Okay gearheads, need some advice. (again) lol

I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).

It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe, exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.

Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog, but just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a Mustang.

So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first mistake. (Grin.)

I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the other, and I'd like your thoughts.

First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want, the Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live. What kind of hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly, would I have to change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb. This will just add to the cost, but I'm not sure how much.

When I asked an SVT tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that." Okay, so minus the prick (which also scares the crap out of me) how many hours on the 6 and 9 do you think it would take? Also, thought about this after, if I had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?

The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing "c" springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be some money left over for some pulleys.

Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other would be more complete. But I can't do both. I do love to corner the car hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a blast. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.

Help me out guys. Summer is running out.

Thanks!

Brad

BradandBrooks wrote:
> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).

High elevation means your best deal is to go with a blower. Simple
bolt-ons won't make up for the loss of nearly 20% of your horsepower
you're losing at that altitude. Trust me, I lived/raced in Albuquerque
(5,300 feet) for 8 years.

Patrick
'93 Cobra


> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe, exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>
> Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog, but just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a Mustang.
>
> So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first mistake. (Grin.)
>
> I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the other, and I'd like your thoughts.
>
> First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want, the Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live. What kind of hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly, would I have to change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb. This will just add to the cost, but I'm not sure how much.
>
> When I asked an SVT tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that." Okay, so minus the prick (which also scares the crap out of me) how many hours on the 6 and 9 do you think it would take? Also, thought about this after, if I had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?
>
> The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing "c" springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be some money left over for some pulleys.
>
> Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other would be more complete. But I can't do both. I do love to corner the car hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a blast. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.
>
> Help me out guys. Summer is running out.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Brad
>
>
>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C6A60F.F2D148C0
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> <HTML><HEAD>
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> <DIV>I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
> exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the
> Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog, but
> just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a Mustang.</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first
> mistake. (Grin.)</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the
> other, and I'd like your thoughts.</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want, the
> Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live.&nbsp; What kind of
> hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly, would I have to
> change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb. This will just add to the
> cost, but I'm not sure how much. </DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>When I asked an SVT&nbsp;tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't
> done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that."&nbsp; Okay, so minus the
> prick (which also&nbsp;scares the crap&nbsp;out of me)&nbsp;how many hours on
> the 6 and 9 do you think it would take?&nbsp; Also, thought about this after, if
> I had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing "c"
> springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be some money
> left over for some pulleys.</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other
> would be more complete.&nbsp; But I can't do both. I do love to corner the car
> hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a
> blast.&nbsp; But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the
> cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>Help me out guys. Summer is running out.&nbsp; </DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>Thanks!</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>Brad</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C6A60F.F2D148C0--

I am not a big fan of the centrifugal blowers because they need to be
spun to 5,000 rpm to get any decent power from them. I like the twin
screw blows because they are more efficient and will increase horsepower
and torque from idle to redline. I have a Kenne Bell
Blowzilla/Flowzilla setup on my '89 LX and last time I had it on a dyno
it made 460 ft-lbs of torque at the rear wheels at 2,300 rpm. Take my
word for it, an engine with a high flat torque curve is a blast to
drive. Here's a link you should check out before making a final decision:

http://www.kennebell.net/supercharge...-flowzilla.htm


BradandBrooks wrote:
> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
>
> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
> exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>
> Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the
> Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog,
> but just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a Mustang.
>
> So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first
> mistake. (Grin.)
>
> I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the
> other, and I'd like your thoughts.
>
> First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want,
> the Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live. What
> kind of hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly,
> would I have to change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb.
> This will just add to the cost, but I'm not sure how much.
>
> When I asked an SVT tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't
> done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that." Okay, so minus
> the prick (which also scares the crap out of me) how many hours on the 6
> and 9 do you think it would take? Also, thought about this after, if I
> had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?
>
> The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing
> "c" springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be
> some money left over for some pulleys.
>
> Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other
> would be more complete. But I can't do both. I do love to corner the
> car hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a
> blast. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the
> cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.
>
> Help me out guys. Summer is running out.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Brad
>
>
>
>

BradandBrooks wrote:
> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
>
> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
> exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.

