Switchable live...

[note small crossposting]
Hopefully a quicky question.

'92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.

Dropped the dash cover, checked power at the ignition, you've got a
switchable live on the ignition on the smallish red wire when you put
the key in [1], is that going to be substantial enough to power a modern
stereo or should I be taking a more substantial feed from somewhere
else?

I'd really like it on the key in stage rather than full ignition for
moments like today sat in traffic when you know you aren't going to move
for 20mins, or just having to sit in car can still have the radio on
without engine running, nor a perm live as I recall this radio used to
stay warm with the faceplate off when on a permanent live [2].

Prompt reply would be bloody handy from anyone as the car is still in
bits

TIA

[1] I never could find this bugger in my mk2 Golf for some reason [2]
Currently a Kenwood 6024 MP3 player, likely to get replaced shortly...
(bloody cd drives packed up)
--
Jon B
Above email address IS valid.
<http://www.bramley-computers.co.uk/> Apple Laptop Repairs.

On Tue, 23 May 2006 19:08:03 +0100, (Jon B)
wrote:

>'92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
>is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.

Might sound silly, but are you absolutely sure?

I mean VW's have the permanent and switched live exchanged in the ISO
plug, that's an old porblem with them (so much for ISO). But each one
I saw had them.

Maybe a previous owner had not known that situation and, to get rid of
the unwanted switched one, has cut it off and sealed the blank end?

>
>Dropped the dash cover, checked power at the ignition, you've got a
>switchable live on the ignition on the smallish red wire when you put
>the key in [1], is that going to be substantial enough to power a modern
>stereo or should I be taking a more substantial feed from somewhere
>else?

AFAIK the radios anyway take the power from the permanent live. The
switched live is just that: A sign that you want the radio to operate
:-)

regards

Wolfgang

Wolfgang Pawlinetz > wrote:

> On Tue, 23 May 2006 19:08:03 +0100, (Jon B)
> wrote:
>
> >'92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
> >is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.
>
> Might sound silly, but are you absolutely sure?
>
> I mean VW's have the permanent and switched live exchanged in the ISO
> plug, that's an old porblem with them (so much for ISO). But each one
> I saw had them.
>
> Maybe a previous owner had not known that situation and, to get rid of
> the unwanted switched one, has cut it off and sealed the blank end?
>
Positive, there is only one power wire, the second isn't there at all.
The previous (and only owner) has never fitted a radio before.
--
Jon B
Above email address IS valid.
<http://www.bramley-computers.co.uk/> Apple Laptop Repairs.

On Tue, 23 May 2006 21:11:28 +0100, (Jon B)
wrote:

>Wolfgang Pawlinetz > wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 23 May 2006 19:08:03 +0100, (Jon B)
>> wrote:
>>
>> >'92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
>> >is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.
>>
>> Might sound silly, but are you absolutely sure?
>>
>> I mean VW's have the permanent and switched live exchanged in the ISO
>> plug, that's an old porblem with them (so much for ISO). But each one
>> I saw had them.
>>
>> Maybe a previous owner had not known that situation and, to get rid of
>> the unwanted switched one, has cut it off and sealed the blank end?
>>
>Positive, there is only one power wire, the second isn't there at all.
>The previous (and only owner) has never fitted a radio before.

Then I may make a suggestion as you have aleady the car in pieces :-)

You've found a switched wire, so you might as well slap a relay (radio
shack?) behind the radio, route a cable from the permanent live to the
relay IN, route a cable from the switched live from the ignition to
the relay SWITCH and route a cable from the relay OUT to the proper
ISO connector position. Place a fuse in the feed from the permanent
live and you're done.

Crude, but it should work just fine. The relay will seperate the
circuits, and using the permanent live as the power source and using
the switched life from ignition just to switch the relay will make
sure you'r not overloading the switched live.

JM2C (make sure the fuse is dimensioned adequately)

Wolfgang

On Tue, 23 May 2006 22:29:35 +0200, Wolfgang Pawlinetz
> wrote:

>You've found a switched wire, so you might as well slap a relay (radio
>shack?) behind the radio, route a cable from the permanent live to the
>relay IN, route a cable from the switched live from the ignition to
>the relay SWITCH and route a cable from the relay OUT to the proper
>ISO connector position. Place a fuse in the feed from the permanent
>live and you're done.

I forgot, somewhere there there must be 'ground' :-)

Wolfgang

Wolfgang Pawlinetz > wrote:

> On Tue, 23 May 2006 21:11:28 +0100, (Jon B)
> wrote:
>
> >Wolfgang Pawlinetz > wrote:
> >
> >> On Tue, 23 May 2006 19:08:03 +0100, (Jon B)
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> >'92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
> >> >is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.
> >>
> >> Might sound silly, but are you absolutely sure?
> >>
> >> I mean VW's have the permanent and switched live exchanged in the ISO
> >> plug, that's an old porblem with them (so much for ISO). But each one
> >> I saw had them.
> >>
> >> Maybe a previous owner had not known that situation and, to get rid of
> >> the unwanted switched one, has cut it off and sealed the blank end?
> >>
> >Positive, there is only one power wire, the second isn't there at all.
> >The previous (and only owner) has never fitted a radio before.
>
> Then I may make a suggestion as you have aleady the car in pieces :-)
>
> You've found a switched wire, so you might as well slap a relay (radio
> shack?) behind the radio, route a cable from the permanent live to the
> relay IN, route a cable from the switched live from the ignition to
> the relay SWITCH and route a cable from the relay OUT to the proper
> ISO connector position. Place a fuse in the feed from the permanent
> live and you're done.
>
Cheers, quick update, your comments about the ISO switch did spur
something in my mind. I had perm live at the usual switched live
position, and nothing where the perm live should be (factory).

