Oil bath cleaners on kadrons

Hi Guys,

I am working on getting early bug aircleaners adapted to dual
kadrons. There is somewhat big mismatch of the ID on filter and
kadron throat. 2" id filter and 2.6" OD on the kadrons. From what I
can see I will have to cut the bottom neck of the airfilter where
clamp is welded and weld on some plate that will attach to adapter on
the carburetor. Nothing super complicated...

One thing that's been bothering me is the differences between the
venturi in the cleaner and size of the throat. Does anybody think
this can create some problems besides the challenge of getting the to
mated together?

Thanks,
Anton

On Mar 7, 10:19 am, anton > wrote:
> Hi Guys,
>
> I am working on getting early bug aircleaners adapted to dual
> kadrons. There is somewhat big mismatch of the ID on filter and
> kadron throat. 2" id filter and 2.6" OD on the kadrons. From what I
> can see I will have to cut the bottom neck of the airfilter where
> clamp is welded and weld on some plate that will attach to adapter on
> the carburetor. Nothing super complicated...
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Anton,

Before cutting anything I suggest you consider an adapter.

If you have a small lathe the quick solution is to turn a pair of
adapters from aluminum. You may also use commercially available
exhaust pipe reducers... or even sections of PVC pipe, if you provide
a couple of stays to stabilize the mass of the air cleaner. (You can
install a riv-nut into the side of the air cleaner canister. Just be
sure to do so above the level of the oil.)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> One thing that's been bothering me is the differences between the
> venturi in the cleaner and size of the throat. Does anybody think
> this can create some problems besides the challenge of getting the to
> mated together?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've never found this to be a problem. First off, even a 2332 isn't
sucking as much air as you may think. Volumetric Efficiency falls as
rpm increases, so that your CFM under full-throttle is seldom more
than 60% of the 'on-paper' flow-rate. Secondly, the typical oil-bath
air cleaner is designed to flow significantly more air than the engine
requires under full-throttle. This excess capacity is to accommodate
the fact the flow-rate declines as the labyrinth portion of the filter
accumulates crud. Finally, the air cleaner is only feeding two
cylinders rather than four.

You're on the right track. There are a number of solutions to the
problem. Keep experimenting until you find one that matches your
tools & skills.

-Bob Hoover

Bob,

Thank you for reassurance on the flow.

About the mounting part. At first a tubular sort of adapter is
exactly what i was thinking of. Later after trying to source some
exhaust pipe that would fit over the carb, I've realized that it would
take quite a bit of different sizes of pipe to narrow it down. Intake
portion of airfilter was already planned for relocation due to
interference with firewall, deck lid and a shroud. After measuring
"stock" kad filters the K&N type of style it appears that early oil
bath cleaners just a tad taller, however top portion is dome so it
might still be ok. Now the way stock filter mounts is via stud which
is welded to a bridge across the top of the carb throat. I can get
these aircleaners off by taking the top plate then the filter then the
bottom. This isn't exactly an option with the oil baths. they can be
tilted a bit but have to come off in one piece. So in order to keep
em short and removable they will need to be modified. at the bottom.
Not exactly best option, but given how the intake portion will have to
be relocated it doesn't bother having few cleaners cut up a bit.
Besides finding a few cheap oil bath cleaners is not too much of a
problem.

Hopefully I will get cracking on this soon and I will take pictures
and post them here.

Thanks again,
Anton





On Mar 7, 1:22 pm, Veeduber > wrote:
> On Mar 7, 10:19 am, anton > wrote:
>
> > Hi Guys,
>
> > I am working on getting early bug aircleaners adapted to dual
> > kadrons. There is somewhat big mismatch of the ID on filter and
> > kadron throat. 2" id filter and 2.6" OD on the kadrons. From what I
> > can see I will have to cut the bottom neck of the airfilter where
> > clamp is welded and weld on some plate that will attach to adapter on
> > the carburetor. Nothing super complicated...
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Dear Anton,
>
> Before cutting anything I suggest you consider an adapter.
>
> If you have a small lathe the quick solution is to turn a pair of
> adapters from aluminum. You may also use commercially available
> exhaust pipe reducers... or even sections of PVC pipe, if you provide
> a couple of stays to stabilize the mass of the air cleaner. (You can
> install a riv-nut into the side of the air cleaner canister. Just be
> sure to do so above the level of the oil.)
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > One thing that's been bothering me is the differences between the
> > venturi in the cleaner and size of the throat. Does anybody think
> > this can create some problems besides the challenge of getting the to
> > mated together?
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I've never found this to be a problem. First off, even a 2332 isn't
> sucking as much air as you may think. Volumetric Efficiency falls as
> rpm increases, so that your CFM under full-throttle is seldom more
> than 60% of the 'on-paper' flow-rate. Secondly, the typical oil-bath
> air cleaner is designed to flow significantly more air than the engine
> requires under full-throttle. This excess capacity is to accommodate
> the fact the flow-rate declines as the labyrinth portion of the filter
> accumulates crud. Finally, the air cleaner is only feeding two
> cylinders rather than four.
>
> You're on the right track. There are a number of solutions to the
> problem. Keep experimenting until you find one that matches your
> tools & skills.
>
> -Bob Hoover

On Mar 7, 7:47 pm, anton > wrote:
> Bob,

> About the mounting part. At first a tubular sort of adapter is
> exactly what i was thinking of. Later after trying to source some
> exhaust pipe that would fit over the carb, I've realized that it would
> take quite a bit of different sizes of pipe to narrow it down.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Exhaust pipe adapters come in a wide range of sizes, allowing a
replacement muffler or resonator to mate with the existing exhaust/
tail-pipe. You should be able to find a single adapter that will do
the job.

The air cleaner does not have to be placed symmetrically over the
carb. Indeed, it does not have to be mount ON the carburetor at all.
So long as the pipe or tubing between them does not include a lot of
sharp corners, you may locate the air cleaner almost anywhere.

Finally, a labyrinth filter made of treated paper (ie, the sort of
thing used on all modern cars), is about 99% as effective as an oil-
bath air cleaner FOR THE FIRST 20 HOURS, after which it's efficiency
begins to fall. If you use a LARGE treated-paper filter, such as for
a V8 engine, on a 2180 the 99% rating will remain valid for as much as
100 hours (this assumes the vehicle is only used on-pavement). If you
take your Kadron filter down to the auto parts store and simply
compare it against the filters that are available, you will find a
treated paper filter that is a close match as to size. You must still
fabricate a base and lid but that is a relatively trivial chore,
compared to fabricating a mounting for two oil bath cleaners. I
mention this is as a practical alternative.

A big advantage to treated paper filters is that they may be installed
in any attitude, connected to the carb(s) with ducts.

-Bob Hoover