Blower, no question. We lose almost 20% of our power just from the altitude.
Worse in hot weather. If the blower is tuned correctly, you'll gain that power back
and then the power that sea level cars gain. Blower is the best bang for the buck.
Go with the 9#. At this altitude, it will be closer to a 6# than 9# power levels.
--
..boB
Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red.
1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver
1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z
2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92
1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver
1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast.

Okay guys... 3/3 say blower. One says Flowzilla. But, it's $1000 more. I just can't do that.

But I can do a 9lb Ford.

I'm going to go back to SVT and have a talk with a real tech about that 9lb'er.

Thanks guys!

Brad

".boB" > wrote in message . com...
BradandBrooks wrote:
> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
>
> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
> exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.

Blower, no question. We lose almost 20% of our power just from the altitude.
Worse in hot weather. If the blower is tuned correctly, you'll gain that power back
and then the power that sea level cars gain. Blower is the best bang for the buck.
Go with the 9#. At this altitude, it will be closer to a 6# than 9# power levels.
--
.boB
Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red.
1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver
1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z
2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92
1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver
1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast.

No matter what blower you choose be sure and get a custom tune (i.e.
"chip") based on dyno runs with air-fuel ratio reading taken. This is
necessary to keep you from running lean which can destroy your engine in
the blink of an eye. This is especially important if you are going to
run 9 psi. The more boost you run the hotter the intake air and the
easier for detonation to occur.

Also, I always say if you can't afford to rebuild your engine then you
have no business installing a blower. It takes a lot of money to make
horsepower RELIABLY. At 9 psi you should install larger injectors and
fuel pump along with the custom tuned chip.

BradandBrooks wrote:
> Okay guys... 3/3 say blower. One says Flowzilla. But, it's $1000 more.
> I just can't do that.
>
> But I can do a 9lb Ford.
>
> I'm going to go back to SVT and have a talk with a real tech about that
> 9lb'er.
>
> Thanks guys!
>
> Brad
>
>
> ".boB"
> >> wrote in message
> . com...
> BradandBrooks wrote:
> > I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
> >
> > It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
> > exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>
> Blower, no question. We lose almost 20% of our power just from
> the altitude.
> Worse in hot weather. If the blower is tuned correctly, you'll gain
> that power back
> and then the power that sea level cars gain. Blower is the best
> bang for the buck.
> Go with the 9#. At this altitude, it will be closer to a 6#
> than 9# power levels.
> --
> .boB
> Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red.
> 1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver
> 1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z
> 2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92
> 1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver
> 1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast.

Thx.

Well, I can afford a rebuild, truthfully, I just don't want to. lol.

I never got to SVT today. Monday for sure. I'll bring up these points. THX!

Brad

"Michael Johnson, PE" > wrote in message . ..
No matter what blower you choose be sure and get a custom tune (i.e.
"chip") based on dyno runs with air-fuel ratio reading taken. This is
necessary to keep you from running lean which can destroy your engine in
the blink of an eye. This is especially important if you are going to
run 9 psi. The more boost you run the hotter the intake air and the
easier for detonation to occur.

Also, I always say if you can't afford to rebuild your engine then you
have no business installing a blower. It takes a lot of money to make
horsepower RELIABLY. At 9 psi you should install larger injectors and
fuel pump along with the custom tuned chip.

BradandBrooks wrote:
> Okay guys... 3/3 say blower. One says Flowzilla. But, it's $1000 more.
> I just can't do that.
>
> But I can do a 9lb Ford.
>
> I'm going to go back to SVT and have a talk with a real tech about that
> 9lb'er.
>
> Thanks guys!
>
> Brad
>
>
> ".boB"
> >> wrote in message
> . com...
> BradandBrooks wrote:
> > I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
> >
> > It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
> > exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>
> Blower, no question. We lose almost 20% of our power just from
> the altitude.
> Worse in hot weather. If the blower is tuned correctly, you'll gain
> that power back
> and then the power that sea level cars gain. Blower is the best
> bang for the buck.
> Go with the 9#. At this altitude, it will be closer to a 6#
> than 9# power levels.
> --
> .boB
> Arrived: 2006 FXDI, Red.
> 1997 HD FXDWG - Turbocharged Stolen 11/26/05 in Denver
> 1HD1GEL10VY3200010 CO License J5822Z
> 2001 Dodge Dakota QC 5.9/4x4/3.92
> 1966 Mustang Coupe - Daily Driver
> 1965 FFR Cobra - 427W EFI, Damn Fast.