I've cut the wires on the Kenwood side (I'm not cutting the factory
wires) so that the perm lives goes to the required perm live, found a
suitable switched wire I'm happy with, thought I've got to have full
ignition on, put that to the correct place. All is good.

Ta for the input, I'm normally happy with wiring but, normally I'm also
used to at least dealing with one thats been screwed with a bit, so you
don't mind screwing it up a bit along the way, but this car hasn't, and
I'm trying my damndest to at least keeping it looking that way [1],
sometimes you just need a bit of secondary input.

[1] So any other changes are reversable too
--
Jon B
Above email address IS valid.
<http://www.bramley-computers.co.uk/> Apple Laptop Repairs.

Jon B wrote:

> ... All is good.

Glad you could solve that one :-)

Regards

Wolfgang

Wolfgang Pawlinetz wrote:
> On Tue, 23 May 2006 19:08:03 +0100, (Jon B)
> wrote:
>
>
>>'92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
>>is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.
>
>
> Might sound silly, but are you absolutely sure?
>
> I mean VW's have the permanent and switched live exchanged in the ISO
> plug, that's an old porblem with them (so much for ISO). But each one
> I saw had them.
>
> Maybe a previous owner had not known that situation and, to get rid of
> the unwanted switched one, has cut it off and sealed the blank end?
>
>
[snip]
>
> AFAIK the radios anyway take the power from the permanent live. The
> switched live is just that: A sign that you want the radio to operate
> :-)
>
> regards
>
> Wolfgang
>
Some didn't have a switched live at all. My MK2 Golf didn't. Wolfgang is
right about the switched and permanent being swapped in the connector
though, if the switched is present. Some newer radios have swappable
wires in the harness to cater for this.

Chris Bartram > wrote:

> >
> Some didn't have a switched live at all. My MK2 Golf didn't. Wolfgang is
> right about the switched and permanent being swapped in the connector
> though, if the switched is present. Some newer radios have swappable
> wires in the harness to cater for this.

That will explain why I couldn't find switchable in my mk2 golf then

The permanent live was in the wrong place but switched was still
missing, no wire to the ISO connector at all. But as covered in the rest
of thread, found something I was happy with (though not key in ignition
stage) and connected up to it.

There were no funny smells or smoke this morning on the way to work so
so far, so good. Tomorrow the cam belts... [1]

[1] Parts 'should' be at the dealers now, booked into garage for that
one.
--
Jon B
Above email address IS valid.
<http://www.bramley-computers.co.uk/> Apple Laptop Repairs.

"Jon B" > wrote in message
news:1hft0m6.1afom17s3vglkN%black.hole@jonbradbury .com...
> [note small crossposting]
> Hopefully a quicky question.
>
> '92 Audi 80 (B4 Chassis) trying to wire in the cars first radio, there
> is ISO plugs behind the blanking plate but no switchable live to them.
>
> Dropped the dash cover, checked power at the ignition, you've got a
> switchable live on the ignition on the smallish red wire when you put
> the key in [1], is that going to be substantial enough to power a modern
> stereo or should I be taking a more substantial feed from somewhere
> else?
>
> I'd really like it on the key in stage rather than full ignition for
> moments like today sat in traffic when you know you aren't going to move
> for 20mins, or just having to sit in car can still have the radio on
> without engine running, nor a perm live as I recall this radio used to
> stay warm with the faceplate off when on a permanent live [2].
>
> Prompt reply would be bloody handy from anyone as the car is still in
> bits
>
> TIA
>
> [1] I never could find this bugger in my mk2 Golf for some reason [2]
> Currently a Kenwood 6024 MP3 player, likely to get replaced shortly...
> (bloody cd drives packed up)

Similar problem on MK2 Golfs which don't come with an ignition live feed.
One bodge is to run it from the heater fan switch as that is on a switched
live (if the stereo runs off the switched live, don't do ****e wiring. OTOH
if it's just used as a signal, you should survive). You'll be able to get an
ignition live from the fusebox if you want to do it right, but I don't know
Audi electrics so I can't tell you where. You may want to find a later type
ignition switch from a post CE2 (ie, any post 90 VW with the hazard light
switch on the column) which switches the live feed as soon as you put the
key in. This saves you from feeding the coil electricity when you want the
radio on and engine off.

OTOH, you could just wire switched live up to constant live.