, because
> >>> the pump is such a low power device, raising say 1 gallon / hour a
> >>> few psi, well less than 1 hp of motor power, I'd guesstimate with
> >>> some rough calculations.
> >>
> >> Your figures are a bit adrift though. Yes I know they are guesses but
> >> since the pump needs to raise the delivery pressure at the filter so
> >> that the engine's FI is supplied with enough fuel at the most extreme
> >> of power demands and RPM, the volume at a guess is far higher than
> >> 1 gallon / hour.
> >
> > Whatever "at a guess" means.
>
> The same as your guess.
>
> > Of course the flow varies. Why would you suggest otherwise, except to
> > be a jackass?
>
> Ah, but the flow remains essentially constant.

Ah, but I wasn't attempting to do anything more than a back of the envelope
calculation. You're being a jack.

This is fact that you
> have failed to grasp. Any fuel at say 2.5 bar which is not consumed by
> the FI is returned to the tank.
>
> > I don't work with absurd numbers such as 90 mph, but instead numbers
> > for the typical driver in the U.S.
>
> > You're not greeted with seriousness or patience by me, because of that
> > vulgar email you sent.
>
> Show me the headers! In fact show me the email.

Oh get all upset. I don't save such tasteless crap, sent in frustration by
someone who can't defend his position. Others can believe me or not.

> And read more carefully what I have posted - you are trying to twist
> what I say to suit yourself.

You're pathological.

OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg
for each fillup by date.

9/13 - 38.7
9/17 - 36.6
9/23 - 39.3
9/25 - 37.1
10/1 - 34.7
10/5 - 35.5
10/8 - 33.0
10/14 - 35.2
10/18 - 33.3
10/23 - 34.0
10/31 - 32.2
11/07 - 31.5

3,600 total miles

My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The
mpg should be higher.

"cinerama" > wrote
> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg
> for each fillup by date.
>
> 9/13 - 38.7
> 9/17 - 36.6
> 9/23 - 39.3
> 9/25 - 37.1
> 10/1 - 34.7
> 10/5 - 35.5
> 10/8 - 33.0
> 10/14 - 35.2
> 10/18 - 33.3
> 10/23 - 34.0
> 10/31 - 32.2
> 11/07 - 31.5
>
> 3,600 total miles
>
> My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The
> mpg should be higher.

Do you live north or south in the U.S.? Did you check your tire pressure?

cinerama wrote:

> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg
> for each fillup by date.
>
> 9/13 - 38.7
> 9/17 - 36.6
> 9/23 - 39.3
> 9/25 - 37.1
> 10/1 - 34.7
> 10/5 - 35.5
> 10/8 - 33.0
> 10/14 - 35.2
> 10/18 - 33.3
> 10/23 - 34.0
> 10/31 - 32.2
> 11/07 - 31.5
>
> 3,600 total miles
>
> My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The
> mpg should be higher.

This may have been mentioned already, but if the weather has been getting
increasingly cooler where you are, that will decrease your mileage. Also,
once it is broken in (after about 5000 miles), your mileage should improve,
although likely not until next spring if you are in a winter climate.

cinerama wrote:
> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg
> for each fillup by date.
>
> 9/13 - 38.7
> 9/17 - 36.6
> 9/23 - 39.3
> 9/25 - 37.1
> 10/1 - 34.7
> 10/5 - 35.5
> 10/8 - 33.0
> 10/14 - 35.2
> 10/18 - 33.3
> 10/23 - 34.0
> 10/31 - 32.2
> 11/07 - 31.5
>
> 3,600 total miles
>
> My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The
> mpg should be higher.
>
im not seeing a problem, especially if its got an A/T. youre getting an
average 35mpg... what kind of mileage are you expecting? a solid 40mpg,
regardless? on an engine that isnt broken in? in the middle of fall,
going into winter?

take it back to the dealer, and thats what theyre going to tell you.
then when you leave, theyre going to laugh at you.