JohnV@nn wrote:
> BradandBrooks wrote:
>> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
>>
>> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe, exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>>
>> Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog, but just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a Mustang.
>>
>> So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first mistake. (Grin.)
>>
>> I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the other, and I'd like your thoughts.
>>
>> First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want, the Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live. What kind of hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly, would I have to change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb. This will just add to the cost, but I'm not sure how much.
>>
>> When I asked an SVT tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that." Okay, so minus the prick (which also scares the crap out of me) how many hours on the 6 and 9 do you think it would take? Also, thought about this after, if I had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?
>>
>> The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing "c" springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be some money left over for some pulleys.
>>
>> Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other would be more complete. But I can't do both. I do love to corner the car hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a blast. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.
>>
>> Help me out guys. Summer is running out.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Brad
>
> What point in the power band do you want the power? Would you want to
> feel full boost at, say, 2000 rpm or would you want the boost to roll
> on gradually and peak out at about 5000 - 5500? If you answered 2000
> rpm then you want a twin screw-type blower like the Kenne Bell.
> Granted it is quite a bit more money but you know what they say.
>
> BTW the centrifugal blower that Ford sells is a rebadged Powerdyne
> part; I just did a quick search and found the Powerdyne 9psi unit for
> $1599 and the FRPP-badged version at $2074 (same retailer).

One thing I forgot to add was that the Powerdyne (aka Ford Motorsport
brand) units use a belt to drive the impeller which has a tendency to
break quite often. Especially on the 9 psi units since they spin
faster. It costs about $500 a pop to rebuild them so they may not be as
economical as they appear.

Also, you are right about power delivery. I personally don't want to
spin the engine to 5,000+ rpm every time I want to get some horsepower.
In third gear I can accelerate like I was shot out of a canon from
2,500 rpm to redline. With a centrifugal, in third gear, I would have
to be running near 90 mph to be in the power band or be down shifting
like a lunatic to keep the boost up. for awhile I had my Kenne Bell
blower pullied for 16 psi and right of idle I had all 16 psi available
at the slightest blip on the throttle. High rpm horsepower is OK but
big torque is what makes driving REALLY fun, IMHO.

"JohnV@nn" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> BradandBrooks wrote:
>> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
>>
>> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe,
>> exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>>
>> Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the
>> Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog,
>> but just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a
>> Mustang.
>>
>> So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first
>> mistake. (Grin.)
>>
>> I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the
>> other, and I'd like your thoughts.
>>
>> First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want,
>> the Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live. What
>> kind of hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly,
>> would I have to change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb.
>> This will just add to the cost, but I'm not sure how much.
>>
>> When I asked an SVT tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't
>> done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that." Okay, so minus
>> the prick (which also scares the crap out of me) how many hours on the 6
>> and 9 do you think it would take? Also, thought about this after, if I
>> had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?
>>
>> The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing
>> "c" springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be
>> some money left over for some pulleys.
>>
>> Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other
>> would be more complete. But I can't do both. I do love to corner the car
>> hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a
>> blast. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the
>> cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.
>>
>> Help me out guys. Summer is running out.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Brad
>
> What point in the power band do you want the power? Would you want to
> feel full boost at, say, 2000 rpm or would you want the boost to roll
> on gradually and peak out at about 5000 - 5500? If you answered 2000
> rpm then you want a twin screw-type blower like the Kenne Bell.
> Granted it is quite a bit more money but you know what they say.
>
> BTW the centrifugal blower that Ford sells is a rebadged Powerdyne
> part; I just did a quick search and found the Powerdyne 9psi unit for
> $1599 and the FRPP-badged version at $2074 (same retailer).
>
> John