"High Tech Misfit" > wrote in message
...
> cinerama wrote:
>
>> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg
>> for each fillup by date.
>>
>> 9/13 - 38.7
>> 9/17 - 36.6
>> 9/23 - 39.3
>> 9/25 - 37.1
>> 10/1 - 34.7
>> 10/5 - 35.5
>> 10/8 - 33.0
>> 10/14 - 35.2
>> 10/18 - 33.3
>> 10/23 - 34.0
>> 10/31 - 32.2
>> 11/07 - 31.5
>>
>> 3,600 total miles
>>
>> My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The
>> mpg should be higher.
>
> This may have been mentioned already, but if the weather has been getting
> increasingly cooler where you are, that will decrease your mileage. Also,
> once it is broken in (after about 5000 miles), your mileage should
> improve,
> although likely not until next spring if you are in a winter climate.

I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one
station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off earlier
than others and it can be half gallon to 1 1/2 gallons too soon. I always
go past the first and second automatic cut offs, slowly.


--
Kent Finnell
From the Music City USA

Kent Finnell wrote:
> I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one
> station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off earlier
> than others and it can be half gallon to 1 1/2 gallons too soon. I always
> go past the first and second automatic cut offs, slowly.
>
> --
> Kent Finnell
> From the Music City USA


----------------------------------

Why would you do that? Your new car came with an owner's manual that
says you shouldn't. If you want the best results, you need to follow the
Maker's instructions.

'Curly'

Kent Finnell > wrote:
> I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one
> station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off
> earlier than others and it can be half gallon to 1 1/2 gallons too soon.
> I always go past the first and second automatic cut offs, slowly.


Different pump cutoffs would balance out over time.
If you clicked off a gallon too soon, the mileage would show too high for
that tank, but the next tank, when you replaced that missing gallon, would
be much lower. Those two would average out.

Instead of tracking just the mileage on a tank, track the gallons put in
for each fill. Over a period of time, you can look at the mileage across
multiple fillups, making the automatic cutoff immaterial.

You could put in one gallon, or "five dollars worth" on each visit, and
over time, you could still get an accurate mpg rating.
http://www.rahul.net/dold/clarence/Honda_Mileage.htm

--
---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5

"'Curly Q. Links'" > wrote in message
...
> Kent Finnell wrote:
>> I also wonder about the fill up method. I buy most of my gas at one
>> station, but sometimes I have to use a different pump. Some cut off
>> earlier
>> than others and it can be half gallon to 1 1/2 gallons too soon. I
>> always
>> go past the first and second automatic cut offs, slowly.
>>
>> --
>> Kent Finnell
>> From the Music City USA
>
>
> Why would you do that? Your new car came with an owner's manual that
> says you shouldn't. If you want the best results, you need to follow the
> Maker's instructions.
>
> 'Curly'

First of all, it's NOT a new car, it's not even a Honda. However I've owned
3 Honda, among other cars. I've filled them up all the same way, other wise
you cannot get an accurate mileage calculation.

The Maker's instructions are for maker's benefit, not necessarily for the
consumers. For what it's worth, I never spill a drop.

Tell me, Curly, why did you send me private email to bitch at me? If you
want to lecture me, do it in the group. Then I can respond in a manner that
won't make me look some sort of wild man when I tell you to go teach your
grandma to suck eggs.

I'll be 65 by the end of the month and I don't need lectures from someone
who calls himself "Curly Q. Links" and is probably 1/3rd my age or less.


--
Kent Finnell
From the Music City USA

In article . com>,
says...
> OK. Back to the gas mileage problem I'm having. Here is the list of mpg
> for each fillup by date.
>
> 9/13 - 38.7
> 9/17 - 36.6
> 9/23 - 39.3
> 9/25 - 37.1
> 10/1 - 34.7
> 10/5 - 35.5
> 10/8 - 33.0
> 10/14 - 35.2
> 10/18 - 33.3
> 10/23 - 34.0
> 10/31 - 32.2
> 11/07 - 31.5
>
> 3,600 total miles
>
> My driving is mostly highway, 60 mph, slow starts and stops.etc. The
> mpg should be higher.

I threw your data into Excel.
It works out to an average 35 mpg, 65 miles/day.
Roughly, the greater the number of days between fillups, the worse your
mileage. You don't tell us how many gallons each fillup was, so it's
difficult to infer this, but periods when you go longer between fillups
may indicate less highway driving (and less miles), therefore more
short, low-mileage trips.
Your two lowest mileage days were both Mondays; unless you work
weekends, your weekend driving may be affecting your overall mileage.

--Gene