Yes they are Powerdynes. I purchased the 6lb kit as a small boost for my car
so I don't harm my engine and no oil line taps and its quieter then most.
You can find them around the $1500 price check Ebay. They also come with a
FMU which saves you a few hundred bucks. If you go for a larger pulley you
need a by pass valve and a larger in tank fuel pump. Ask them which head
unit you are getting with the kit. The BD11-a is the newer model so make
sure that is what you are getting. The next step up is a the XB-1A which can
handle upto 18psi and are fine at low levels but cost allot more. IMO I say
go for the Ford Powerdyne if money is an issue. Its a great entry way into
the world of s/c the belts are rated for 50k miles and you can have it
rebuilt down the road for just over $300-500 with kevlar belts and other
improvements.

As far as centrifugal vs roots blowers also keep in mind the centrifugal
(ex: Powerdyne, Procharger) will be cooler and allow a denser air flow then
the roots (ex: Whipple, Kenne Bell). Henceforth you can have the two types
of blowers producing 6psi but the centrifugal will give more power cause of
the denser air flow. Just some more food for thought.

Nick

"JohnV@nn" > wrote in message ups.com...
BradandBrooks wrote:
> I have a 93 GT with pretty low mileage (about 40,000 miles).
>
> It's totally stock with a 5-spd and 2.73s. Oh, I do have an X-pipe, exhaust, subs, and timing bump. All the usual little things.
>
> Today, it got pretty warm here (and being way up in the foothills of the Rockies where the air is thin), the car was a real dog. Well, not a dog, but just not what you expect when you see the 5.0 on the side of a Mustang.
>
> So, I was driving by an SVT dealer and stopped in. That was my first mistake. (Grin.)
>
> I've decided to do one of two things. I only have money for one or the other, and I'd like your thoughts.
>
> First scenerio is get a 9lb supercharger from Ford. That's what I want, the Ford model, and there are no emissions testing where I live. What kind of hp and tq increases would a 9lb give me? And, more importantly, would I have to change the fuel pump and head gaskets, unlike the 6lb. This will just add to the cost, but I'm not sure how much.
>
> When I asked an SVT tech how many hours to do this he said, "I haven't done a 5.0 in years... why would you want to do that." Okay, so minus the prick (which also scares the crap out of me) how many hours on the 6 and 9 do you think it would take? Also, thought about this after, if I had a speed shop install it, would that void warranty? Anyone know?
>
> The other option is to go with some 3.73s out back and some Ford Racing "c" springs and long tubes (again, no emissions). Maybe there would be some money left over for some pulleys.
>
> Both routes would be good, one car would be more powerful, but the other would be more complete. But I can't do both. I do love to corner the car hard (got some really sticky and wide Yokohamas on her) and that's a blast. But I'm wondering if I shouldn't just do the SC while I have the cash, and add other things later. But option #2 is pretty enticing too.
>
> Help me out guys. Summer is running out.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Brad

What point in the power band do you want the power? Would you want to
feel full boost at, say, 2000 rpm or would you want the boost to roll
on gradually and peak out at about 5000 - 5500? If you answered 2000
rpm then you want a twin screw-type blower like the Kenne Bell.
Granted it is quite a bit more money but you know what they say.

BTW the centrifugal blower that Ford sells is a rebadged Powerdyne
part; I just did a quick search and found the Powerdyne 9psi unit for
$1599 and the FRPP-badged version at $2074 (same retailer).

John


John,

Is that really true? And you can get one for $1600? I can get the FRPP for $2000. That;s the cost of a new fuel pump and the gasket. Hmmmm... very interesting.

I would like the low end power, but really, don't you guys find that the 5.0 has enough power from idle to 3,500 rpm? I find it lacks after that. Plus then, does traction become an issue?

I'm starting to get confused here. But that's a good thing - means I'm learning something.

Thanks!

Brad